[Malcyg]

If switching between external headphone amp and speakers, wouldn’t it make sense to leave headphone adapter in there so crossfeed settings show? Or would that cause issue with speakers or some other setting not to show?

If you have anything plugged into the headphone jack, it disables all other outputs. That’s kind of the point of previous comments really.

I don’t find there is a universal setting for XFeed. It depends upon the music, which is another reason I was hoping Roon could be a quick, on the fly solution. Some music sounds better with it off whilst other music sounds better with it on and at different levels. As a very general rule, I find that the older the recording, the higher the level of crossfeed I might use.

 

[iDesign]

Except that what you lose with engaged crossfeed with your headphones you also lose with speakers without crossfeed (low-frequency channel separation), so this conjecture is illegitimate. What some might prefer, though, is the artificial widening of the soundstage at low frequencies through headphones during the reproduction of speaker-based recordings – and the sense of increased detail (true in some sense, although as mentioned it's artificial).

You’re missing the point that it’s not just simply about sound stage.

 

[iamoneagain]

I suspect individual preferences for the cross feed have more to do with our perception of sound and the music genre(s) than the headphone itself. For example, the Utopia has a small soundstage so based on your post activating the cross feed should help in that regard. But as @iamoneagain writes, he finds it more “engaging” with the cross feed off. And I’ll make a good bet that as a listener he also appreciates the nuances of the sound engineer’s L/R mix and you lose that with the cross feed. Thats one of the reasons I prefer it off.

I feel like I lose the precision of the Utopia. Everything is so crystal clear with Crossfeed off. It’s more like you’re in the studio or at the front of the stage. And when I was younger that’s how I preferred my live shows. Go to small clubs and get right up against the stage. I also grew up listening to headphones and most my music listening has been thru headphones. Never had a nice speaker setup and current living situation doesn’t allow for it spacewise or financially.

 

[iamoneagain]

If you have anything plugged into the headphone jack, it disables all other outputs. That’s kind of the point of previous comments really.

I don’t find there is a universal setting for XFeed. It depends upon the music, which is another reason I was hoping Roon could be a quick, on the fly solution. Some music sounds better with it off whilst other music sounds better with it on and at different levels. As a very general rule, I find that the older the recording, the higher the level of crossfeed I might use.

I guess the best you can do is just play around with the setting and then can save as different dsp presets. Looks like there’s a bunch of posting about Crossfeed in the roon forum. Haven’t gone then them so not sure if will offer any help.

 

[JaZZ]

You’re missing the point that it’s not just simply about sound stage.

I don't think so. You were talking of the missing nuances of the sound engineer’s L/R mix with crossfeed, and I say all you lose is the artificial component of these nuances, which would also get «lost» through speakers. BTW, the mentioned L/R mix (also called stereo effect) is one of the two most important components of soundstage.

 

[JamieMcC]

Crossfeed definitely not for me with my current phones hd800 (SDR Mod).

 

[CRITICALSHOT]

Rob Watts said:
Normally it should be on.
But with Blu 2 it sounds better off.
Don't ask me why, as it is too complicated to explain; but in short it was lessons learned when the HF filter was improving the SQ with 44.1 kHz, when it should have had no change to the SQ.
Rob

 

[PhenixS1970]

Hi All, not in the market section yet but I'm letting go of my Chord Electronics Etude amplifier, black and in mint condition (purchased May, 21 2019). EU buyers only. Feel free to drop me a message if you are interested in a DAVE - ETUDE wedding .

 

[DaveRedRef-III]

I have to agree with Criticalshot (and others) that when using Blu MkII M Scaler and Dave together the sound is better with the HF Filter 'off'. Even for hi res files imo. The filter may sound warmer when 'on' but it affects dynamic speed and frequency band in the lower mids. A simple test is to find a good vocal recording that places the vocalist in your room. With the HF filter set to off, the vocal sounds more dynamic, solid and natural in the lower mids.

I have tested this with a good number of vocal recordings now and the result is consistent to my ears.

 

[iamoneagain]

I have to agree with Criticalshot (and others) that when using Blu MkII M Scaler and Dave together the sound is better with the HF Filter 'off'. Even for hi res files imo. The filter may sound warmer when 'on' but it affects dynamic speed and frequency band in the lower mids. A simple test is to find a good vocal recording that places the vocalist in your room. With the HF filter set to off, the vocal sounds more dynamic, solid and natural in the lower mids.

I have tested this with a good number of vocal recordings now and the result is consistent to my ears.

I’m now completely sold on having the filter off with mscaler with my current setup. Not finding any thinness or missing warmth. As said in prior post I’m powering the mscaler with Poweradd battery at 16v and this bring subtles change where no harshness to highs and fuller sound than stock power supply. It really does sound like a veil is lifted when you turn the HF filter off. The highs now shimmer and sparkle where sound a little dull in direct comparison.

Please aware using battery at 16v brings risk since recommended a 15v but has mscaler breaker at 18v and Poweradd pro 5 outputs very close to 16v when at that setting. If use 12v, music has less energy and highs seem less extended. Doesn’t sound as good as stock power supply.

 

[ubs28]

I feel like I lose the precision of the Utopia. Everything is so crystal clear with Crossfeed off. It’s more like you’re in the studio or at the front of the stage. And when I was younger that’s how I preferred my live shows. Go to small clubs and get right up against the stage. I also grew up listening to headphones and most my music listening has been thru headphones. Never had a nice speaker setup and current living situation doesn’t allow for it spacewise or financially.

Some headphones do benefit from crossfeed, such as the AFC 2.

 

[Triode User]

I’m now completely sold on having the filter off with mscaler with my current setup. Not finding any thinness or missing warmth. As said in prior post I’m powering the mscaler with Poweradd battery at 16v and this bring subtles change where no harshness to highs and fuller sound than stock power supply. It really does sound like a veil is lifted when you turn the HF filter off. The highs now shimmer and sparkle where sound a little dull in direct comparison.

Please aware using battery at 16v brings risk since recommended a 15v but has mscaler breaker at 18v and Poweradd pro 5 outputs very close to 16v when at that setting. If use 12v, music has less energy and highs seem less extended. Doesn’t sound as good as stock power supply.

I cannot quite come to terms with a preference for 16v compared to 12v feeding the Mscaler from the PowerAdd especially when it is accompanied with descriptive comments suggesting more energy and more extended highs with the higher voltage. The mscaler is only number crunching so the described sound attributes introduce the concept of added noise somehow, perhaps in the switching circuit for the higher voltage or perhaps the higher voltage gives the noise more energy and so the ensuing distortion is also greater and more audible? Just thinking aloud and musing rather than anything else.

 

[iamoneagain]

I cannot quite come to terms with a preference for 16v compared to 12v feeding the Mscaler from the PowerAdd especially when it is accompanied with descriptive comments suggesting more energy and more extended highs with the higher voltage. The mscaler is only number crunching so the described sound attributes introduce the concept of added noise somehow, perhaps in the switching circuit for the higher voltage or perhaps the higher voltage gives the noise more energy and so the ensuing distortion is also greater and more audible? Just thinking aloud and musing rather than anything else.

So you think might be more noise? I just tested again and there is a difference at 16v vs 12v. I’ll give 12v a longer listen with HF off. That does have the effect I’ve heard mentioned of darker sounding but might take some getting use to. Think I ended up preferring 16v since sounded closer to stock power supply and that was sound I was used to. Also dark sound with HF on was not to my liking.

 

[Triode User]

So you think might be more noise? I just tested again and there is a difference at 16v vs 12v. I’ll give 12v a longer listen with HF off. That does have the effect I’ve heard mentioned of darker sounding but might take some getting use to. Think I ended up preferring 16v since sounded closer to stock power supply and that was sound I was used to. Also dark sound with HF on was not to my liking.

It is an easy trap to fall into of thinking that a sound has more 'life' or an 'enhanced sound stage' and that it is better when in reality it is just more noise artifacts that are being heard. With digital signals by and large the darker sound is always more accurate and truer to the music in the digital signal. My best power supply for the Mscaler can initially sound rather flat or lifeless compared to some others but after a while I realise that the other supplies just had more noise artifacts and there is more real detail when using the better power supply.

I may be wrong because there is a lot of YMMV in this but @Rob Watts continually says something similar to what I am saying regarding the perils of changing something and thinking that the change is better when all that one has really done is to add in more noise artifacts.

 

[iamoneagain]

It is an easy trap to fall into of thinking that a sound has more 'life' or an 'enhanced sound stage' and that it is better when in reality it is just more noise artifacts that are being heard. With digital signals by and large the darker sound is always more accurate and truer to the music in the digital signal. My best power supply for the Mscaler can initially sound rather flat or lifeless compared to some others but after a while I realise that the other supplies just had more noise artifacts and there is more real detail when using the better power supply.

I may be wrong because there is a lot of YMMV in this but @Rob Watts continually says something similar to what I am saying regarding the perils of changing something and thinking that the change is better when all that one has really done is to add in more noise artifacts.

Well so for I’m liking what I’m hearing. So currently settled on 12v Poweradd with HF off and no crossfeed. For some music, crossfeed 1 seems to sound better but need more time with it to make sure.