[kuma]

Quote:

Originally posted by ServinginEcuador I'm actually amazed at the sheer number of category #3 people there are out there. They have an opinion based on a vacuum of real knowledge, yet still make fun of those who actually try them and are so "deluded " into thinking they actually work. What a crack-up.

The thing is I would be #3 people if I didn't try em either.

I try these tweeks every now and then to dare they won't work. I mean.. c'mon this sounds too stupid! CD denagnetiser? painting ridges of CD with green/black pen? I used to laugh at those anal types. hehehe.

One thing I have learned, tho, the changes are not always for better with these various tweeks. They sure change something, but it might make things worse.

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally posted by Howie I would like to get my hands on one. You're suppose to demagnitize after every 2-3 play or something.

Haven't tried with headphones. but for speaker listening, it's effective long enough to play a CD. Auric Illuminator lasts longer.

 

[Hirsch]

Quote:

Originally posted by ServinginEcuador (Aimed at no one in specific) There are three categories of people when it comes to tweaks: 1. Those who've tried them and believe in them. 2. Those who've read a web site ad and will never try them. 3. Those who read a web site ad and make fun of those who are in category #1.

Let's not forget an important category:

4. Those who've tried them and still believe that they do nothing.

Comments from those in categories 1 and 4 are the ones that add the most information, IMO. I tend to not get a lot out of theoretical arguments most of the time, as theory and reality are often at odds with each other.

 

[Sovkiller]

Another important one:

5. Who've tried the tweak in question and is absolutelly sure that in fact it does nothing to the sound at all, and all of the stated "improvements" are just as result of a marketing strategy to sell a product (or a device).....or others placebo effect.

This one is very similar to the one mentioned by Hirsch but this one leaves no doubt at all at least to the evaluator, but of course this is a very controversial category, as nobody can prove that a thing doesn't work, if you insist that it does, and stated it IYO or to your ears, as nobody has your ears, nor your exact same opinion, but anyway.....

note: nothing personal against tweaks, IMHE some of them really work, and are great, but most of them, are in fact placebo effect, and some people have proved them as such (IIRC there is a funny A/B test around on speaker cables, in which the cables were in fact never switched, and a lot of audiophiles in fact noticed and wrote about the differences between them)....but as I stated before sometimes some of them really work.....

....

 

[Tomcat]

Yet another category:

6. Those who have tried a tweak and believe it sounds worse than without it.

As I have said, to me, anything that involves wiping the CD seems to fall into that category. Or the green "SID - Sound Improvement Disc" that is supposed to reduce stray laser light. To my ears, it reduces the dynamic range, gives transients and etched quality and reduces bass extension and slam, while providing an artificially distanced soundstage. To me, the SID sounds fatiguing. It doesn't make the music "analog", it dulls it.

 

[tanfenton]

Quote:

Originally posted by ServinginEcuador (Aimed at no one in specific) There are three categories of people when it comes to tweaks: 1. Those who've tried them and believe in them. 2. Those who've read a web site ad and will never try them. 3. Those who read a web site ad and make fun of those who are in category #1.

4. Those who've tried them and don't believe in them.

[Didn't see Hirsch's post.]

NGF

 

[braillediver]

How about those that think it technically makes no sense?

Demagnetizing a plastic, non-inductive disk? Try picking up a CD with a magnet?

Expensive power cords when the power then goes through an automotive fuse?


Mitch

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally posted by Tomcat As I have said, to me, anything that involves wiping the CD seems to fall into that category. Or the green "SID - Sound Improvement Disc" that is supposed to reduce stray laser light. To my ears, it reduces the dynamic range, gives transients and etched quality and reduces bass extension and slam, while providing an artificially distanced soundstage. To me, the SID sounds fatiguing. It doesn't make the music "analog", it dulls it.

Everyone's system needs is different. The effect of dulling down transients might work on a system with a lean bright slant. A listener might feel that it made the treble smoother, when in fact, the effect might be rolling off the transients. This effect happens a lot in various power strip devices too. Water gets even murkier since everyone's power condition is different depending on a location. Or, some feel mp3 or copied CD sound better, and I can see also, that dulling down effect might be percieved as smoothing and less fatiguing depedning on one's systems.

Most controversial, as you already know, is the various aftermakret power cords and cables. The same exact cables can sound fabulous in one system, while sound completely abominable in another no matter how expensive they are.

 

[Sovkiller]

Quote:

Originally posted by braillediver How about those that think it technically makes no sense? Expensive power cords when the power then goes through an automotive fuse? Mitch

And after 2000 Kms of plain bare cooper rusted line wire from the main power supply to your home....LOL, I do believe that if you previously conditioned the power at home, with some kind of device, and after that you try some cables, that is OK to talk about differences, but plain out of an outlet, pretty nonsense that the last meter will improve the sound....at least IMO

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sovkiller And after 2000 Kms of plain bare cooper rusted line wire from the main power supply to your home....LOL, I do believe that if you previously conditioned the power at home, with some kind of device, and after that you try some cables, that is OK to talk about differences, but plain out of an outlet, pretty nonsense that the last meter will improve the sound....at least IMO

Most effective power related improvements for cheap is to have two dedicated lines installed ( one for sources and digital stuff one for power amps ) with 10 or 12 guage wire.

Even tho several thousand feet of crappy wire reaching to your house, having a decent wire inside of the house to the outlets made the significant difference.

 

[Wodgy]

Quote:

Originally posted by kuma Most effective power related improvements for cheap is to have two dedicated lines installed ( one for sources and digital stuff one for power amps ) with 10 or 12 guage wire.

That's a cool idea -- having separate digital and analog power lines. I like it!

 

[Sovkiller]

Quote:

Originally posted by kuma Most effective power related improvements for cheap is to have two dedicated lines installed ( one for sources and digital stuff one for power amps ) with 10 or 12 guage wire. Even tho several thousand feet of crappy wire reaching to your house, having a decent wire inside of the house to the outlets made the significant difference.

It is not cheaper to have two dedicated lines in the house, than a power line conditioner, just for curiosity, ask for an estimate on that project and you will run to get one, just to set a line for an air conditioner or an electric stove any dedicated professional will charge you the cost of the power conditioner itself, imagine to do a whole project to separate the lines internally and run it through the walls, or just add one dedicated for that purpose....
On the second point I agree, but most of the times this is not the case, and people insist in replacing just the power cord for a multithousand dollars one.....

 

[kuma]

Quote:

Originally posted by Sovkiller It is not cheaper to have two dedicated lines in the house, than a power line conditioner, just for curiosity, ask for an estimate on that project and you will run to get one, just to set a line for an air conditioner or an electric stove any dedicated professional will charge you the cost of the power conditioner itself, imagine to do a whole project to separate the lines internally and run it through the walls, or just add one dedicated for that purpose.... On the second point I agree, but most of the times this is not the case, and people insist in replacing just the power cord for a multithousand dollars one.....

In my case, installing two dedicated lines cost me few hundred bucks. If I could have done it myself, the cost would be way cheaper. ( only labor cost anyways. material is cheap )
Better investment than most power conditioners I have tried in my systems, too.
Adding a power conditioner can alter the sound not to your liking.

 

[Dusty Chalk]

Quote:

Originally posted by Wodgy They can't get magnetized. It's basic Physics.

Well, basic physics might teach us that aluminum and plastic can't be demagnetized, but advanced physics teaches us that all molecules (including water!) have some magnetic properties (although not necessarily enough to become a magnet themselves, but enough to react to magnetic fields).

So, yes, they can.

PS Not sure what the difference is between Hirsch's category #4 and Sovkiller's category #5, other than the latter is phrased more harshly.

 

[Sovkiller]

Quote:

Originally posted by kuma In my case, installing two dedicated lines cost me few hundred bucks. If I could have done it myself, the cost would be way cheaper. ( only labor cost anyways. material is cheap ) Better investment than most power conditioners I have tried in my systems, too. Adding a power conditioner can alter the sound not to your liking.

Well in your case this was a good choice, congrats, an electrician charged me 250.00 for a dedicated line for an air conditioner some time ago, and just for that, so I assumed that for a whole project of dedicated lines, the cost will be a lot more, OTOH there are good power conditioners under 300.00, and maybe the replacement of the lines, or the new line, will not solve the problem in some houses, or some towns specially the old ones, if the pollution on the line is too high you still may need a filter or so, and what about the the air conditioners, everytime mine started on my old house that was a pain to my ears, and it was on a separate circuit of the house....