DIY Ground Box Thread

[Dandoudou]

and one 16 kg (with 4 connections) that is still on its slow way from China:

I'm also waiting for my 16 kg box.
We will receive them at the same moment.

I did not do a 'direct' comparison. If systematic like you I would have painted only one of the two Quartz boxes, but I did not

It's a pity that you did not try painting only one first to listen to the difference that it makes.

 

[cdacosta]

I at times find it very hard to share or explain the difference of what I hear after adding a DIY ground box to the system. The more boxes I add to a different part of the system, the more refined the system gets, which is also hard to share and express in writing. It is almost a must "hear for oneself" to understand. So I get that the change you hear is hard to explain, especially without a with and without type comparison.

I notice in the pic you are using the 6N copper wire for a cable I suggested. Curious to know what you think of the difference between the factory cable that came with the box and the 6N copper wire?

 

[bodiebill2]

I notice in the pic you are using the 6N copper wire for a cable I suggested. Curious to know what you think of the difference between the factory cable that came with the box and the 6N copper wire?

It starts with trusting you @cdacosta, and following one of your suggestions. Then I sit and listen. What follows is kind of a paradox: if the tweak is successful, I relax and dwell in the euphoria zone, and in that state of mind I am no longer a rational being. Any wish to prove anything to anyone has disappeared by then. Actually, for me, that is all the proof I need. Also, I am reluctant to state in some quasi-objective manner that what I experience, as I know that some will take it as a fact, whereas it is purely subjective and system dependent. Do not forget that most of us have fine-tuned our systems to such a degree that attributing SQ effects to one isolated device or tweak becomes harder and harder.

 

[Dandoudou]

The more boxes I add to a different part of the system, the more refined the system gets, which is also hard to share and express in writing. It is almost a must "hear for oneself" to understand.

@Clockmeister posted an interesting input about ground boxes on Audiophile Style.
According to him, for an optimized result, all the ground boxes of the system should be connected between them to avoid difference in potential between the devices:

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...ur-etherregen/?do=findComment&comment=1247993

 

[bodiebill2]

Sometimes it takes some time, but after 2 hours of listening to classical orchestral music I am pretty convinced that the Rustins G Shield layers on the ground boxes have yielded a nice step up in SQ I do not necessarily mean due to break in but rather that such an incremental improvement can only properly be heard in an extended listening session.

 

[Dandoudou]

Sometimes it takes some time, but after 2 hours of listening to classical orchestral music I am pretty convinced that the Rustins G Shield layers on the ground boxes have yielded a nice step up in SQ I do not necessarily mean due to break in but rather that such an incremental improvement can only properly be heard in an extended listening session.

If you hear such improvement with these small grounding boxes, imagine how good your system will sound with the 16 kg behemoth box.

 

[Crypt Keeper]

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B09LS7J3ZD/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_image?ie=UTF8&th=1 - The EMF paint I used for my boxes ... I did 3 coats of this paint + 1 coat of Krylon Fusion All-In-One Spray Paint ...

One of my recent small ( 3.7 Kg) boxes has no paint shield ... Once the burn-in is done I will do A to B and then paint the box...

 

[cdacosta]

@Clockmeister posted an interesting input about ground boxes on Audiophile Style.
According to him, for an optimized result, all the ground boxes of the system should be connected between them to avoid difference in potential between the devices:

https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...ur-etherregen/?do=findComment&comment=1247993

I read through the page from you link. I did not see where @Clockmeister wrote about that. Can you quote what he said or guide me to it?

From the way he writes or speaks it is apparent he mods and designs, cool. What I am unsure about because I am not a designer and have not tested, is that "some" components like a DAC do not connect signal grounds to earth ground. If all the ground boxes or signal grounds are connected then that will change the design and effectively connect the signal to earth ground. The DAC I am using is like this, some of the inputs are not earth/chassis grounded. I have yet to test all outputs, which I will soon.

 

[cdacosta]

If you hear such improvement with these small grounding boxes, imagine how good your system will sound with the 16 kg behemoth box.

Just as an FYI, most large boxes are multiple boxes in one enclosure. I think the one you are getting is the one Crypt Keeper purchased from Aliexpress. The 16k box is four boxes in one enclosure.

 

[bodiebill2]

I read through the page from you link. I did not see where @Clockmeister wrote about that. Can you quote what he said or guide me to it?

From the way he writes or speaks it is apparent he mods and designs, cool. What I am unsure about because I am not a designer and have not tested, is that "some" components like a DAC do not connect signal grounds to earth ground. If all the ground boxes or signal grounds are connected then that will change the design and effectively connect the signal to earth ground. The DAC I am using is like this, some of the inputs are not earth/chassis grounded. I have yet to test all outputs, which I will soon.

Here is the passage that @Dandoudou , I believe, was referring to:
https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...r-etherregen/page/93/#elControls_1247993_menu

 

[bodiebill2]

Tomorrow I will start designing/building an AC wall outlet with hardwood and these sockets:
- Furutech FT-SDS (G) EU
- Furutech FT-SDS NCF EU
- cruzeFIRST Audio Maestro double US
This will give me the flexibility to compare/finetune with Gold plated and NCF/Rhodium, and also use US plugs.

Question: is it advisable to add a connector for a ground box and, if yes, which inside component(s) should I attach this to?

 

[Dandoudou]

I read through the page from you link. I did not see where @Clockmeister wrote about that. Can you quote what he said or guide me to it?

From the way he writes or speaks it is apparent he mods and designs, cool. What I am unsure about because I am not a designer and have not tested, is that "some" components like a DAC do not connect signal grounds to earth ground. If all the ground boxes or signal grounds are connected then that will change the design and effectively connect the signal to earth ground. The DAC I am using is like this, some of the inputs are not earth/chassis grounded. I have yet to test all outputs, which I will soon.

He mentions the grounding boxes in a larger context about grounding:


"Grounding is a interesting subject one which I really could deleve into great depth, so many audio manufacturers white papers I've seen on this at quiet frankly they are very wide of the mark.
This is RF at work, primarily conducted emissions, however there are other reference rail issue to overcome as well.

The whole point of the exercise is to reduce the PD (potential difference) between each of the 0Vdc (reference rails) between the various connected equipment to a low a resistance as possible. Taking into account the whole transmission line itself and the following impedances. Absolute ideal is a single connection point rather than multiple boxes which will give you variously different PD's. I'm not saying they don't work, what I suggesting is that it's not as optimal as it could be.

Over the years I have collected pretty much all of the latest and greatest grounding boxes, measured them in NON-Amir way (lol) in working systems with a calibrated set up to specifically designed to record and identify this very issue.

This investigation came about on a non-audio project we were involved with in the telecommunications sector nearly ten years ago.

What I can say is that we have measured over 150uA of RF current travelling through the various signal transfer pathways on audio systems.


https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...ur-etherregen/?do=findComment&comment=1247993

 

[cdacosta]

Here is the passage that @Dandoudou , I believe, was referring to:
https://audiophilestyle.com/forums/...r-etherregen/page/93/#elControls_1247993_menu

If it is the July 8 post...

"Grounding is a interesting subject one which I really could deleve into great depth, so many audio manufacturers white papers I've seen on this at quiet frankly they are very wide of the mark.
This is RF at work, primarily conducted emissions, however there are other reference rail issue to overcome as well.

The whole point of the exercise is to reduce the PD (potential difference) between each of the 0Vdc (reference rails) between the various connected equipment to a low a resistance as possible. Taking into account the whole transmission line itself and the following impedances. Absolute ideal is a single connection point rather than multiple boxes which will give you variously different PD's. I'm not saying they don't work, what I suggesting is that it's not as optimal as it could be."

I agree. But I think he is referring to earth ground potential. I think the subject is fascinating, but have not found definitive work on the subject. And when I had direct access to designers and manufacturers I never thought to breach the topic during discussions with them. Would love to know more, especially before attempting anything with my gear.

Thanks for the link.

 

[Dandoudou]

Would love to know more, especially before attempting anything with my gear.

Thanks for the link.

I post on AS.
If you formulate your questions, I can ask him for more information, and clarifications.

 

[cdacosta]

Question: is it advisable to add a connector for a ground box and, if yes, which inside component(s) should I attach this to?

I would. Use a pure copper binding post and wire it to the star point for earth ground. From star point you will have 4 ground leads, one to each of the three outlets and one to binding post for the ground box.

As an aside, I have not used the Schuko outlets but have two of the Maestro. The Maestro outlets do not look like much, but sound very natural and uncolored.