[sajunky]

Update: Well, I can not be sure if I have that bias thing, but I think connecting it to the keyboard (usb 2.0 inside) and keyboard to macbook, sounds less shouty the female vocals high. When using the usb 3.0 hub, I would swear it's less transparent sound, and the female vocals high sound more glary, more piercing.

Used pj harvey song, to talk to you, 24-96, audirvana. upsampled x2.

Enjoy your Ares!

Yip, it is reported by many that USB 2.0 phy is less noisy.
Your journey only begins. I have to add, that keyboard is USB powered. Better result are when using USB 2.0 hub with external power supply. And then you can experiment whether it is better to plug it to a keyboard port or directly to a laptop (in my experience better, but make your own tests). Keyboard can be plugged to this hub, but no more devices, just DAC and optionally keyboard.

External power supply is important, as it redirects ground loops to a hub's power supply. It is what ifi defender does. It can be a quality LPS for better results, but you can try a typical USB charger first.

 

[Lolito]

Thanks, I have a few usb 2.0 hubs somewhere. the dac already has a LPS, 5V, regulable.I see many people have it at 5.01, or 5.02, I adjusted mine to 5.00v, not sure what should I set it to... The laptop PSU is a big piece of crap and the port is usb 3.0, sounds better to the keyboard, to the laptop directly sounds like to the usb 3.0 port...

This is not Ares yet, this is a topping E30 with LPS from china.

UPDATE TO NOT WRITE MORE POSTS:

Is there any kind of audiophile friendly usb 2.0 hub? Since I plan to keep 2 dacs for convenience, one R2R for audirvana, another delta sigma for youtube, movies and electronic music or whatever, would be nice to have a decent usb 2.0 hub, with connection to external power supply. thanks.

 

[PopZeus]

Any Apple Mac computer owners here using it also with an Ares 2? I´ve read in the past some little issues or something? I use Audirvana, ALAC files, red book, then high res flacs too and dsd, all via Audirvana playback... Would be great to be warned of any caveats, so I don't get mad if it doesn't work from minute 1. I alse read it needs a ton of burn in time, right?

Yeah, I have a very similar setup. For a while, my iMac was freezing everytime I took the Ares 2 off standby. It was really bad, even freezing during start up. It was a direct USB connection but now I'm using a hub, and now I leave my DAC on all the time (sounds better warm anyways and gets you thru burn-in faster). I've never used a DDC so I don't know what I'm missing. I've also never tried the Ares via coax, so that might be peak performance for that DAC? No idea, but Audirvana sounds excellent through my setup.

 

[sajunky]

Is there any kind of audiophile friendly usb 2.0 hub? Since I plan to keep 2 dacs for convenience, one R2R for audirvana, another delta sigma for youtube, movies and electronic music or whatever, would be nice to have a decent usb 2.0 hub, with connection to external power supply. thanks.

Audiophile hub? Better get DDC. Did I said only one device connected to the hub, didn't I? You can surely afford two cheap hubs/PSU's.

 

[Lolito]

Thanks for the inputs and help. It is very nuanced details in the sound, you really have to pay attention to notice it, but there is certainly an improvement now, connected to the usb 3.0 hub with plenty of stuff connected there, now just to the keyboard as usb 2.0 hub, sounds cleaner, less glare maybe, less shouty, cleaner larger bass... Now, I have one of those fancy 10€ USB audiophile cable from aliexpress, and then I have the one included with the DAC. Both sound the same, or the non fancy one better if you ask me, didn't test that yet. I think both cables sound very clean, will keep the audiophile one. it is much more beefy, thick, stronger. Eventually I will have to use a USB 2.0 hub with optional PSU, linear or not... This is an endless collection of boxes eh? and we didn't considered DDC yet in this whole... This is an endless rabbit hole that eventually you gotta decide where to stop, otherwise... this was a free sound upgrade though.

 

[daytrader]

keeping on topic with USB cables, has anyone experimented with run length over USB? I‘ve read 10 to up to 15’(max) is perfectly acceptable with no signal degradation. Anyone, thought? Thanks

 

[Lolito]

the longer the cable, the more interference it can grab, maybe there a more audiophile cable works better, still, 5m is a decent max length for usb, if it's properly powered should be good. here the audiophile cable of 1m, via the 2.0 thing and with 2x oversampling, sounds really good. Still, delta sigma kinda shouty eventually, if loud, more in speakers than headphones, can be room acoustics easily, we are splitting hairs here ATM. In the sweetspot life is great now at 23:32



also turned down the laptop fans, they were spinning as if it was 1995 all over again

 

[TheRealDz]

I see you have experience with these "USB cleaners". How was the "performance" or the sound in general, without any of those devices? what is your source, it has cable noise or somehting?

I see there iFi iPurifier, iFi Silencer. Any help would be highly appreciated, since this denafrips Ares2 gonna have to stay here for a long long time. Not spending more money on a DAC until 2026, minimum ;-D

@Lolito, sorry for the slow reply.

1) iFi Silencer: I don't hear a difference. I can't say whether it is worth it. But for $50, it may be fun to experiment with.

2) iFi iPurifier: after lots of experimenting, I think the music sounds smoother, but it is not dramatic either way.

However, this is a necessary component for me, since I am running a toslink out from my AppleTV on my living room rig, and I need this to convert to coax. Otherwise, I think your money is better spent on;

3) Singxer F-1: @AlanU was right; the improvement is pretty dramatic. Way more inner detail and dimension to the music, while sounding smoother. One of my acid tests is whether I can keep turning the music up without fatigue, and with the F-1 I can keep doing so. And mine doesn't even have 100 hours on yet (supposedly continues to improve up to 500 hours).

The fundamental sound of the Ares isn't changed, but rather it is improved across the board. Absolute no brainer for $200, and a necessary component to get the most out of your Ares.

4) Schiit Etir: cleaned up the sound, but perhaps too much. It made the Ares sound a bit more clinical - ie, it changed the fundamental sound of my Ares, for the worse.

If you have noise problems in your system, perhaps the Etir is your solution. But ib my system, it did not make the dramatic improvement that the F-1 did.

I hope that helps.

 

[AlanU]

@Lolito, sorry for the slow reply.

1) iFi Silencer: I don't hear a difference. I can't say whether it is worth it. But for $50, it may be fun to experiment with.

2) iFi iPurifier: after lots of experimenting, I think the music sounds smoother, but it is not dramatic either way.

However, this is a necessary component for me, since I am running a toslink out from my AppleTV on my living room rig, and I need this to convert to coax. Otherwise, I think your money is better spent on;

3) Singxer F-1: @AlanU was right; the improvement is pretty dramatic. Way more inner detail and dimension to the music, while sounding smoother. One of my acid tests is whether I can keep turning the music up without fatigue, and with the F-1 I can keep doing so. And mine doesn't even have 100 hours on yet (supposedly continues to improve up to 500 hours).

The fundamental sound of the Ares isn't changed, but rather it is improved across the board. Absolute no brainer for $200, and a necessary component to get the most out of your Ares.

4) Schiit Etir: cleaned up the sound, but perhaps too much. It made the Ares sound a bit more clinical - ie, it changed the fundamental sound of my Ares, for the worse.

If you have noise problems in your system, perhaps the Etir is your solution. But ib my system, it did not make the dramatic improvement that the F-1 did.

I hope that helps.

Good to hear the Singxer F1 is doing the trick!!!!

This is where a reclocker is a serious jump from your typical DDC such as the Eitr.

In most cases any type of USB "performance" device is just a slight improvement....if at all.

What I have observed is that my old UPtone USBRegen was nothing special when I used it with my laptop to DAC. Never cared for the Uptone product even though it was suppose to be effective. Well as weeks go by I am just observing that it's not that much of any improvement when I feed the treated Uptone USB Regen signal to the Mutec Mc-3+USB. To be fair it may possibly be a slight refinement. One must understand that the slightest improvement will always add up collectively. I am commenting on the USBRegen based on my ears and not honeymoon excitement of buying devices. I've had to dust off this product as I shelved it due to little to no improvement. Mind you I was trying to fix a jitter problem witha simple device.

The re-clocking device should be a kick in the face "WOW". Just remember that in my case the first reclocker is a wow!! the second unit is not nearly as "wow" but my wallet still feels it's a worthy refinement that is without a doubt justifiable.

If people talk about "improvements" with apple tv. I have used my Silent Angle N8 audio grade ethernet switch (I used 2 SA N8/ with F1 Linear power supply). I feed the ethernet to my apple TV and the sound quality gets dramatically better. I use CAT7 Ugreen shielded cable as it's grounded well to protect the signal. The detail improves alot and is worth it to me. No joke....... it's very noticeable in my hifi 2 CHANNEL rig.

However for audio the external device that re-clocks signal is a very serious upgrade.

 

[Lolito]

Maybe DAC manufacturers should be taking notes here, maybe USB implementation can be a selling point for the future. I would like my next DAC to have this stuff integrated, not having to buy another damn box. RE-clocking the clocked clock after first clock re-clock clock... So now denafrips, or Singxer, can sell you the usb cleaning box first, then the DAC, then the pre-amp, then amp... LOL

I think USB implementation and quality of cleaning is going to be the next battle in affordable delta-sigma dacs of up to 1000€. It already is. Schiit implementation supposed to be quite good.

 

[AlanU]

Maybe DAC manufacturers should be taking notes here, maybe USB implementation can be a selling point for the future. I would like my next DAC to have this stuff integrated, not having to buy another damn box. RE-clocking the clocked clock after first clock re-clock clock... So now denafrips, or Singxer, can sell you the usb cleaning box first, then the DAC, then the pre-amp, then amp... LOL

I think USB implementation and quality of cleaning is going to be the next battle in affordable delta-sigma dacs of up to 1000€. It already is. Schiit implementation supposed to be quite good.

So virtually all DACS us USB Asycronous connection.

Most hardcore 2 channel people I know will use I2S (Aqua acousic) with their LinQ streamer or Mutec feeding coax to dacs. This is where it concentrates on retention of the clock signal from the re-clocking DDC. Interesting how many care little for MQA or 32 bit. I can now understand why as even 16 bit has blown me away after cascading my two mutecs.

USB is not appealing to me as it would require an excellent noise rejecting usb cable $$$$$$. This may sound silly but if you spend 500 bucks on a boutique fancy usb cable that is a passive piece of wire....spending approx 1000 more will provide you a reclocking DDC that will be in ENDGAME guaranteed source feed that is proven to work for year to come. On the otherhand buy a Singxer F1 and usb ifi unit and buy something that works vs a spendy fancy looking usb cable.

I no longer even care for 32 bit or MQA. Bottom line is the quality of the clock signal that feeds the dac. USB for some people may work great but it all depends on how your gear rejects noise or how it copes with noise.

 

[Lolito]

So virtually all DACS us USB Asycronous connection.

Most hardcore 2 channel people I know will use I2S (Aqua acousic) with their LinQ streamer or Mutec feeding coax to dacs. This is where it concentrates on retention of the clock signal from the re-clocking DDC. Interesting how many care little for MQA or 32 bit. I can now understand why as even 16 bit has blown me away after cascading my two mutecs.

USB is not appealing to me as it would require an excellent noise rejecting usb cable $$$$$$. This may sound silly but if you spend 500 bucks on a boutique fancy usb cable that is a passive piece of wire....spending approx 1000 more will provide you a reclocking DDC that will be in ENDGAME guaranteed source feed that is proven to work for year to come. On the otherhand buy a Singxer F1 and usb ifi unit and buy something that works vs a spendy fancy looking usb cable.

I no longer even care for 32 bit or MQA. Bottom line is the quality of the clock signal that feeds the dac. USB for some people may work great but it all depends on how your gear rejects noise or how it copes with noise.

If I ever want to waste money, I would certainly expend it in prostitutes and cocaine and then get a schiit heresy+modi. I´ve never ever seen 32bits music file. I have 24-96, or even 24-192, dsd 64 and even 128, but 32 bits never even seen it. Of course, I have not tested any of those ddc, you say coaxial better than toslink for entering the dac with?

 

[sajunky]

So virtually all DACS us USB Asycronous connection.

Most hardcore 2 channel people I know will use I2S (Aqua acousic) with their LinQ streamer or Mutec feeding coax to dacs. This is where it concentrates on retention of the clock signal from the re-clocking DDC. Interesting how many care little for MQA or 32 bit. I can now understand why as even 16 bit has blown me away after cascading my two mutecs.
[...]
Bottom line is the quality of the clock signal that feeds the dac. USB for some people may work great but it all depends on how your gear rejects noise or how it copes with noise.

Rejecting a noise is very difficult on the USB, I agree. On the other side USB allows to deliver data stream asynchronously which means a clock from the internal oscilators is used for synchronisation. Unfortunately this perfect scenario is broken when you try to isolate I2S output from the USB receiver. It means that most of DDC devices will reclock, while it could be avoided. You call it re-clocking DDC's. Not the best solution in my opinion, it is why you have Mutec re-clocking device where re-clocking is made very well. Another method is to design bi-directional isolator that would not break asynchronous packet delivery. This would not require reclocking USB port, perhars you should try DI-20/DI-20HE or any 2021 version of Audio DG DACs that implement this feature.

 

[Lolito]

So virtually all DACS us USB Asycronous connection.

Most hardcore 2 channel people I know will use I2S (Aqua acousic) with their LinQ streamer or Mutec feeding coax to dacs. This is where it concentrates on retention of the clock signal from the re-clocking DDC. Interesting how many care little for MQA or 32 bit. I can now understand why as even 16 bit has blown me away after cascading my two mutecs.

USB is not appealing to me as it would require an excellent noise rejecting usb cable $$$$$$. This may sound silly but if you spend 500 bucks on a boutique fancy usb cable that is a passive piece of wire....spending approx 1000 more will provide you a reclocking DDC that will be in ENDGAME guaranteed source feed that is proven to work for year to come. On the otherhand buy a Singxer F1 and usb ifi unit and buy something that works vs a spendy fancy looking usb cable.

I no longer even care for 32 bit or MQA. Bottom line is the quality of the clock signal that feeds the dac. USB for some people may work great but it all depends on how your gear rejects noise or how it copes with noise.

One question, what price are your speakers? because my speakers with amp costs new 1100€, I bought them on offer for 660€. Speakers with amplification.
I bought now a 600€ R2R DAC, it is already an overcost. I understand with systems with a +5000€ speakers, with 1000-2000€ in amp+preamp, I understand all that hassle. but re-clocking the clock for the clock after the clock, usb to coax to XLR ro rca...


Too much. Schiit Bifrost 3 and be done with it, you heard it here first.

 

[joseG86]

If I ever want to waste money, I would certainly expend it in prostitutes and cocaine and then get a schiit heresy+modi.

Lmao