Roam
Banned - aka aerius
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2007
- Posts
- 476
- Likes
- 21
Cheap, good, balanced. Pick two.
Cheap, but good balanced amp.
- Thread starter _jazz
- Start date
_jazz
Head-Fier
- Joined
- May 4, 2006
- Posts
- 51
- Likes
- 0
Quote:
Wow, I didn't know it would be that much, I was hoping it'd be around the same price as the SP Tube Mini and the SP Square Wave non-balanced, which I believe is $999. But that could be the introductory price.
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...7/hf07_078.jpg
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...7/hf07_079.jpg
Is balanced that much better? I've never heard a balanced system, but heard a lot of good things about it and that's why I want to try it out. I was trying to find the cheapest way, but still have some quality.
The Headroom Desktop Balanced stock with Desktop module is the same price as the Headroom Desktop Single Ended with Max module, both with the Stepped Attenuator, are the same price? Would the Balanced with Desktop module sound better than the Desktop Single Ended with Max module?
| Originally Posted by vcoheda /img/forum/go_quote.gif the SP Sqaure Wave is $1699, but maybe there is an introductory offer making it less. |
Wow, I didn't know it would be that much, I was hoping it'd be around the same price as the SP Tube Mini and the SP Square Wave non-balanced, which I believe is $999. But that could be the introductory price.
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...7/hf07_078.jpg
http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...7/hf07_079.jpg
Is balanced that much better? I've never heard a balanced system, but heard a lot of good things about it and that's why I want to try it out. I was trying to find the cheapest way, but still have some quality.
The Headroom Desktop Balanced stock with Desktop module is the same price as the Headroom Desktop Single Ended with Max module, both with the Stepped Attenuator, are the same price? Would the Balanced with Desktop module sound better than the Desktop Single Ended with Max module?
Quote:
The more expensive amps use fully discrete components instead of integrated chips and also have better power supplies. That accounts for a lot of the costs.
| Originally Posted by Zorander /img/forum/go_quote.gif Is the step-up from the "budget" balanced amps to the higher-end ones worth it? I'm considering one in the near future and won't mind paying more if it's worth the investment. Cheers! |
The more expensive amps use fully discrete components instead of integrated chips and also have better power supplies. That accounts for a lot of the costs.
Quote:
The balanced version is more than both of those amps. I am convinced that balanced is worth the money. The HR desktop or Rudistor NX-33 are probably the cheapest balanced amps available and neither of them require a balanced source to work, another potentially huge cost saver.
| Originally Posted by _jazz /img/forum/go_quote.gif Wow, I didn't know it would be that much, I was hoping it'd be around the same price as the SP Tube Mini and the SP Square Wave non-balanced, which I believe is $999. But that could be the introductory price. http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...7/hf07_078.jpg http://i55.photobucket.com/albums/g1...7/hf07_079.jpg Is balanced that much better? I've never heard a balanced system, but heard a lot of good things about it and that's why I want to try it out. I was trying to find the cheapest way, but still have some quality. The Headroom Desktop Balanced stock with Desktop module is the same price as the Headroom Desktop Single Ended with Max module, both with the Stepped Attenuator, are the same price? Would the Balanced with Desktop module sound better than the Desktop Single Ended with Max module? |
The balanced version is more than both of those amps. I am convinced that balanced is worth the money. The HR desktop or Rudistor NX-33 are probably the cheapest balanced amps available and neither of them require a balanced source to work, another potentially huge cost saver.
Quote:
what does this amp look like. who builds them. where can we get more information.
| Originally Posted by mofonyx /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm getting a Balanced CKK III from the guy who built himself an awesome set of Balanced Diamond Buffers. 
|
what does this amp look like. who builds them. where can we get more information.
cotdt
Headphoneus Supremus
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2005
- Posts
- 3,220
- Likes
- 17
Quote:
http://www.amb.org/audio/ck2/
You can buy them from MisterX. Most people build it themselves, though.
| Originally Posted by vcoheda /img/forum/go_quote.gif what does this amp look like. who builds them. where can we get more information. |
http://www.amb.org/audio/ck2/
You can buy them from MisterX. Most people build it themselves, though.
Quote:
i thought he stopped building amps.
| Originally Posted by cotdt /img/forum/go_quote.gif http://www.amb.org/audio/ck2/ You can buy them from MisterX. Most people build it themselves, though. |
i thought he stopped building amps.
Zorander
Headphoneus Supremus
Quote:
What are the total costs we can expect for a fully-built one?
| Originally Posted by cotdt /img/forum/go_quote.gif http://www.amb.org/audio/ck2/ You can buy them from MisterX. Most people build it themselves, though. |
What are the total costs we can expect for a fully-built one?
cotdt
Headphoneus Supremus
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2005
- Posts
- 3,220
- Likes
- 17
Quote:
Not sure... you'd have to ask MisterX. With a nice case, it will be around $160 in parts for a single-ended one or $250 for a balanced one. So a fully built balanced one should cost maybe $600.
| Originally Posted by Zorander /img/forum/go_quote.gif What are the total costs we can expect for a fully-built one? |
Not sure... you'd have to ask MisterX. With a nice case, it will be around $160 in parts for a single-ended one or $250 for a balanced one. So a fully built balanced one should cost maybe $600.
SonicDawg
1000+ Head-Fier
- Joined
- Dec 28, 2005
- Posts
- 1,137
- Likes
- 16
I think the cheapest way to go balance is to get two identical Chinese made goodies and set them in dual mono
My next setup is going to be less than 600 dollars total
humanflyz
Headphoneus Supremus
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2005
- Posts
- 1,772
- Likes
- 14
Balanced doesn't automatically equal good.
You can balance a cMoy, but that doesn't mean it's going be better than a unbalanced Dynalo. Balanced is not some magic pill that will solve all your problems. An amp is only worth balancing if its single-ended performance is good to begin with.
There is a good reason why you don't see amp manufactures come out with balanced models for their low-end models: because the benefits are not going to be all that noticeable.
You can balance a cMoy, but that doesn't mean it's going be better than a unbalanced Dynalo. Balanced is not some magic pill that will solve all your problems. An amp is only worth balancing if its single-ended performance is good to begin with.
There is a good reason why you don't see amp manufactures come out with balanced models for their low-end models: because the benefits are not going to be all that noticeable.
Kees
Headphoneus Supremus
- Joined
- Feb 18, 2006
- Posts
- 4,619
- Likes
- 26
Quote:
I think that can only work if you have a balanced source, right?
| Originally Posted by SonicDawg /img/forum/go_quote.gif I think the cheapest way to go balance is to get two identical Chinese made goodies and set them in dual mono
|
I think that can only work if you have a balanced source, right?
Veniogenesis
Headphoneus Supremus
- Joined
- Oct 10, 2004
- Posts
- 2,296
- Likes
- 10
Dual mono can sound very good. I tend to believe that most of the sonic advantages of a balanced headphone rig are attributed to their dual-mono-like nature. As a note, most balanced headphone amps aren't true dual monos since they don't have separate power sections for each channel.
cotdt
Headphoneus Supremus
- Joined
- Aug 29, 2005
- Posts
- 3,220
- Likes
- 17
Balanced has:
Double the voltage swing
Double the current
Four times output power
Much higher power supply rejection ratio
Much higher common mode rejection ratio
Double the dampening factor, better control over the drivers
Less noise
Lower distortion
Solves ground loop issues (from personal experience)
More electrons for a smoother sound (some say this is why tubes sound smoother than solid state)
In short, buying two cheap amps and balancing them would definately be worth it.
Double the voltage swing
Double the current
Four times output power
Much higher power supply rejection ratio
Much higher common mode rejection ratio
Double the dampening factor, better control over the drivers
Less noise
Lower distortion
Solves ground loop issues (from personal experience)
More electrons for a smoother sound (some say this is why tubes sound smoother than solid state)
In short, buying two cheap amps and balancing them would definately be worth it.
Uncle Erik
Uncle Exotic
- Joined
- Mar 18, 2006
- Posts
- 22,596
- Likes
- 532
Another to consider is the Dynamid, which is a balanced Dynalo, or Gilmore Lite. They used to be commercially available as the Gilmore Reference, but I don't believe they're being manufactured any longer.
I'm in the process of building one. Parts cost will depend on what you choose. I went with the stock BOM Dan Gardner has on his site; that's about $160 for two channels. I'll grab those with the next paycheck. I've already built two STEPS for the power supplies. Those are about $70 each. I'll be using a case from Par-Metal, and that runs about $60. Still need to hunt down a pot for it, as well as buy knobs, switches, jacks, etc. I think the total cost will be around $400-$450 or so.
A savings over commercial units, for sure, but still not inexpensive. Building a balanced CK2III would probably knock a hundred off the total. If you want to spend a little more, a balanced Beta22 is possible, as is the revered Dynamight.
If you're interested in amps, you should give some thought to buying a soldering iron. They're not that difficult to build, you learn a lot, you save money, and the DIY headphone amp designs are excellent. There's no compromise with sound quality.
I'm in the process of building one. Parts cost will depend on what you choose. I went with the stock BOM Dan Gardner has on his site; that's about $160 for two channels. I'll grab those with the next paycheck. I've already built two STEPS for the power supplies. Those are about $70 each. I'll be using a case from Par-Metal, and that runs about $60. Still need to hunt down a pot for it, as well as buy knobs, switches, jacks, etc. I think the total cost will be around $400-$450 or so.
A savings over commercial units, for sure, but still not inexpensive. Building a balanced CK2III would probably knock a hundred off the total. If you want to spend a little more, a balanced Beta22 is possible, as is the revered Dynamight.
If you're interested in amps, you should give some thought to buying a soldering iron. They're not that difficult to build, you learn a lot, you save money, and the DIY headphone amp designs are excellent. There's no compromise with sound quality.
Users who are viewing this thread
