[theveterans]

^ A well established recording studio still probably use the Yamaha NS-10M rather than the newer HS7 or HS8. Well, the HS7 (stock) doesn't sound like a flat response studio monitor to me as it sounds like a great sounding bookshelf speaker rather than sterile flat sounding studio monitor. All I can say with the HS7's stock woofer is that it doesn't sound lousy in anyway and is very quick and tight, but don't expect a chair/sofa vibrating bass quantity to it though.

 

[Pharmaboy]

I'm encouraged by your comments about the HS7 sounding good. As far as bass, as long as the HS7's woofers are tight, accurate down to 80 Hz or so (all the really challenging frequencies are below that--requiring tons of power), I'll be fine, since I cross over the SVS SB1000 below 80Hz. And when I finally get around to installing my Marchand XM66 crossover (variable frequency), I'll be able to nudge that crossover frequency down or up to where the system sounds best overall.

Since you own the HS7's and are familiar w/them sonically & operationally, I have a question. Occasional user comments about the HS series mention that they're completely unshieided (magnetically, EMI, etc)...some say they pickup and amplify EMI from cellphones, nearby computers, routers, etc. That's a real concern for me due to constrained space on desktop (the rt. monitor will be ~10" from a desktop/tower).

Have you found interference to be an issue w/your HS7's?

 

[theveterans]

I'm encouraged by your comments about the HS7 sounding good. As far as bass, as long as the HS7's woofers are tight, accurate down to 80 Hz or so (all the really challenging frequencies are below that--requiring tons of power), I'll be fine, since I cross over the SVS SB1000 below 80Hz. And when I finally get around to installing my Marchand XM66 crossover (variable frequency), I'll be able to nudge that crossover frequency down or up to where the system sounds best overall.

Since you own the HS7's and are familiar w/them sonically & operationally, I have a question. Occasional user comments about the HS series mention that they're completely unshieided (magnetically, EMI, etc)...some say they pickup and amplify EMI from cellphones, nearby computers, routers, etc. That's a real concern for me due to constrained space on desktop (the rt. monitor will be ~10" from a desktop/tower).

Have you found interference to be an issue w/your HS7's?

80Hz accuracy should be fine. IMO, it rolls off starting around 40Hz though 35Hz is probably about -3 or -4 db down from flat. 30 Hz is about -7 to -10db based on my hearing as I don't have a microphone and equipment to test.

About the user comments, no I only hear EMI when I am ONLY sending SMS from my iPhone. This is only induced when my iPhone is 2 feet away or less. Beyond that, no ill effects. LTE bands, Bluetooth 3.0 or 4.0 (I use a Bluetooth mouse) and WiFi (both 2.4 and 5 GHz bands) have no effects with the HS7s. Haven't tested 3G though since I am covered with LTE in my area. No noise induced from my computer though even though it's only 1.5 feet away from the HS7.

 

[Pharmaboy]

@theveterans, you're making my day here! I really appreciate this information...

I was kinda worried about EMI. Previously I'd worried about using adapters to connect my unbalanced cables to these monitors, but decided to make that worry go away by getting a quality unbalanced-to-balanced converter (Aphex 124A) + balanced cables. But when it came to EMI, I didn't have any real workarounds.

BTW, what does "SMS" mean? (I don't know diddly about cellphones)

 

[theveterans]

@theveterans, you're making my day here! I really appreciate this information...

I was kinda worried about EMI. Previously I'd worried about using adapters to connect my unbalanced cables to these monitors, but decided to make that worry go away by getting a quality unbalanced-to-balanced converter (Aphex 124A) + balanced cables. But when it came to EMI, I didn't have any real workarounds.

BTW, what does "SMS" mean? (I don't know diddly about cellphones)

I completely run mine unbalanced from a cheap RCA cable from Livewire (RCA to 1/4" TS cable) as the HS7 accepts unbalanced inputs anyways. I don't know if going balanced will remove EMI if the speakers themselves aren't shielded like you mentioned.

Here's SMS from Wikipedia. TLDR: it's your messaging app in your phone that doesn't need internet access.

"Short Message Service (SMS) is a text messaging service component of most telephone, World Wide Web, and mobile telephony systems.[1][1] It uses standardized communication protocols to enable mobile phone devices to exchange short text messages. An intermediary service can facilitate a text-to-voice conversion to be sent to landlines.[2] SMS was the most widely used data application, with an estimated 3.5 billion active users, or about 80% of all mobile phone subscribers, at the end of 2010.[1]"


PS:

When you receive the HS7, burn them it as the tonality sounded like a cheap speaker at the first 50-100 hours. After that, you will be awestruck on how amazing vocals and mids sound like on it (at least it did for me). The mids are better than any headphones and IEMs I've tried, including AKG K712 Pro, Campfire Audio Vega, Bowers and Wilkins P9, Sennheiser HD800 and Grado GS1000

 

[Pharmaboy]

Texting! It's something I don't know how to do, can't seem to learn to do--but everybody else in the known world does constantly, including while on the toilet or behind the wheel.

I am a "digital neanderthal." My wife forced me to carry a cellphone while driving (presumably so whoever pries me out of the wreckage w/"The Jaws of Life" can notify my next-of-kin...who, yes, my wife). It's a flip-phone. I think it was cutting edge when Miami Vice was still on TV.

Re balanced vs unbalanced, once again, occasional user comments about the HS series said they sounded bad w/unbalanced in, and the Yamaha manual is pretty clear that balanced is what they intended. So I took care of it as described in last post. But if you're getting good sound out of a cheap RCA-to-TS cable, hat's off to you.

And yes, I plan burn-in just as you describe. I'll probably get flamed for mentioning this, but literally everything in audio/desktop audio (speakers, DACs, headphones, amps, even HP cables) seems to benefit from fairly long burn-in. Somebody will jump in and inform me I'm delusional because it's impossible burn-in would have any effect. Regardless, that's what I hear.

 

[theveterans]

"Re balanced vs unbalanced, once again, occasional user comments about the HS series said they sounded bad w/unbalanced in, and the Yamaha manual is pretty clear that balanced is what they intended. So I took care of it as described in last post. But if you're getting good sound out of a cheap RCA-to-TS cable, hat's off to you."

That's weird. I've heard it out of Balanced connection from a Focusrite audio interface (don't know what model) from the brick-and-mortar store where I demoed it before purchasing and IMO my current audio chain sounded much better in SE. Then again, to make sure you're getting the best out of it, going balanced is a no brainer.

PS
As for being a digital neanderthal, I'm in the generation Y group so yeah I'm part of the "can't live life without a smartphone" demographic.

 

[Pharmaboy]

"Re balanced vs unbalanced, once again, occasional user comments about the HS series said they sounded bad w/unbalanced in, and the Yamaha manual is pretty clear that balanced is what they intended. So I took care of it as described in last post. But if you're getting good sound out of a cheap RCA-to-TS cable, hat's off to you."

That's weird. I've heard it out of Balanced connection from a Focusrite audio interface (don't know what model) from the brick-and-mortar store where I demoed it before purchasing and IMO my current audio chain sounded much better in SE. Then again, to make sure you're getting the best out of it, going balanced is a no brainer.

PS
As for being a digital neanderthal, I'm in the generation Y group so yeah I'm part of the "can't live life without a smartphone" demographic.

Not surprising, really. That focusrite interface almost certainly has a built-in DAC that may/may not sound as good as yours. There's also circuitry in it to convert unbalanced to balanced (and the reverse). Depending on how good that circuitry is (high-grade transformers or opamps) or how poor it is (low grade transformers or opamps), that's another factor that could influence sound. The default connection & interconnect in pro studios being 100% balanced, I'm not sure that interface mfrs put lots of time & $$ into their conversion circuitry (though I could be wrong).

I tested my unbalanced-to-balanced chain very briefly: ie, my then-DAC, Audio GD NOS 19; to the Aphex 124A unbalanced-to-balanced converter; output via top quality balanced cables, to balanced input of Violectric V281)--just to make sure this converter I bought used on ebay is working OK (it is).

I'm quite familiar w/the sound of this same chain, sans the Aphex converter & w/a high quality RCA interconnect between DAC & unbalanced input of V281. This balanced version of the chain sounded just fine. So I'm reasonable sure it will sound OK on the Yamaha's.

PS: I'm not just a digital neanderthal because I'm a boomer, resistant to change, blah-blah. Fact is, I can barely see/read anything on cellphone screens. Even on the larger phones in use now, actually reading text (in documents, text msgs, etc) is challenging--lots of squinting, using highest-power reading glasses, etc. My vision started changing 15 yrs ago or so (it's called "presbyopia"--happens to everyone w/age)...so I just never formed the cellphone habit.

 

[riderx1]

My experience with soundcards is terrible compared to DACs.

 

[vipervick]

I'm not into powered monitors. I have a spare flagship AVR which will run bookshelves and a sub no problem. The Schiit Modi should be good enough DAC for now, eh?

 

[vipervick]

How well does an AVR like the TX-NR 5007 do as a headphone amp? Because I shouldn't need a separate amp if the DAC is going to the receiver, right?

 

[Pharmaboy]

How well does an AVR like the TX-NR 5007 do as a headphone amp? Because I shouldn't need a separate amp if the DAC is going to the receiver, right?

I just looked up the specs on your Onkyo AVR. Not a word about power output or design--just 2 words, "Headphone jack."

I always found Onkyo gear to sound pretty good, a definite bump from run-of-the-mill receivers. Regardless, even the best receivers don't put a lot of design effort or parts' cost in the headphone output. Usually it's a simple IC, op-amp, or something similar. Power ratings, if any are even stated, are usually on the low side.

My experience with headphone amplification is that sooner or later, if you really want the best your headphones can give, you have to step up to either a well designed separate HP amp, or an amp/DAC combination like the ones Audio GD has made for years. My first serious/good headphone was the Fidelio X2, and I really didn't hear what it could do until I upgraded from a FiiO E10K to a well-design, stand-alone amp: the Lake People G109-A. It was a revelation; the difference in sound quality was huge--a different world. And this was before I got a planar (ZMF Ori), which wants/needs serious power to sound its best.

It would be a terrific piece of luck if your AVR was the exception and had a great headphone circuit. But something tells me you're not that lucky.

This discussion is only partly about $$ (there are really fine-sounding HP amps that cost <$500, some quite a bit less. It all comes down to function--an amp that's designed expressly for headphones is (IMHO) always the way to go...

 

[Pharmaboy]

Well, there have been developments re my ZenPro Modded Yamaha HS7's:

• They arrived yesterday, exactly on schedule, a mere 3 days after ordering them
• Dealing with Warren, owner of ZenPro, has been far above average in every way (a very good buying experience so far)
• They were exceedingly well boxed...and now that they're unboxed, these things are flat out beautiful to my eyes. Yeah, I know--sound counts/looks don't, but I like looking at them.

I have them set up to burn in for ~100 hrs using my unbalanced-to-balanced converter box (Alpha 124A) w/spare audio components. Bizarrely, I have it this set up in a largely empty 3-car garage attached to the house. The HS7's are on the far/opposite wall from the house; when I enter the garage via the connected hallway, I have to walk nearly ~35 feet to reach them. It's hard to imagine a less promising "sonic environment" for powered monitors.

Despite all that, they actually sound pretty fine, which surprises me. Interestingly, they sound good the whole time I'm walking toward them, but when I get w/in 4-5 feet, suddenly the sound "locks in" as I enter the soundfield. They're not even spaced optimally (just 1-2 ft apart, sitting on a big workbench). But there clearly is a soundfield. These are obviously designed as nearfield monitors (something I knew, but interesting to have it demonstrated so clearly). Hard to really figure out how they sound, given the huge space they're in. But I can already hear a few trends:

1. The bass is really quite good. I'll use a sub below ~60-70 dB in home office, but even w/o a sub, the bass is pleasing--tuneful with a nice rounded quality. Not the ultra-dry solid-state bass I was 1/2-expecting.
2. Treble sounds accurate but not peaky or fatiguing. Again, the real test will come when they're in home office, but I'm not hearing problems in the treble at this point.
3. Midrange is the big suprise--there's a lot of musical information coming out of the midrange, way more than I'm used to from my decent but not exceptional powered speakers (Swan M200 MKIIIs). And the midrange sounds quite good--not edgy or forced.
4. I started burning them in w/24 hrs of classical music (symphonies for 12 hrs, then massed choral works + orchestra for next 12). Volume is moderate, and the music sounds quite nice. I just changed over to reggae at a slightly higher volume, and damned if that doesn't sound really good. Actually found myself boogying a little to the music (in my garage).

So far, so good. These are the first "professional" powered monitors I've heard. I worried that they would be lifeless, flat to the point of annoying, and not "musical." But so far, that's not the case at all...

Impossible to draw real conclusions about sound, given how big the physical environment is in garage vs my 13' X 15' home office. Then there's the fact that the key electronics I'll be using in home office (Violectric V281 as amp/preamp; Audio GD DAC-19 or NOS-19 DACs) are light years better than my temp system in the garage (a 30 year old modded Phillips CD player + passive volume controller).

I'll rotate the HS7's into home office system this Wed. More comments to follow. But at this point, I'm encouraged...

 

[vipervick]

Here's pics of the desk.

 

[Pharmaboy]

Here's pics of the desk.

Awesome chair! And a nice, calm-looking office environment. Those monitors must be pretty large...they make other components look miniature.

I'll have to post pictures of my home office--need to borrow a cellphone ( + the person who knows how to take pictures w/it!)