[agisthos]

Rob what sort of compromises were made to fit the Chord casework. DAVE is much better than Hugo, but I imagine it's still not an engineers paradise to make things fit.
 
Probably a touchy question, because I am basically asking what performance was left on the table. Or maybe there was none left on table, just extra hard work on that PCB layout...

 

[paulchiu]

Thanks. I'll get that loan Alpha Analogue back and stop bothering you. Cheers

 
Hi Steve,
 
It's no bother at all.  Enjoy the adventure.  
 
Paul

 

[x RELIC x]

Rob what sort of compromises were made to fit the Chord casework. DAVE is much better than Hugo, but I imagine it's still not an engineers paradise to make things fit.

Probably a touchy question, because I am basically asking what performance was left on the table. Or maybe there was none left on table, just extra hard work on that PCB layout...

I'm not there that there were any.....

http://www.head-fi.org/t/766517/chord-electronics-dave/1650#post_12341081

On price with Dave it was fairly simple. I designed Dave to suit a sound quality and a performance goal - my own targets, not something Chord was setting. There was no price point set or determined - everything was engineering driven. Once the design was finished, Chord added up the BOM, used their usual multipliers, and that was the price.

But I have just gotten back on a small press and dealers trip, and that was interesting. We popped into a dealer who had sold a few Mojo's, and we had a few hours spare. He was a tube/vinyl very high end dealer and I happened to have a Dave in my bag (I hand carry Dave with me on my travels for music in the hotel). So we listened to it, and we got the same reaction you had - every piece of music was spine tingling good - even 1960's Rolling Stones. The dealer said he had never heard digital ever sound like that - indeed, he said it was actually better than his beloved vinyl!

So pretty chuffed by that, we went onto the next meeting with a dealer that stocks Dave, whereupon we were told in no uncertain terms that Dave was just way too cheap. He claimed that nobody will compare a Dave at $13k against a $50k DAC, that to say Dave was better was ridiculous as the price was wrong. It can sound better, measure better, that just didn't matter as the price was wrong, and everybody measures by price. Telling this to an engineering driven company (John was with me) was, shall we say - somewhat disheartening. Ho hum.

On another issue - you mention some high res recordings - now my experience of hi res is mixed. Sometimes it can sound much worse, usually a bit better than redbook, sometimes it can sound extraordinary. What are your best recordings that work sonically and musically?

Thanks Rob

 

[agisthos]

I'm not there that there were any.....

http://www.head-fi.org/t/766517/chord-electronics-dave/1650#post_12341081

 
Rob is obviously talking about components cost there. I am talking about PCB layout and placement. I'm sure he would prefer to design a DAC for a 44cm wide case and have the luxury of full size boards.

 

[x RELIC x]

Rob is obviously talking about components cost there. I am talking about PCB layout and placement. I'm sure he would prefer to design a DAC for a 44cm wide case and have the luxury of full size boards.

I'm not so sure. As you can see Chord has many different sized components from tall to thick and thin. The DAVE itself could easily be larger given its footprint within the accompanying stand. Doesn't look to me like the design was restricted. Of course I'm interested in the feedback from Rob as well on this, but to me it seems he like he drove the design for SQ over anything else.

 

[Rob Watts]

The short answer is small is beautiful - small gives better RF filtering, shorter path lengths, better vibration control with everything clamped onto a solid aluminium block.
 
So I can't recall any compromises needed to suit the chassis size.
 
Rob

 

[Sunya]

My power amp is VAC 450 iQ. I love them to death. I will not swap them with other power amps. Maybe until Rob comes out with the digital power amp...

 
Given the high gain of the 450iQs, at what level do you usually have DAVE's VC?

 

[EVOLVIST]

You know, I was thinking, I can understand the DAVE being the price that it is, but for the life of me I cannot wrap my head around the stand being that much. I could have a custom stand made for a fraction of the price. Though pleasing to the eye, that is a lot of scratch.

Observation/vent over.

Waiting for the DAVE to get here.

 

[Toolman]

Anyone think the DAVE stand/rack made it difficult to plug your headphone cables in?

 

[Christer]

You know, I was thinking, I can understand the DAVE being the price that it is, but for the life of me I cannot wrap my head around the stand being that much. I could have a custom stand made for a fraction of the price. Though pleasing to the eye, that is a lot of scratch.

Observation/vent over.

Waiting for the DAVE to get here.

I still think DAVE is firmly  in the "silly" price range especially  taking  the recent discussion not exactly denied by Chord of the relative  SQ differences between their DACs Mojo,Hugo and DAVE into account.  And frankly as far as the  absolutelty ridiculously priced ,stand is concerned a bag of lentils or rice will do the same job for a far more reasonable price than most such products aimed more at  vanity than any real SQ benefits at all.
Brown rice is healthier than white but will do exactly the same excellent job as brown rice used  as a "beanbag".
PS. Hope you will enjoy your DAVE once you get it.

 

[Mojo ideas]

You know, I was thinking, I can understand the DAVE being the price that it is, but for the life of me I cannot wrap my head around the stand being that much. I could have a custom stand made for a fraction of the price. Though pleasing to the eye, that is a lot of scratch.

Observation/vent over.

Waiting for the DAVE to get here.

Please try to understand the retail price. It comprises of manufacturing costs and profit, retailers and distributors margins. I can confirm to you all that we at Chord Electronics use the same costs and margin factors across everything we make and sell. So if something appears expensive it genuinely is expensive to manufacture. You might look at the stand and think you could get it made for half the price. Well I doubt you really could design then make it in relatively small volumes to the quality standards we apply then market and distribute it world wide. So I ask you look hard at the stand as it's an absolute bargain at the price it is as big chunks of precision machines aircraft grade HE 9 aluminium are far from inexpensive. Sorry to sound as I do in this but comments like those made about our pricing are so inaccurate that I felt it necessary to chip in.

 

[smial1966]

Having owned a Chord Hugo, Hugo TT, Mojo and most recently DAVE, I can categorically state that the sonic performance of my latest acquisition easily trounces the aforementioned. Having purchased a number of well regarded DACs (Metrum Hex, Ayre Codex, Goldmund Telos) I can authoritively endorse the thread comments others have made regarding the sublime intricacy and lifelike reproductive qualities of DAVE. I always aspire to create a 'live' experience with my headamp/DAC setup and with a good recording, be it Redbook or high resolution, the Chord DAVE brings me closer to audio nirvana than anything that I've ever listened to before.

I still think DAVE is firmly  in the "silly" price range especially  taking  the recent discussion not exactly denied by Chord of the relative  SQ differences between their DACs Mojo,Hugo and DAVE into account.  And frankly as far as the  absolutelty ridiculously priced ,stand is concerned a bag of lentils or rice will do the same job for a far more reasonable price than most such products aimed more at  vanity than any real SQ benefits at all.
Brown rice is healthier than white but will do exactly the same excellent job as brown rice used  as a "beanbag".
PS. Hope you will enjoy your DAVE once you get it.

 

[Ampus]

Mmmm....if you have already invested, say, 20000 usd in quality headphones/in-ears or 50000 usd in new speakers, would you buy the Mojo and call it a day? I mean, really? I mean, really really?

Yes, really! Don't fall into the fallacy that expensive things are always better. Didn't you read Rob's advice about "Don't listen with your wallet"?

I do prefer DAVE over Mojo but, again, for its price the Mojo is hard to beat. $13,000 is a lots of money, especially where you live, but if you have money to burn, it's your prerogative.

 

[EVOLVIST]

Please try to understand the retail price. It comprises of manufacturing costs and profit, retailers and distributors margins. I can confirm to you all that we at Chord Electronics use the same costs and margin factors across everything we make and sell. So if something appears expensive it genuinely is expensive to manufacture. You might look at the stand and think you could get it made for half the price. Well I doubt you really could design then make it in relatively small volumes to the quality standards we apply then market and distribute it world wide. So I ask you look hard at the stand as it's an absolute bargain at the price it is as big chunks of precision machines aircraft grade HE 9 aluminium are far from inexpensive. Sorry to sound as I do in this but comments like those made about our pricing are so inaccurate that I felt it necessary to chip in.

 
Nah, it's cool, John...and I feel you, I really do. I couldn't presume to make a better stand, only a stand that would work. Regardless, I've bought the DAVE and it will be shipped to me tomorrow. I am happy.

 
 
In other news, since I have you on the line, what was the thought about adding the pre-emphasis function, where it "de-emphasizes" these old CD flags? It hasn't been a common thing with CD audio in a long time, but boy this function is a DAC is super cool! I guess I can listen to those "Holy Grail" Dark Side of the Moon and Abbey Road black triangle releases with confidence. 

 

 

[JaZZ]

  In other news, since I have you on the line, what was the thought about adding the pre-emphasis function, where it "de-emphasizes" these old CD flags? It hasn't been a common thing with CD audio in a long time, but boy this function is a DAC is super cool! I guess I can listen to those "Holy Grail" Dark Side of the Moon and Abbey Road black triangle releases with confidence. 

 

 
Now that you mention it, I indeed found it in the DAVE manual. I liked the sound quality of few CDs in my collection that were pre-emphasized and from there deduced that it was a beneficial feature. Theoretically it is. Sadly there's no corresponding indication on the display.