Do you really hear differences in cables?

[Canman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnFerrier And I think the burden of proof lies on the people that believe Loch Ness exists...

Oh man, this argument is sinking like a concrete block in water.

 

[JohnFerrier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boodi Do you think there would be a cable world market and research for doing something like thousands of different cables for audio trasmission.

Of course, if people are willing to spend their hard earned money on cables... I'd like to know why it doesn't seem like these product are targeted to the recording industry (with professionals that know the business of audio).

The problem I really have is that these replacement cables can cost more than the cost of headphones. I can't help but wonder what Sennheiser engineers must think...


JF

 

[greenhorn]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rodbac It's stupid-easy to get the signal to the phones intact!

Is this valid for interconnects as well?

 

[Jahn]

Quote:

Originally Posted by greenhorn Is this valid for interconnects as well?

I would say just as valid. Amp to Cans. Or Source to Amp. Either way you are dealing with connectors and a wire. How good are the connectors? How good is the wire? Does it make any difference? I would think a discussion of headphone cables would also apply to interconnects.

 

[JohnFerrier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Langrath If you exchange you original cable from for example HD580. Are you really sure that you hear the difference? Has anybody really made a real blind test? I am an unbeliever. Georg .

Langrath,

Did any of this help?


JF

 

[boodi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnFerrier Of course, if people are willing to spend their hard earned money on cables... I'd like to know why it doesn't seem like these product are targeted to the recording industry (with professionals that know the business of audio). The problem I really have is that these replacement cables can cost more than the cost of headphones. I can't help but wonder what Sennheiser engineers must think... JF

..the fact is that the audiophile "passion" is quite addictive and obs. too , this justify some large expenses by consumers and therefore also the speculation on cables..
Give also hi-fi headphones is much more affordable that regular size hifi, gives that head.fi exists blablabllaand bla..

( btw I assume you dont' make use of aftermarket cables after yuor last post

)

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnFerrier And I think the burden of proof lies on the people that believe Loch Ness exists...

No, we don't have to prove anything. This forum is made for pretending, not proving.

And BTW, Loch Ness does exist.

 

[JohnFerrier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boodi ...( btw I assume you dont' make use of aftermarket cables after yuor last post )

I wired my amplifier with silver wire; however, I have not seen any evidence to lead me to believe that the stock cables are in anyway inadequate for the job. Look, the differences between cables will be small changes in resistance and capacitance. Much larger resistors and capacitors are already used in the amplifier. I don't think that our ears are capable of detecting very small changes in electrical parameter in cables. If a person has already chosen headphones and a decent source, spend your money on CDs (and support your favorite artists).


Quote:

Originally Posted by JaZZ And BTW, Loch Ness does exist.

Of course...


JF

 

[Earwax]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaZZ And BTW, Loch Ness does exist.

I'm sure Nessie will be relieved to hear that!

 

[JaZZ]

The final proof:

 

[cecirdr]

Quote:

Originally Posted by JaZZ The final proof:

Bwhahahaha!

 

[IstariAsuka]

Just a quick question for you guys, maybe I'm being stupid, but it's worth a shot.

With all this talk about how the Zu Mobius "removes the veil" and "opens up the mids" and all, it seems to me that a Senn outfitted with an aftermarket cable would measure differently on a FR curve than one with the stock cable, right? Because these described differences are the same types of differences seen between different headphones in a basic sense by looking at FR curves.

So, if I'm right and not just being completely stupid, why don't we ask Headroom or someone like that to make FR curves for us? Same setup, same headphone, just changing the cables. I know they have the cardas, at least, and I'd think one of them would have to have some others.

 

[JohnFerrier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka Just a quick question for you guys, maybe I'm being stupid, but it's worth a shot. With all this talk about how the Zu Mobius "removes the veil" and "opens up the mids" and all, it seems to me that a Senn outfitted with an aftermarket cable would measure differently on a FR curve than one with the stock cable, right? Because these described differences are the same types of differences seen between different headphones in a basic sense by looking at FR curves. So, if I'm right and not just being completely stupid, why don't we ask Headroom or someone like that to make FR curves for us? Same setup, same headphone, just changing the cables. I know they have the cardas, at least, and I'd think one of them would have to have some others.

That is interesting. My guess is that the difference between cable X and cable Y, if measureable, will be much less than the variation between the left and right headphone transducer. Now, how many people can tell that the left and right channels of their headphone transducer don't have exactly the same response curve?

To illustrate, this represents the difference in frequency response for the left and right channels of a pair of HD 650s.

Does anyone hear this kind of difference? Recall any posts about differences between left and right channels (unless the headphone is broken)? Cable variation, if measureable, will be *much* less than that.


JF

 

[sacd lover]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IstariAsuka Just a quick question for you guys, maybe I'm being stupid, but it's worth a shot. With all this talk about how the Zu Mobius "removes the veil" and "opens up the mids" and all, it seems to me that a Senn outfitted with an aftermarket cable would measure differently on a FR curve than one with the stock cable, right? Because these described differences are the same types of differences seen between different headphones in a basic sense by looking at FR curves. So, if I'm right and not just being completely stupid, why don't we ask Headroom or someone like that to make FR curves for us? Same setup, same headphone, just changing the cables. I know they have the cardas, at least, and I'd think one of them would have to have some others.

I doubt they would measure differently at all. This is just like doing a tube switch. A rca 6sn7gt gray glass tube is much different sounding than a hytron 6sn7gt tall bottle. The sound is clearly different the tubes being almost opposites of one another. If you measure the amp it still measures the same. I have asked Mikhail at singlepower about this specifically. Changing tubes will not alter the amps measurements. Why this is so is a mystery.

This is one of the main reasons I so oppose this measurement mentality that will not accept that measurements cant convey every difference our ears can perceive. There is more to sound measurement than distortion measurements and frequency response deviations. We just havent discovered what they are and how to measure them yet. It certainly would be interesting to see if there were any measureable changes no matter how small. I have done this same test out of a gilmore v2-se using two senn 650's, three different senn cables and my ears perceive clear differences. How they would measure is anyones guess.

 

[JohnFerrier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sacd lover I doubt they would measure differently at all. This is just like doing a tube switch. A rca 6sn7gt gray glass tube is much different sounding than a hytron 6sn7gt tall bottle. The sound is clearly different the tubes being almost opposites of one another. If you measure the amp it still measures the same. I have asked Mikhail at singlepower about this specifically. Changing tubes will not alter the amps measurements. Why this is so is a mystery. This is one of the main reasons I so oppose this measurement mentality that will not accept that measurements cant convey every difference our ears can perceive. There is more to sound measurement than distortion measurements and frequency response deviations. We just havent discovered what they are and how to measure them yet. It certainly would be interesting to see if there were any measureable changes no matter how small. I have done this same test out of a gilmore v2-se using two senn 650's, three different senn cables and my ears perceive clear differences. How they would measure is anyones guess.

We got a man to the moon and back alive following laws of physics not magic wires and hokus pokus...

JF