[kevin638880]

Why didn't they source the leather case from Dignis I wonder? I agree that the quality of the case is rather poor for a $5000 product. And IMO N8ii has a better packaging. The box feels more sturdy and better to protect the DAP during shipment.

Probably costs much more than what they have bundled right now. Which is a shame because I don't think Dignis would bother making leather cases for these kind of limited edition products. I hope I am wrong because I will be switching over immediately if they make one.

Packaging....well, you might have noticed that it is exactly the same as the SP3000's box. A little originality would be nice, no? But also that was kinda what I've expected from companies, if you know what I mean.

 

[RonaldS86]

Probably costs much more than what they have bundled right now. Which is a shame because I don't think Dignis would bother making leather cases for these kind of limited edition products. I hope I am wrong because I will be switching over immediately if they make one.

Packaging....well, you might have noticed that it is exactly the same as the SP3000's box. A little originality would be nice, no? But also that was kinda what I've expected from companies, if you know what I mean.

Yeah I forgot that N30LE is a limited production so maybe they wont bother making the case for it
The only thing I miss from AK is their good quality leather case
And yeah, I hope that N30LE last for several years just based on the price only. I'll be very pissed when it only last for 2 or 3 years and then it breaks. Sincerely hope all the problem happened is not because of bad design

 

[aaf evo]

I'm also reading that this titanium DAP gets scratched easily

Unfortunately every titanium DAP is prone to scratches. Go look at used RS8…

 

[Stouthart]

Unfortunately every titanium DAP is prone to scratches. Go look at used RS8…

Curious to learn how that will workout for the new iPhone Pro Anyway, guess what matters now is how Cayin will respond to avoid a potential PR nightmare, on their 30th birthday of all things.

 

[aaf evo]

Curious to learn how that will workout for the new iPhone Pro Anyway, guess what matters now is how Cayin will respond to avoid a potential PR nightmare, on their 30th birthday of all things.

I’ll find out Friday I’ve gone the clear silicone route case to protect it but still see the lovely Ti

 

[kazekhh]

I’ll find out Friday I’ve gone the clear silicone route case to protect it but still see the lovely Ti

My Apple Watch Ultra (titanium) is super resistant to scratches, I have knocked everything you could’ve imagined and there’s only two tiny scuff. I agreed that the N30LE launch was done poorly with so many QA issues. Touch wood, no problem with my AP so far tho.

 

[Stouthart]

My Apple Watch Ultra (titanium) is super resistant to scratches, I have knocked everything you could’ve imagined and there’s only two tiny scuff. I agreed that the N30LE launch was done poorly with so many QA issues. Touch wood, no problem with my AP so far tho.

Then don't knock your N30LE with your Watch Ultra Sorry, could not resist

 

[crazyhank]

Guys - This topic I know has been answered...but can you each please toggle your Amp from A to AB and tell me if you hear an audible difference? I feel like I'm the only one that cares about this...and I'm the crazy one LOL... I have the C9 and HIby RS8.... toggle from A/AB is noticeable. AB is more resolving, A is more ooomph.

I caught the bug about it not permitting the change in settings menu when P+ is on...and they will correct it thanks to Andy. But we may have a bigger issue, where the amp isn't selecting correctly.

Appreciate you checking. This is for all of us so we don't miss out a on this core and very very beautiful feature. On C9, it makes all the difference especially when in Tube mode.

Thank you for your time!

 

[crazyhank]

Guys - This topic I know has been answered...but can you each please toggle your Amp from A to AB and tell me if you hear an audible difference? I feel like I'm the only one that cares about this...and I'm the crazy one LOL... I have the C9 and HIby RS8.... toggle from A/AB is noticeable. AB is more resolving, A is more ooomph.

I caught the bug about it not permitting the change in settings menu when P+ is on...and they will correct it thanks to Andy. But we may have a bigger issue, where the amp isn't selecting correctly.

Appreciate you checking. This is for all of us so we don't miss out a on this core and very very beautiful feature. On C9, it makes all the difference especially when in Tube mode.

Thank you for your time!

Does anyone hear anything audible when touching the A/AB toggle? Even a small click? Like we hear when enabling tube mode, timbre, or P/P+ ?

 

[Blanchot]

Reading all the posts by owners of this N30LE, reporting an incredible series of bugs and various problems, I allow myself to define the release of this Dap Limited edition as "disastrous".
Just for personal information, with both my A&K Sp3000 and A&K Se300, since the first turn on, I have had nothing that created problems with my IEMs, cables and Amp.

It's funny that you should say this. At the beginning of last week I pondered whether I should buy the N30LE or the SP3000. Because of the various complaints in this thread I decided to go with the SP3000 Cu. It arrived on Friday, got to listen to it for an hour or so and charged it up before I went to bed. On Saturday morning I was ready for a listening session but then the darn thing won't turn on. It's completely dead. It won't turn on and it won't charge. It became a brick after just one hour of use.

It seems that Astell & Kern have QC issues as well.

 

[Kobe4ever]

It's funny that you should say this. At the beginning of last week I pondered whether I should buy the N30LE or the SP3000. Because of the various complaints in this thread I decided to go with the SP3000 Cu. It arrived on Friday, got to listen to it for an hour or so and charged it up before I went to bed. On Saturday morning I was ready for a listening session but then the darn thing won't turn on. It's completely dead. It won't turn on and it won't charge. It became a brick after just one hour of use.

It seems that Astell & Kern have QC issues as well.

I'm sorry about this.
Have you tried doing a reset by holding the wheel down for a long time?
Statically there may be some defective units with any electronic product, but the situation of this N30LE seems a little different to me

 

[Andykong]

First of all, Cayin wants to extend our sincere apology to all the N30LE users who have encountered the hissing problem.

Before we explain the problem, we want to advise N30LE users to contact their dealer immediately if they run into any hissing problems. Once our dealer confirms the problem, we shall swap a new machine immediately if the dealer has N30LE in stock, or our dealer will collect the N30LE from you. Alternatively, if the dealers don’t have any spare N30LE in stock, we’ll send out a new set of N30LE to the dealer immediately when the problem is verified and documented. On the other hand, to assist in solving this problem effectively, we need you to provide a detailed description of the IEM, headphones, and cable that produce the hissing problem, our dealer will collect the information and photo from you for documentation and further investigation of the hissing problem. We shall try our best to minimize the logistic delay but to safeguard the interest of the dealers, please return the reported DAP to your dealer before the new N30LE package arrives at the dealer’s shop. Our dealer will work out the details with each customer, and we’ll keep a close eye to make sure the interests of our users are handled in good hands.

We started to investigate the hissing problem after Torq shared his problem, we cannot replicate the problem in our laboratory. It appears to be a randomized problem that can’t be determined or replicated even when we conducted vigorous loading experiments with the N30LE units we have on hand.

From what we have been told, the hissing only shows up at Class A or Hyper Mode (which by default is operated in Class A mode) with 4.4mm balanced phone output. We also noticed that the hissing is not audible in Class AB amplification mode. Theoretically, Class A and Class AB are only different biased settings of the same circuit, and the working current of Class A is relatively higher than Class AB. Besides, the hissing problem will only show up with certain IEMs/headphones or IEM/headphone cables, so it is a random event or trigger by certain unusual electrical characteristics of the IEMs/headphones or IEM/headphone cables.

We shall ship back Torq’s N30LE and perform a thorough study. In the meantime, we have received another hissing report from a local N30LE user in China. The hissing problem only appears with a particular IEM cable, so we asked him to send his N30LE, the IEM with cable to us, and we received the package on 17th September 2023. These are our findings from the weekend:

1. We can replicate the hissing problem with the returned N30LE and that particular IEM and IEM cable.
2. The hissing disappeared when we swapped with another N30LE from our inventory. We have tried three sets of N30LE and couldn’t replicate the hissing problem again.
3. As the user has mentioned that the hissing is only audible with the particular cable, we swapped it to another IEM cable with compatible connectors. We confirmed that with the returned N30LE and the IEM+ cable made available to us, there was no audible hissing noise after we swapped the IEM cable.
4. Now this is the part that truly surprises us. Because the IEM is a modular design with swappable connectors, we tried swapping the connectors. When we replaced the 4.4mm connectors on this IEM cable with another compatible 4.4mm connector, the hissing disappeared.
5. Unfortunately, when we reconnected the original 4.4mm connector back to the IEM cable, the hissing problem returned, so we eliminated the possibility of insecure installation in the hissing problem
6. We have borrowed a set of Meze 109Pro headphones with bundled headphone cables from a local Cayin dealer. This headphone has been mentioned as one of the sources of hissing instances. Since it is readily available locally, so we move on quickly today. When we connected the Meze 109Pro to the returned N30LE and several N30LE in our inventory, we couldn’t replicate the hissing problem. This further explained that the hissing problem is a mix and match of N30LE with certain IEM/headphones under unit variance conditions.

Based on the testing we have conducted so far, our current working theory is the problem is related to specific capacitive loading characteristics that show up in unit variance occasionally. The problem only shows up with a particular DAP + IEM/headphone + cable combination and the problem is unit dependent. This problematic combination will exhibit capacitive loading characteristics that produce sound effects similar to white noise.

We shall continue our problem-solving. We need more time to investigate the problem, and hopefully, when we receive Torq’s returned N30LE DAP, we can widen our test samples and collect more information. If you prefer to discuss your hissing problem directly with Cayin staff after you have reported your instance to your dealers, please feel free to email us at service@cayin.cn.

We shall keep the N30LE community informed when we gather more information and hopefully pinpoint the source of the problem scientifically.

Once again, we apologize for all the inconvenience caused, please work with your dealer immediately to speed up the return and replacement process.

 

[Torq]

From what we have been told, the hissing only shows up at Class A or Hyper Mode (which by default is operated in Class A mode) with 4.4mm balanced phone output. We also noticed that the hissing is not audible in Class AB amplification mode.

Just a quick clarification:

For me, the hissing and static started in Class A mode on 4.4mm (and only over 100F or so). Once the hissing and static began, it was present in ALL modes that I tried (so A, AB, SS, Tube Classic & Modern) and on both 3.5mm and 4.4mm outputs. Switching modes made no difference*. I did not try Hyper mode.

Just wanted to put that out there so that your diagnostic efforts don't miss something.

Feel free to contact me directly if you, or your engineers, want to clarify any of the behavior I experienced.

---
*There was one session where switching modes did fix the issue, but that was just low-level static, not hissing, and it was short-lived. So either my unit has two different issues or I was just (un)lucky that session.

 

[Stouthart]

@Andykong you are most certainly aware of this, but Meze 109 Pro issues where mostly reported in combination with the Meze UPCHD copper upgrade 4.4 cable (a combination I was about to buy).

 

[Andykong]

Cayin has grown into one of the largest vacuum tube amplifier development and manufacturing facilities in the world. At the dawn of our 30th Anniversary, we are expanding our facilities and building a new Research and Development Building in our existing facility. We shall move our Management, R&D, and Sales team into the new building. The original Main Building will become 100% Production related and we shall add a new production line to increase our throughput and efficiency. When each production line becomes more focused, there are fewer variables to deal with, and the both quantity and quality will be enhanced significantly.

So how big is Cayin? Are we one of the largest research and production facilities for audiophiles electronics?

Let's start with a recent photo taken by a UAV on June 2023, immediately after we completed the construction work of our new R&D building and started our internal facilitation.



We have been in this facility since 2005. The building in the background is the original Main building. That is a 4-story facility with a total floor area of around 4,730 sq. meters, and we also have a small canteen and staff quarter (~1,120 sq. meters) behind the Main building. The building in the foreground is our new R&D building. This is a 3-story facility at around 540 sq. meters per floor, so we added around 1,620 sq. meters to the Cayin Headquarters site, and the total floor area is, give and take, around 7,500 sq. meters.

While I don't have a space per staff statistic readily available, I can assure you that we are working on a very tight space allocation. To put our situation into prospect, this is the layout of the 3rd Floor of the new R&D building.



If I have drawn your attention by now, and you are interested in reading more information about Cayin as a brand and one of the major contributor in the China HiFi industry, HiFi+ have published a fairly comprehensive brand story for Cayin in their Directory of High-End Audio Manufacturer (2019). Check this out and you'll understand how we reach this far since 1993.

Before I go to bed, let me share with you one more photo, a visionary photo, a glimpse into Cayin's distant future.

In between our Main building and the canteen/staff quarter, we have hidden a dream. There is enough space, and we have reserved the right, to build one more 4000 sq meters building, and we can double our canteen/staff quarter if needed.

Do we need this extra building? Not now, but we definitely want to do that if Cayin continues to grow at the current pace.

When are we going to bring this dream to reality? Well, it depends on our innovation, engineering, and sales/marketing, but more important, it depends on you: our customers, our users, and all the friends and hobbyist who recognize Cayin as one of your companions in your journey of sound.

With Cayin, your music will never be the same again.

With you, Cayin will never be the same again.

We finally moved into the new R&D building this weekend.

The Engineering and R&D Department stopped our routine operation at 5 pm (+GMT 8) on 15th September, and we need to pack up our own table before we head back home. We came back the next day and started moving to the new building. These are a few snapshots by the end of Saturday. We shall keep the new and old office in parallel run for a few days before we stut down the old office completely, and we shall tear down the old office and onstruct a new production line from the space we freed in this exercise.