Do you believe in Burn-In?
Jan 10, 2012 at 1:51 AM Post #214 of 221

zazex

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Quote:
There may be some truth to the burn in of electronics, but I think the lack of a power button on these devices isn't so much as a burn in method, but more so because perhaps the on/off cycle can shorten the device's live.  Plus, I truly believe that many amps and pre-amps sound their best when they are fully warmed up.  Makes no sense to turn them off if they take hours to get to full operating temps.
 


 

 
It may very well be true that the on-off cycle shortens the life of electrical devices, but I haven't heard anything definite on that.
 
But I have heard definitely from designers (electrical, not aesthetic) and other folks knowledgeable in this area
the notion that transistor-based audio gear sounds best when fully warmed up.
 
Jan 10, 2012 at 2:35 AM Post #215 of 221

Magick Man

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For speakers? Absolutely. My B&W N802s gradually bloomed over the course of several hundred hours. This isn't conjecture, it's fact. I had to take one of them in for service (bad crossover) and after it was fixed we A/B blind tested it against a newer N802 in the showroom. Mine produced smoother bass and better defined mids, we could pick it out every time.
 
For headphones? Sometimes. It usually isn't as dramatic, though, and doesn't seem to take nearly as long, maybe 5-10 hours.
 
Tube gear? I have my doubts. There is a difference for a little while, until the tubes are fully warmed up, but that's all I've ever been able to hear.
 
Transistor gear? I've never heard any differences. I have strong doubts here.
 
Cables? *snicker* Yeeeeah... riiiight. Cable burn-in is 100% hokum and exotic cables sold to improve sound are a scam. That said, I do spend a decent amount on cables, but not because they sound better. I enjoy building my own interconnects and playing with neat looking braids and plugs.
 
Jan 10, 2012 at 10:07 PM Post #216 of 221

zazex

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Quote:
For speakers? Absolutely. My B&W N802s gradually bloomed over the course of several hundred hours. This isn't conjecture, it's fact. I had to take one of them in for service (bad crossover) and after it was fixed we A/B blind tested it against a newer N802 in the showroom. Mine produced smoother bass and better defined mids, we could pick it out every time.
 
For headphones? Sometimes. It usually isn't as dramatic, though, and doesn't seem to take nearly as long, maybe 5-10 hours.
 
Tube gear? I have my doubts. There is a difference for a little while, until the tubes are fully warmed up, but that's all I've ever been able to hear.
 
Transistor gear? I've never heard any differences. I have strong doubts here.
 
Cables? *snicker* Yeeeeah... riiiight. Cable burn-in is 100% hokum and exotic cables sold to improve sound are a scam. That said, I do spend a decent amount on cables, but not because they sound better. I enjoy building my own interconnects and playing with neat looking braids and plugs.

 
 
Slightly OT, but are you saying that cables have no effect on sound quality?
 
 
Jan 11, 2012 at 12:42 AM Post #217 of 221

mcdeeda

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it's 99.999% psychological, imo
 
Jan 11, 2012 at 12:49 AM Post #218 of 221

liamstrain

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Quote:
 
 
Slightly OT, but are you saying that cables have no effect on sound quality?
 



Provided that they are not poorly made, and can carry enough signal (large enough gauge of a decent conductor for the distance and load required) - then no. They have not been shown (via objective measurement or blind testing) to have any effect whatsoever. 
 
Jan 11, 2012 at 2:09 AM Post #219 of 221

Magick Man

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Quote:
Provided that they are not poorly made, and can carry enough signal (large enough gauge of a decent conductor for the distance and load required) - then no. They have not been shown (via objective measurement or blind testing) to have any effect whatsoever. 


Ayup. As long as the cable is of sufficient gauge, and the connectors weren't attached by blind chimps, it'll sound like any other cable. We compared $.20/ft 12AWG lamp cord to $1,800 Homegrown X-32 Silver and there were no differences. The test bed was a Krell SACD Standard and KAV-400Xi, running to a pair of Wilson Watt/Puppy VIIs. We did ABX, single blind AB, and open testing with classical, jazz, and rock. 8 hours of testing, 4 testers (2 who were the "golden ear" types), zero difference.
 
The guy ended up sending the Homegrowns back and I made him a nice pair of 12' 10AWG OFC cables using premium spades and ruby-red braided sleeves for $60 (my cost). He was very happy.
 
 
Jan 11, 2012 at 2:20 AM Post #220 of 221

WhiteCrow

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I believe it, my DT1350's used to sound like gravel playing songs with heavy bass. Letting them burn in I can actually feel/hear proper bass.
 
Jan 11, 2012 at 8:18 AM Post #221 of 221

hodgjy

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Absolutely true.  The only thing that matters with cables is the thickness to distance ratio, and even that is overblown at times.  For interconnects less than 10 feet, the included throw-away cables that come with every CD player will sound exactly the same as $1000 exotic cables.  Speaker cables need to get thicker if you're running lengths of 25 feet and over in order to overcome the resistance of the cable itself.  But whether you use Home Depot lamp cord or $200 a foot silver spun from a magic spider on Mount Olympus, it will sound the same.
 
Quote:
Ayup. As long as the cable is of sufficient gauge, and the connectors weren't attached by blind chimps, it'll sound like any other cable. We compared $.20/ft 12AWG lamp cord to $1,800 Homegrown X-32 Silver and there were no differences. The test bed was a Krell SACD Standard and KAV-400Xi, running to a pair of Wilson Watt/Puppy VIIs. We did ABX, single blind AB, and open testing with classical, jazz, and rock. 8 hours of testing, 4 testers (2 who were the "golden ear" types), zero difference.
 
The guy ended up sending the Homegrowns back and I made him a nice pair of 12' 10AWG OFC cables using premium spades and ruby-red braided sleeves for $60 (my cost). He was very happy.
 



 
 

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