[mevans]

Hi--
 
By way of introduction my name is Mark Evans.  I'm 66 years old, a retired U.S. government lawyer, and live in a suburb of D.C.  I just discovered your website and look forward to digesting at least some of the vast knowledge and experience shared.  Brooko's reviews are remarkable.
 
I have been listening to HD580s for many years.  In fact, I have two sets, one in listening/poker room/man cave, and one in bed.  I have always found them to be fantastic but never done any serious comparing with other sets.  I recently found myself with too much disposable income and bought a set of HD700s on eBay sight unseen.  Figured I would upgrade right past the 600/650 models, also untested.  Maybe a mistake.  I've only had the 700s a few days and am still getting used to them, but I see problems.  Forgive lack of appropriate audio jargon from this novice, but these phones strike me as too bright for my taste.  The problem appears worse at times (blaring brass, for example).  When grating, I need to turn down volume to continue listening.  I'm leaning toward selling these phones but wish to listen further before making a commitment.  If I were to sell or trade, I might consider buying the HD600 or HD650.  I have read tons of reviews of these two phones on this and other sites,  Here are my questions?  Given my apparent sensitivity to brightness, which of the 600 or 650 would be better suited to me?  Or, are both of these models sufficiently close to the 580s to forget the whole project.  Also, comfort is very important to me and I think I saw somewhere that both 600 and 650 have a tighter clamp than 580.  If this is true and if 600 and 650 not compensated by significantly better sound, then I think I would sit tight with my 580s.
 
If I do decide to buy or trade, I would hope to be able to use that feature of your board.

 

[Brooko]

Hi Mark
 
Welcome.  Yep - you're talking about the HD700's treble issues.  They aren't there all the time, but on certain music I found the same thing.  Not sure if you saw this - but it might also help:
 
http://www.head-fi.org/t/725127/comparison-review-a-tale-of-two-sennheisers-hd600-vs-hd700
 
If you already have the HD580 and look for something a just little different (warmer, lusher and a bit more resolving) then I'd definitely suggest the HD650.  Do you have anywhere you can go try them first though?  Also - what will your source/amp be?

 

[mattnad]

The best way to find out for yourself is to trial a pair.  The 600s are very close to the 580s - they were essentially the same set of cans back in the day, although modern 600s might have materially different drivers now.  If you're going to try something different from the 580s, I'd go for the 650s and see if you like them.  If you you pick up a pair from a store that permits trials or returns (Amazon), you can return them if you don't like them.
 
As an aside, a higher model number doesn't always mean "better".  It means "different", and sometimes it can mean upgraded (the 600s had fancier aesthetics than the 580s).

 

[mevans]

Thanks, guys.  I realize now that my mistake was not trying out the 700s before buying them.  I honestly don't know whether there are dealers in this area that carry and allow auditioning of Sennheiser headphones.  I'll check around.
 
So far as power source, and I recognize that this is sacrilege among serious audiophiles, I'm using the headphone jack of my Adcom GFP-710 preamp.  It seems to provide clarity at all reasonable listening levels.  Which reminds me, I also have a Presonus HP4 distribution amp (with 4 headphone jacks) that I bought so that friends could enjoy listening through headphones along with me.  Should I presume that the Presonus does not offer the quality performance of headphone amps designed for audiophile systems?
 
Thanks for all the help.

 

[mattnad]

Using a headphone jack on decent hardware is not sacrilege to me. The Melos SHA-1 was as much a pre-amp as a headphone amp and highly prized. I personally used my McIntosh preamp for years and it was great. Yeah people can get into the details, but quality hardware is quality hardware.

 

[mevans]

I did some quick checking and think it unlikely that I will be able to audition any of the high-end Sennheiser phones conveniently.
 
At this point, I think I will continue to listen to my 700s to see if my ears ever get accustomed to their brightness.  If not, I will likely try to sell to a nearby stereo shop or repair facility.
 
By the way, in one of these threads I recall a member from northern Virginia.  I'm in Falls Church, so if you're reading this and want to catch up for a beer, drop me a line.
 
Mark
 
[Mod Edit - removed email link - best to contact by PM, then share email addresses there ]

 

[MorrisL]

  I also have a Presonus HP4 distribution amp (with 4 headphone jacks) that I bought so that friends could enjoy listening through headphones along with me.  Should I presume that the Presonus does not offer the quality performance of headphone amps designed for audiophile systems?
 
Thanks for all the help.

I have Presonus HP4 too, and I think it's really quiet and plenty loud for serious listening. I keep asking people here for feedback but no one wants to speak about it. That amp is incredibly versatile and sounds high quality to me... I don't understand why everyone is so tight-lipped about it here.

 

[mevans]

Update:  I've made a tentative decision to keep my HD700s.  They seem to work great with most music.  For example, just beautiful with Sheffield Lab's Let it Go by Clair Marlo.  I've got the gold disc but, to be honest, not sure I could distinguish in blind test with original issue.
I'm using headphone jack on Adcom preamp (GFP-710) which is clear as a bell and plenty loud, but Presonus works well too.
 
By contrast, 700s not so great with Sinatra at the Sands, a wonderful live concert for those unfamiliar.  But, maybe recorded 'brighter' because parts almost unlistenable.  For Frank, and similar recordings, I've got my 580s.  Even there, brightness is off-putting but not so noticeable as with the 700s.

 

[mevans]

One final (?) point:  I don't know how many reviews I've read on internet or watched on YouTube that claim the HD700s are the most comfortable headphones available.  Not so.  I've listened to a grand total of maybe 5 different phones in my entire life and the 700s don't even top that list.  The HD580s are more comfortable, largely because of the greater cushioning in the ear pads. 

 

[AudioCans]

Fantastic review Brooko. This review and other reviews from both yourself and other people gave me the confidence to buy the HD600's. I did try auditioning various phones, including various Sennheiser, Grado's and others that were generally more expensive; the problem is I was auditioning in the shop using different equipment and felt confused with all the sources and amps. One thing struck me at the time though was the quality of the HD600' and 650's for a reasonable cost, moving up the scale I thought that it was a case of ever diminishing returns, especially when being told I would be better with the HD800s, but would need the Senn amp to really get the best out of them, the thought of spending the best part of £2K on headphones and amp made me shudder, so I left saying I would have to think about it.
 
I have only had them just over a week, but the sound quality has been excellent straight from the box. I wanted some good phones for use when I can't play through speakers, and equally wanted something that would not sound to different to them. I have some ATC SCM19 monitors and it is amazing how they sound so similar with most music to the HD600's. at present I am only connecting the to a TEAC UD-H01 DAC, as I do not want to jump straight into a dedicated headphone amp until I have a much better idea of what will work best for them, I see no real need to spend fortunes on an amp that would totally outclass the HD600's.
 
I listen a wide variety of music from Laura Marling, Joni Mitchell, Sara K, to Dire Straits, Mike Oldfield, Keb Mo, Roger Walters. Jazz, Blues, some country, rock, classical; almost anything really, well once anyway. The HD600's seem to work well with most of what I have listened to with them in the short time I've had them.
 
Regarding burn in, I am going to leave them for several hours connected to my PC playing the Tellurium Q test track 2, this definitely worked when used to burn in my speakers and speaker cable, so it will interesting if I notice any difference with the phones.
 
Once again thank you for the review and unknowingly helping me to decide.

 

[potterpastor]

I have both the 600 and the 650. The 650 is warmer sounding. Plugged into my Yamaha RX479 receiver, listening to Tidal, I prefer the 650's lush, lovely, and dynamic sound. It's the way I want my music to sound, it just sounds right to me.For the same reason, I like the original Momentum plugged into my iPad or iPhone, it's got that same type of sound that I love. I have the Momentum 2.0, and I find that headphone to be shouty and forward in the mid range.

With my Valhalla 2, the 650 sounds softer, and I find that my 600 is more dynamic and punchy.

So depending on the equipment I am using, I gravitate toward one or the other.

I should say that my Hifiman HE400 S sounds clearer than both. Sometimes I reach for that because I love the clarity, and sometimes I reach for the 650 when I just want to get lost in the music.

 

[Skullbox]

Hi Paul! Thanks for the great helpfull review!

I've read almost everything. I'm still hesitating between those two though. Which one would you recommend with using my FiiO X3ii. (Adding E12a or E17k if required)

I mainly listen to: Vocal jazz, (female), soft rock, R&B, alternative, accoustic, (piano/guitar) electronica music genres. It willbe my first serious HP.

Thank!

 

[Brooko]

There really isn't a lot of difference between the two. The HD650 are a little warmer, bassier, and a little more lush in the vocals. The HD600 have always (to me) sounded a little more natural, and a little brighter.

For my personal tastes, the HD600 is my pick - but I could cheerfully live with the HD650 if I had it. Both are simply wonderful headphones.

 

[Skullbox]

There really isn't a lot of difference between the two. The HD650 are a little warmer, bassier, and a little more lush in the vocals. The HD600 have always (to me) sounded a little more natural, and a little brighter.

For my personal tastes, the HD600 is my pick - but I could cheerfully live with the HD650 if I had it. Both are simply wonderful headphones.

Yep, but with female jazz vocale, accoustic, alternative... what your pick ?

 

[Brooko]

Yep, but with female jazz vocale, accoustic, alternative... what your pick ?

 
That depends on your preference 

.  Personally I think the HD600 is more realistic - especially with acoustic instruments. Its also cheaper (although I can't really fathom why).  I'd say go with the HD600.