[szore]

I currently have a Bifrost 2, and I love the soundstage depth and weight/thickness to the sound compared to my Modius, but I feel like its a bit too forward and dynamic for my tastes. I came from the Modius, where I like the more laid back, less forward, wider presentation with a clearer background but after hearing the Bifrost 2 I really do appreciate what it brings. I found the Bifrost 2 has a very similar tonality to the Schiit amplifiers, but in my case I found it a bit too much of a good thing for the synergy I was hoping at getting.

I'm thinking of getting the Ares II, what I'm hoping for is that its not quite as forward and dynamic as the Bifrost 2 (softer and more laid back sounding), but still maintains that depth and weight to the sound - while having a more accentuated and wider soundstage. A bonus of course if it can maintain some treble air and background clarity. Would I be looking in the right direction with this DAC?

I have not heard the bitfrost but I think the Ares will be what you are looking for.

 

[Ufanco]

I currently have a Bifrost 2, and I love the soundstage depth and weight/thickness to the sound compared to my Modius, but I feel like its a bit too forward and dynamic for my tastes. I came from the Modius, where I like the more laid back, less forward, wider presentation with a clearer background but after hearing the Bifrost 2 I really do appreciate what it brings. I found the Bifrost 2 has a very similar tonality to the Schiit amplifiers, but in my case I found it a bit too much of a good thing for the synergy I was hoping at getting.

I'm thinking of getting the Ares II, what I'm hoping for is that its not quite as forward and dynamic as the Bifrost 2 (softer and more laid back sounding), but still maintains that depth and weight to the sound - while having a more accentuated and wider soundstage. A bonus of course if it can maintain some treble air and background clarity. Would I be looking in the right direction with this DAC?

I read a lot of different reviews and forum posting comparing these 2 before choosing a Ares ii. From what I understand there is a difference in sound signature btw Ares ii and Bitfrost 2. I think the ares ii might be more what you are seeking sound wise.
Just not sure if it be a huge upgrade to buy a Ares ii if you already have the Bitfrost 2. You might do better off looking at upgrading amp or another part of the system depending on what the rest of system is.
If you decide to go the Ares ii route the good thing is it’s a hot seller on the used market and you would recoup most of the cost if you decide it’s not for you.
There are a lot of reviews and comparisons btw these 2 units online. But in the end it really comes down to a personal choice on which one sounds better to you. Honestly the only real way to tell is by comparing them in your system. If I was in your position I would order the ares ii and compare them. Worse case you loss a little when you sell the one you least like.

Personally I rather loss a few bucks and enjoy what sound the best to me. I love the sound of Ares ii so feel no need to test out the Bitfrost 2. In your case it sounds like the Bitfrost 2 isn’t supply the sound you are seeking.

 

[TrumpOrMonkey]

I read a lot of different reviews and forum posting comparing these 2 before choosing a Ares ii. From what I understand there is a difference in sound signature btw Ares ii and Bitfrost 2. I think the ares ii might be more what you are seeking sound wise.
Just not sure if it be a huge upgrade to buy a Ares ii if you already have the Bitfrost 2. You might do better off looking at upgrading amp or another part of the system depending on what the rest of system is.
If you decide to go the Ares ii route the good thing is it’s a hot seller on the used market and you would recoup most of the cost if you decide it’s not for you.
There are a lot of reviews and comparisons btw these 2 units online. But in the end it really comes down to a personal choice on which one sounds better to you. Honestly the only real way to tell is by comparing them in your system. If I was in your position I would order the ares ii and compare them. Worse case you loss a little when you sell the one you least like.

Personally I rather loss a few bucks and enjoy what sound the best to me. I love the sound of Ares ii so feel no need to test out the Bitfrost 2. In your case it sounds like the Bitfrost 2 isn’t supply the sound you are seeking.

I hear you on that when it comes to upgrading amp or other things first, I'm currently using a Jotunheim 2 and Lyr 3 for amp duties at the moment which I enjoy a lot. I had spent some time exploring and comparing quite a few different amps to find the ones I like now. I had considered looking into the 1k USD~ used price range of amps but since I'm from Australia there doesn't tend to be as many options as over in the US at this price, and usually the options I'm either not too interested in (iCan Pro, Burson Soloist 3xp) or are physically too large to fit in my current setup (Bryston BHA-1, Mjolnir 2 etc) and all of which (apart from the Soloist 3xp) are closer to 1.4k USD so quite a lot more expensive. There seems to be quite a gulf between the 400 to 700 AUD options to the 2k + options I found.

For headphones I'm running Arya V2, HE6SEv2, LCD2F, HD800S - as well as a Stax SRM-212 running SR202 and SR404 on the side. So I feel like I'm pretty dialed in when it comes to headphones too. There's very little I feel like trying out or upgrading to, maybe an LCD3F or consider getting a SR007 - but no strong urge to do it yet. So at the moment I'm just trying to dial in my setup and optimize it as much as I can.

At the moment I'm seeing the Modius as the weak link in my system that should be easiest to upgrade. I wouldn't say that I'm significantly dissatisfied by how it sounds, but its more of a curiosity to see if I can get more by stepping up to a higher end DAC.

DACs have been more difficult than anything else in this hobby to get reviews that seem to instill confidence in being able to conceptualise how they will sound in my experience. I've seen reviews for the Ares II which say the stage is collapsed compared to D/S DACs around the same price, and then I've heard reviews which have said the soundstage is much more expansive. I've seen reviews which have said its warmer than the Bifrost 2, then reviews which have said that its more neutral than the Bifrost 2. So I'm really not sure what to expect at this moment. This is not something I experienced with researching headphones or amps - at times my own findings would differ, but generally reviews felt more in agreement with each other.

All that I know is that the only way for certain is to try it, but ultimately I'm trying to not lose too much cash on it so waiting patiently for a used one to come up in my local headphone market, then we'll see!

Thanks for your advice, appreciate it

 

[Ufanco]

I hear you on that when it comes to upgrading amp or other things first, I'm currently using a Jotunheim 2 and Lyr 3 for amp duties at the moment which I enjoy a lot. I had spent some time exploring and comparing quite a few different amps to find the ones I like now. I had considered looking into the 1k USD~ used price range of amps but since I'm from Australia there doesn't tend to be as many options as over in the US at this price, and usually the options I'm either not too interested in (iCan Pro, Burson Soloist 3xp) or are physically too large to fit in my current setup (Bryston BHA-1, Mjolnir 2 etc) and all of which (apart from the Soloist 3xp) are closer to 1.4k USD so quite a lot more expensive. There seems to be quite a gulf between the 400 to 700 AUD options to the 2k + options I found.

For headphones I'm running Arya V2, HE6SEv2, LCD2F, HD800S - as well as a Stax SRM-212 running SR202 and SR404 on the side. So I feel like I'm pretty dialed in when it comes to headphones too. There's very little I feel like trying out or upgrading to, maybe an LCD3F or consider getting a SR007 - but no strong urge to do it yet. So at the moment I'm just trying to dial in my setup and optimize it as much as I can.

At the moment I'm seeing the Modius as the weak link in my system that should be easiest to upgrade. I wouldn't say that I'm significantly dissatisfied by how it sounds, but its more of a curiosity to see if I can get more by stepping up to a higher end DAC.

DACs have been more difficult than anything else in this hobby to get reviews that seem to instill confidence in being able to conceptualise how they will sound in my experience. I've seen reviews for the Ares II which say the stage is collapsed compared to D/S DACs around the same price, and then I've heard reviews which have said the soundstage is much more expansive. I've seen reviews which have said its warmer than the Bifrost 2, then reviews which have said that its more neutral than the Bifrost 2. So I'm really not sure what to expect at this moment. This is not something I experienced with researching headphones or amps - at times my own findings would differ, but generally reviews felt more in agreement with each other.

All that I know is that the only way for certain is to try it, but ultimately I'm trying to not lose too much cash on it so waiting patiently for a used one to come up in my local headphone market, then we'll see!

Thanks for your advice, appreciate it

No problem the amps you have are great guess missed seeing that in your signature. I hear what your saying on reviews of these two dac’s. In my case I decided to go with the ares ii for a couple of reasons.

First was all the r2r reviews I read to seemed to compare it to the ares ii. I also tend to like a more warm nature sound and seemed the ares ii fits this bill better. There also seemed to be more service issue mentioned with the Bitfrost 2.

When contacted both companies with question I got very different vibes with the responses I received back. If you can’t be bothered to answer question before sales, it doesn’t make me comfortable on how you you handle services after the sale. Alvin at VH Audio was super helpful and friendly in response. This difference wasn’t the hugest part of my decision on purchase, but it did play a roll on it.

Just passed the burn in stage and have no buyers remorse at all. The sound I’m hearing has exceeded my expectations and I highly recommend this Dac. If you buy used try find a original buy who can transfer warranty to you.

 

[BlueSundays]

For those of you who own this DAC, Ive read some reviews that the USB input useage is somewhat sub-par. Just wondering if anyone here had the same trouble or degration of sound quality using the USB input.

 

[godmax]

For those of you who own this DAC, Ive read some reviews that the USB input useage is somewhat sub-par. Just wondering if anyone here had the same trouble or degration of sound quality using the USB input.

USB on the Ares II is perfectly fine - even above average in stability and reliability, but its not galvanic isolated so you might get subject of ground loop noise (same as coax) like any other unisolated DAC. The digital data from coax, optical and USB will all be routed to the same FIFO buffer before getting processed - so if there is no bit-flip happening before that - they are all the same no matter what input you will use.
There was a minor glitch on the Ares II internal buffer handling that created randomly noise on rare conditions, but that has been fixed now with the latest firmware.

 

[sajunky]

For those of you who own this DAC, Ive read some reviews that the USB input useage is somewhat sub-par. Just wondering if anyone here had the same trouble or degration of sound quality using the USB input.

USB can sound good or very bad, a reason is pointed out by @godmax. Coax is less sensitive to the specific configuration assuming there are transformer coupled as it should. Transformer coupling cannot be used on USB lines, so isolation of the USB port is a tricky job. Ares has no USB isolation, it is why i.e. for some users Bifrost 2 sounds better, but it is only because BF2 has USB isolator. It will perform more consistent in various systems. For Ares you should try ground loop redirectors like ifi Defender, converters to S/PDIF, then at a higher price level network streamers that are designed to generate less noise than ordinary PC/laptop.

 

[szore]

For those of you who own this DAC, Ive read some reviews that the USB input useage is somewhat sub-par. Just wondering if anyone here had the same trouble or degration of sound quality using the USB input.

I have a Black Dragon USB out of the Ares and an Element H USB card with power supply, and I'm very happy with the sound...

 

[dougms3]

For those of you who own this DAC, Ive read some reviews that the USB input useage is somewhat sub-par. Just wondering if anyone here had the same trouble or degration of sound quality using the USB input.

I just recently got the Audio-gd DI-20HE DDC and switched to spdif.

Chain is PC > linear ps - Jcat femto > usb > DI20he > spdif > ares ii

What is surprising is that the spdif is limited to 24/192 but sounds better than the DSD512 upsampling via usb to ares ii.

So it could be possible that the usb interface on the ares ii is not all that great but I'm also using an audioquest carbon spdif cable so theres that, I would need an aq carbon usb to sure about the usb interface lol.

 

[BlueSundays]

Awesome replies. Thanks a bunch everyone. Im tempted to go with the Pontus or Gumby, but at that point my DAC would be more $$$ than anything else in my chain. It be a buy once, cry once solution. Probably not messed with at LEAST for 5 years or most likely even longer.

 

[whitedragem]

I hear you on that when it comes to upgrading amp or other things first, I'm currently using a Jotunheim 2 and Lyr 3 for amp duties at the moment which I enjoy a lot. I had spent some time exploring and comparing quite a few different amps to find the ones I like now. I had considered looking into the 1k USD~ used price range of amps but since I'm from Australia there doesn't tend to be as many options as over in the US at this price, and usually the options I'm either not too interested in (iCan Pro, Burson Soloist 3xp) or are physically too large to fit in my current setup (Bryston BHA-1, Mjolnir 2 etc) and all of which (apart from the Soloist 3xp) are closer to 1.4k USD so quite a lot more expensive. There seems to be quite a gulf between the 400 to 700 AUD options to the 2k + options I found.

For headphones I'm running Arya V2, HE6SEv2, LCD2F, HD800S - as well as a Stax SRM-212 running SR202 and SR404 on the side. So I feel like I'm pretty dialed in when it comes to headphones too. There's very little I feel like trying out or upgrading to, maybe an LCD3F or consider getting a SR007 - but no strong urge to do it yet. So at the moment I'm just trying to dial in my setup and optimize it as much as I can.

At the moment I'm seeing the Modius as the weak link in my system that should be easiest to upgrade. I wouldn't say that I'm significantly dissatisfied by how it sounds, but its more of a curiosity to see if I can get more by stepping up to a higher end DAC.

DACs have been more difficult than anything else in this hobby to get reviews that seem to instill confidence in being able to conceptualise how they will sound in my experience. I've seen reviews for the Ares II which say the stage is collapsed compared to D/S DACs around the same price, and then I've heard reviews which have said the soundstage is much more expansive. I've seen reviews which have said its warmer than the Bifrost 2, then reviews which have said that its more neutral than the Bifrost 2. So I'm really not sure what to expect at this moment. This is not something I experienced with researching headphones or amps - at times my own findings would differ, but generally reviews felt more in agreement with each other.

All that I know is that the only way for certain is to try it, but ultimately I'm trying to not lose too much cash on it so waiting patiently for a used one to come up in my local headphone market, then we'll see!

Thanks for your advice, appreciate it

but ‘more so’ following on from the earlier post…..

I currently have a Bifrost 2, and I love the soundstage depth and weight/thickness to the sound compared to my Modius, but I feel like its a bit too forward and dynamic for my tastes. I came from the Modius, where I like the more laid back, less forward, wider presentation with a clearer background but after hearing the Bifrost 2 I really do appreciate what it brings. I found the Bifrost 2 has a very similar tonality to the Schiit amplifiers, but in my case I found it a bit too much of a good thing for the synergy I was hoping at getting.

I'm thinking of getting the Ares II, what I'm hoping for is that its not quite as forward and dynamic as the Bifrost 2 (softer and more laid back sounding), but still maintains that depth and weight to the sound - while having a more accentuated and wider soundstage. A bonus of course if it can maintain some treble air and background clarity. Would I be looking in the right direction with this DAC?

I believe the Ares II is the best gateway (certainly by price point) for the factors you are seeking.
My experience was all the things you are seeking were the areas it had exceptional performance (vs a range of well curated DACs)..
Its only weakness (vs higher priced units) was a few genres didn’t hold up as well vs super specc’d Delta Sigma (and ‘multibit’) DACs, such as electronica, due to D/S and budget DACs generally nailing bass responce (overemphasising this aspect perhaps)..

The few serious review on the Ares II (that knew what they were talking about and didn’t have glaring issues with aspects of the chain that led to their ‘unusual‘ findings), place it as most of what the ‘above’ models offer, but the big improvements, musically speaking was in the bass response (more suitable for specific genres /‘listeners’).

If your music catalogue is all electronica and the absolute most bass response and drive is called for, then, perhaps, that would be the only point against it when comparing vs other models you may be considering.
That being said, the system I auditioned in had zero care towards power supply/noise isolation and ran ‘no sub’, and using some B&W studio monitors well placed in the room, the ‘low bass note’ reach and drive was a MASSIVE STEP UP vs every other DAC auditioned, and I couldn’t imagine wanting more.
The quality of the bass was fantastic, and very natural, with plenty of resolve and push… with the proper texture that bass frequencies should have (that WILL NOT BE FOUND in the units that ‘out bass resolve’ at this price point, using ‘budget’ designs).

Given what you listed were you ‘wants’ this is the checklist item that should be at the top of your shortlist I’d warrant.
I cannot believe these DACs haven’t suffered a price increase or ‘redesign’ to save cost given the last couple of years of retail hardship.

Bargains….

 

[George Hincapie]

I was just about to pull the trigger on this, then realised it has no AES in. How annoying! The Pontus has it, but so much more expensive. Oh well, back to the drawing board...

 

[George Hincapie]

I cannot believe these DACs haven’t suffered a price increase or ‘redesign’ to save cost given the last couple of years of retail hardship.

Bargains….

Just means the margin in them, like most things in this hobby, is insane.

 

[sajunky]

I was just about to pull the trigger on this, then realised it has no AES in. How annoying! The Pontus has it, but so much more expensive. Oh well, back to the drawing board...

Audio GD R-1 has, also I2S and its outputs can be driven simultaneously, $900.

Oh, forgotten... It is a true balaned design, two ladder decoders per channel, not a single one.

 

[roderickvd]

Having double the arrays is a good thing. So is I2S (hopefully without reclocking so better external clocks on DDCs are actually meaningful?)

Still, I can’t get excited from these measurements: https://alpha-audio.net/review/multitest-the-best-dac-for-1000-euros/2. Distortion is mainly on uneven harmonics, dynamic range is around 14 bit and the roll-off on the NOS doesn’t look right. There is aliasing but with some very steep dips and not how NOS should roll off both in theory and practice.

You may not care if this is a great sounding DAC but without having heard it this is what raises a bit of an eyebrow with me.