[Romani]

Ok, thanks. Mine definitely do rattle even if I just shake my head lightly, and it isn't the connection between the ear cup and the hinge. Something going on in the headband. Guess I'll go back and change these to another pair and hope they don't have the rattle.

If I may, I would like to backtrack. Now that the family have gone to sleep and there is dead silence, i can confirm there is a definite rattle, however only in the right earcup. No idea what it is. Maybe the back of the nameplate? Definitely didn't notice it till now and I personally wouldn't be classifying it a fault but just part of how it's assembled. I definitely didn't notice it with any music on that's for sure. Sorry I didn't test it in the correct environment previously.

 

[Bark Snarly]

Hmm, not good to hear... My test was in silence with no music, didn't even sound like the cups were rotating to make noise either.

If it's not something obvious with normal use it should matter though, having to shake your head around a bunch to detect a rattle is probably not normal use!

 

[Romani]

@DanMUC - sounds like your opinion of the FS Classic is quite similar to mine. Nice sound sig and whilst the detail is there when you look for it they do sometimes give you the perception they are a bit muddy. The mid-bass hump also has a habit of making the treble feel a bit recessed although it does actually extent pretty well.

Although you found them similar do you feel the Denon sounds less 'fuzzy' to your ears with more present treble?

---

I do miss my Denon D2000 a great deal and loved the sub bass on them. Haven't come across a can that has quite the same weight & impact since. The mention earlier in the thread that Denon consider the MM400 to be a successor to the D2K definitely piqued my curiousity and if the mids have the same smooth sweetness (albeit a bit recessed) and a similar level of sub bass I'd be well pleased.

Has anyone had a chance to compare the two? More similarities than differences or different beasts?

----
The dilemma I have right now about ordering a pair is really how I'd be able to use them. Whilst I'm sure they'd get some use at home I'm not convinced they'd dislodge the Pandora Hope VI as my headphone of choice. Trains & buses I can see but as I'd be selling my IEMs amongst others to fund them it'd mean they'd also need to be used outdoors, and I'm not sure with a premium headphone like this that I'd want to regularly expose them to the elements....maybe something like the Momentum 2.0 would be a better choice in that respect although I'm not really sensing as much love for that 'phone from owners and the original Mo's, whilst enjoyable enough, aren't imho in the same league as some of the other closed back headphones I've owned. 

I previously owned the D2000. I think the successors have the same impact, if anything, more bass presence, including sub bass. I also think they are less grainy than the D2000. However I do feel the D2000 had a more forward midrange. I think as the MM400 are broken in more, their bass will lessen and midrange will come more forward. I had that happen with all Denons to date.

Funny you should mention the Pandora VI. The brand was on my short list, however not that model. I listened to the Pandora VI side by side with the Pandora IV and enjoyed the IV so much more. Odd part is there are reviews everywhere on the VI, nothing on the IV. I bailed on them as I couldn't get anything concrete on what they were made of. I wasn't going to pay AUD$700 on something whose materials were a mystery. And the one review I came across by Dalethorn on YouTube indicated he found their treble ear piercing. That put doubt in my mind on the rig the store had set up to test them.

 

[Romani]

Hmm, not good to hear... My test was in silence with no music, didn't even sound like the cups were rotating to make noise either.

If it's not something obvious with normal use it should matter though, having to shake your head around a bunch to detect a rattle is probably not normal use!

So after almost an hour of trying to find root cause I think I know exactly where it's coming from, especially considering I was able to silence it just by placing my finger on it. On the handband on the inside, on the right side, with the headband extended, you will see a track running downwards. At the point that track moves to the left, almost making it to the bottom, that's where the noise seems to be from. I've inspected it closely, there is nothing looking loose or faulty, just the nature of the headband I suspect. Why it isn't similarly happening on the left is perplexing. As long as it isn't something from inside the ear cups, I ain't complaining. @provision, can you confirm that is the location of the rattling for you too? Same side? Can you similarly silence it if you press and hold a finger precisely on that track?

 

[jellofund]

I previously owned the D2000. I think the successors have the same impact, if anything, more bass presence, including sub bass. I also think they are less grainy than the D2000. However I do feel the D2000 had a more forward midrange. I think as the MM400 are broken in more, their bass will lessen and midrange will come more forward. I had that happen with all Denons to date.
 

 
Stop it! You're not making this any easier! 

 
Sounds good though and whilst I'm not sure I believe in burn in the D2K is the one headphone that stops me dismissing the idea. Something definitely changed with after extensive use and they became far better balanced - whether that was mechanical, mental or pad related I don't know.
 
Quote:

Funny you should mention the Pandora VI. The brand was on my short list, however not that model. I listened to the Pandora VI side by side with the Pandora IV and enjoyed the IV so much more. Odd part is there are reviews everywhere on the VI, nothing on the IV. I bailed on them as I couldn't get anything concrete on what they were made of. I wasn't going to pay AUD$700 on something whose materials were a mystery. And the one review I came across by Dalethorn on YouTube indicated he found their treble ear piercing. That put doubt in my mind on the rig the store had set up to test them.

 

Without a doubt the Hope VI is the best closed back 'phone I've owned. As far as closed back go I feel my journey is over and the urge to upgrade has finally gone. Of course it's not stopped me sampling new headphones (since acquired a DT150 & considering the MM400) but at least the amount I'm spending is no longer following an upward trajectory!
 
I haven't heard the IV and like you Dale's review put me off. Just don't like excessive treble although a member here who owns them did say he found them bright but not to the extent Dale did....certainly not to the point he felt compelled to EQ the heck out of them.
 
Do you recall if the Hope VI had the same pads as the IV or were they noticeably shallower & softer? FAD originally shipped them with the shallow 'limited edition' pads but have now started to fit the IV pads as standard, which in my opinion (I have both) is a terrible move as they alter the sound radically.....and not for the better. Anyone reading reviews is likely to be confused and disappointed with what they are hearing.

 

[provision]

At the point that track moves to the left, almost making it to the bottom, that's where the noise seems to be from. 

Yep, that's it. Placing my finger on the joint or just slightly folding the cups upwards (as you do when folding them for transport) makes it go away. So nothing faulty but slightly annoying. I guess it can be silenced permanently with some tape or blu-tack if it becomes too annoying .

 

[musikaladin]

 

Hmm, not good to hear... My test was in silence with no music, didn't even sound like the cups were rotating to make noise either.

If it's not something obvious with normal use it should matter though, having to shake your head around a bunch to detect a rattle is probably not normal use!

So after almost an hour of trying to find root cause I think I know exactly where it's coming from, especially considering I was able to silence it just by placing my finger on it. On the handband on the inside, on the right side, with the headband extended, you will see a track running downwards. At the point that track moves to the left, almost making it to the bottom, that's where the noise seems to be from. I've inspected it closely, there is nothing looking loose or faulty, just the nature of the headband I suspect. Why it isn't similarly happening on the left is perplexing. As long as it isn't something from inside the ear cups, I ain't complaining. @provision, can you confirm that is the location of the rattling for you too? Same side? Can you similarly silence it if you press and hold a finger precisely on that track?

 
...yes, exactly; based on your approximation I was then able to identify the little "villain"...
 

 
...it is this small piece of metal, you can see it better from the outside when folding the phone...
 

 
Actually this piece is on the left and right can, and if you move it a little it makes this sound on either side. It is just slightly more loose on the right side, so it makes this clicking sound when shaking the phone. I do not feel disturbed. If it wasn't mentioned here I wouldn't have recognized it.
 
If you feel disturbed, you could try to apply a very little bit of grease (e.g. Shimano Workshop Grease) inside the gap on either side of that metal piece; That should dampen the "rattling" well enough.

 

[Rocco Khan]

  Knowing my taste in music, you know the answer

Then sub bass still present in the MM400s! That is fantastic to hear. Thanks for the test...

 

[musikaladin]

  Does anyone who own these also own the D600's?  Care to compare them?

 
...there is a short comparison AH-D600 / AH-MM400 in the 2^nd comment below this review...

 

[yavormoskov]

How are the highs and the midrange of MM400? For example I listen to a lot of complex classical music, choirs, chamber orchestras, etc. In that regard the bass is not very essential to me. I can live with it as long as it does not affect the midrange, the highs and total clarity.

 

[yavormoskov]

By the way, have you been able to remove the ear pads, guys, or they are non removable for sure?

 

[provision]

By the way, have you been able to remove the ear pads, guys, or they are non removable for sure?

I asked about this at the store where I bought mine and was told that the ear pads are replaceable, though it's best to let an authorized dealer change them because they have a "special tool". If that is really the case I do not know. There is no mention of it in the manual…

 

[carlove]

 
I asked about this at the store where I bought mine and was told that the ear pads are replaceable, though it's best to let an authorized dealer change them because they have a "special tool". If that is really the case I do not know. There is no mention of it in the manual…

 
Yeah, I tried to take my ear-pads off. And it's easily possible, I don't know if you really need a special tool for it.
Though it's troubling that you can't buy separate ear-pads/cables anywhere.

EDIT:
As I noticed my comment is being used in a review, here is some extra information concerning the earpads; be gentle with them, do NOT pull the material that usually touches your ears. This material comes off the rest of the earpads easily (not enough glue/stitching). Getting the earpads up isn't tricky, you can use some force. The earpads (besides mentioned material) are very sturdy. But it does take some effort getting the earpads back on 'perfectly', the earpads (where it attaches itself onto the earcups) won't always seal perfectly, and might show a small black line (the plastical material used to attach itself to the earcups). But just pulling the earpad a bit, or moving it around on the earcup will resolve it. So while the earpads replacement are DIY, it can be tricky or a slight nuisance.

 

[Romani]

Stop it! You're not making this any easier! 

Sounds good though and whilst I'm not sure I believe in burn in the D2K is the one headphone that stops me dismissing the idea. Something definitely changed with after extensive use and they became far better balanced - whether that was mechanical, mental or pad related I don't know.

Quote:
Without a doubt the Hope VI is the best closed back 'phone I've owned. As far as closed back go I feel my journey is over and the urge to upgrade has finally gone. Of course it's not stopped me sampling new headphones (since acquired a DT150 & considering the MM400) but at least the amount I'm spending is no longer following an upward trajectory!

I haven't heard the IV and like you Dale's review put me off. Just don't like excessive treble although a member here who owns them did say he found them bright but not to the extent Dale did....certainly not to the point he felt compelled to EQ the heck out of them.

Do you recall if the Hope VI had the same pads as the IV or were they noticeably shallower & softer? FAD originally shipped them with the shallow 'limited edition' pads but have now started to fit the IV pads as standard, which in my opinion (I have both) is a terrible move as they alter the sound radically.....and not for the better. Anyone reading reviews is likely to be confused and disappointed with what they are hearing.

Yep, I felt the D2000 bass settled with usage. I didn't feel like the top end and mid range had changed that much though.

Comparing the 2 Pandoras, for some reason, I recall the IV having deeper pads. I also recall the IV being more comfy as they were a whole heap lighter. Both beautifully built. Sound wise, I felt the IV had more immediate impact and the VI had some artificial air in the mid range and top end. The best analogy is the VI felt more like the D2000 and the IV more like the MM400 in sound signature. It was a 30 minute listening session so I may have not spent enough time to correctly judge.

 

[Romani]

...yes, exactly; based on your approximation I was then able to identify the little "villain"...




...it is this small piece of metal, you can see it better from the outside when folding the phone...




Actually this piece is on the left and right can, and if you move it a little it makes this sound on either side. It is just slightly more loose on the right side, so it makes this clicking sound when shaking the phone. I do not feel disturbed. If it wasn't mentioned here I wouldn't have recognized it.

If you feel disturbed, you could try to apply a very little bit of grease (e.g. Shimano Workshop Grease) inside the gap on either side of that metal piece; That should dampen the "rattling" well enough.

Well done, you narrowed it right down. I will see what I can do with it once I get home. Who would have thought something so little could be the source of so much chaos