Cayin N3 Hi-Res DAP with AKM4490 DAC, apt-X Bluetooth, and Line, USB & Coax Out for $150

[Francisk]

For the more technical among you: is there any disadvantage I choosing High Gain over Medium or Low? I prefer listening to music quite loud (not for extended periods, I know the dangers), but don't like to crank up the volume to 80 or 90 (which for some recordings I need to do on Medium Gain to drive my P7s to the levels I like). If I switch to High Gain I can leave the volume at 50 or 60 for the same recordings, but does that cost me any signal noise through the extra amplification?

Basically the higher the gain, the higher the noise. For me the rule of thumb is not to switch to high gain unless really necessary eg. level 100 of mid gain is still too soft.

 

[gLer]

Basically the higher the gain, the higher the noise. For me the rule of thumb is not to switch to high gain unless really necessary eg. level 100 of mid gain is still too soft.

Got you. So you're saying Vol 80 on Medium Gain should technically be 'less noisy' than Vol 60 on High Gain, even though they're audibly similar?

 

[Francisk]

Got you. So you're saying Vol 80 on Medium Gain should technically be 'less noisy' than Vol 60 on High Gain, even though they're audibly similar?

I've not measured vol 80 on medium gain against vol 60 on high gain but anyone who understands audio will tell you not to switch the gain to a higher level than what is required to drive your headphone to a satisfactory level. Again the rule of thumb of audio....the higher the gain, the higher the noise. This is just a general advice but hey...do whatever that floats your boat gLer, as long as you're happy and satisfied with it

 

[fourrobert13]

For the more technical among you: is there any disadvantage I choosing High Gain over Medium or Low? I prefer listening to music quite loud (not for extended periods, I know the dangers), but don't like to crank up the volume to 80 or 90 (which for some recordings I need to do on Medium Gain to drive my P7s to the levels I like). If I switch to High Gain I can leave the volume at 50 or 60 for the same recordings, but does that cost me any signal noise through the extra amplification?

When you turn up the gain, you raise the noise floor so you could start hearing some background noise. IMO, there is no need to raise the gain unless your headphones require the extra juice to get the volume to the desired level. It also requires more battery so you don't get as much play time either. If you volume matched the gain settings, there would be no sound differences other than the background noise associated with raising the noise floor.

 

[gLer]

When you turn up the gain, you raise the noise floor so you could start hearing some background noise. IMO, there is no need to raise the gain unless your headphones require the extra juice to get the volume to the desired level. It also requires more battery so you don't get as much play time either. If you volume matched the gain settings, there would be no sound differences other than the background noise associated with raising the noise floor.

Thanks, so the simple answer seems to be: keep it low or medium unless you're already at max volume and it's still too soft This is where the source also plays a part, especially older vinyl rips that are 'noisy' to begin with. Now that I have the N3 and can take my music library around with me I've been weeding out my poorer rips and looking to replace them with more modern or remastered recordings. Also, my DSD backups always seem to play at much higher levels than CDs or downloads for some reason (and are practically noise free even at high volumes), so I'm normally on medium or even low gain for those.

 

[JaeYoon]

Yeah i remember this lesson from Opus 1 thread. Its much better to have volume on high level in low or medium gain or in the red rather than hitting next level of gain on low level. Introducing more noise, etc.

 

[Brimstone]

I couldn't resist any longer and placed an order for one of these today. Excited to replace my old first gen Fiio X3.

 

[fish1050]

I've not measured vol 80 on medium gain against vol 60 on high gain but anyone who understands audio will tell you not to switch the gain to a higher level than what is required to drive your headphone to a satisfactory level. Again the rule of thumb of audio....the higher the gain, the higher the noise. This is just a general advice but hey...do whatever that floats your boat gLer, as long as you're happy and satisfied with it

QUOTE="gLer, post: 13523111, member: 474900"]Got you. So you're saying Vol 80 on Medium Gain should technically be 'less noisy' than Vol 60 on High Gain, even though they're audibly similar?[/QUOTE]

The main reason for multiple gain settings is to match the gain level with the type of iem/headphone. Low gain is intended for sensitive and highly efficient iems. Medium gain for less efficient iem's and highly efficient headphones. High gain for less efficient headphones.

You also want to avoid pushing the volume to high on any one gain setting. The rule of thumb I was trained to follow is if you need to go above 80% volume at any gain level for adequate volume then switch to a higher gain setting. If you are already on high gain then consider adding an external amp. You always want to leave some headroom for the volume. When I sold audio gear one of the main things discussed was dynamic headroom. The idea being that for short bursts more power (headroom) may be needed to reproduce dynamic passages in the music effectively and without distorting. If you can't hear a difference between medium gain at 80 and high gain at 60 I would go high gain at 60. You won't drive the DAP as hard and you may have more power in reserve when needed. As for adding more noise at a higher gain setting the noise floor is so much lower on modern gear compared to my day that I wouldn't worry about it unless your iems are really sensitive.

 

[fish1050]

Surprise is right!!

One day after avgear was suppose to start shipping the N3 for amazon.ca orders (May 31st) it is now no longer listed on amazon.ca. Initially when I checked it showed the N3 as "No longer available not sure if or when it will be in stock". Now it doesn't appear at all. Not listed on avgearshop.com either. So for now only headfoneshop.com is selling it in Canada unless someone else has found another retailer. I am in no rush to buy so I can wait to see if the N3 makes another appearance on amazon.ca

 

[fish1050]

Another Canadian Cayin Dealer.

http://www.altronicsstereo2000.com is also a Cayin dealer and he has an N3 sample on hand and can get the N3. I can vouch for them as I bought my Fiio Q1 from this guy and he has been in business since the 1950's.

While he is not setup for online orders he will take phone orders if anyone is still looking for a Canadian dealer. The price seems to be set at $219.00 as it was listed for this price on amazon.ca and both headfoneshop and http://www.altronicsstereo2000.com are selling it for that price.

 

[peskypesky]

@BrianD19 Hard to keep up as I've got wife, kids, job, etc...

What???? And you have time to listen to headphones?

 

[groucho69]

QUOTE="gLer, post: 13523111, member: 474900"]Got you. So you're saying Vol 80 on Medium Gain should technically be 'less noisy' than Vol 60 on High Gain, even though they're audibly similar?

The main reason for multiple gain settings is to match the gain level with the type of iem/headphone. Low gain is intended for sensitive and highly efficient iems. Medium gain for less efficient iem's and highly efficient headphones. High gain for less efficient headphones.

You also want to avoid pushing the volume to high on any one gain setting. The rule of thumb I was trained to follow is if you need to go above 80% volume at any gain level for adequate volume then switch to a higher gain setting. If you are already on high gain then consider adding an external amp. You always want to leave some headroom for the volume. When I sold audio gear one of the main things discussed was dynamic headroom. The idea being that for short bursts more power (headroom) may be needed to reproduce dynamic passages in the music effectively and without distorting. If you can't hear a difference between medium gain at 80 and high gain at 60 I would go high gain at 60. You won't drive the DAP as hard and you may have more power in reserve when needed. As for adding more noise at a higher gain setting the noise floor is so much lower on modern gear compared to my day that I wouldn't worry about it unless your iems are really sensitive.[/QUOTE]

Headroom!!! I can't tell you how many times I had to ask design engineers, "don't you think you might want to up the power supply to allow for enough headroom?" Error number one is not allowing enough headroom.

 

[groucho69]

Another Canadian Cayin Dealer.

http://www.altronicsstereo2000.com is also a Cayin dealer and he has an N3 sample on hand and can get the N3. I can vouch for them as I bought my Fiio Q1 from this guy and he has been in business since the 1950's.

While he is not setup for online orders he will take phone orders if anyone is still looking for a Canadian dealer. The price seems to be set at $219.00 as it was listed for this price on amazon.ca and both headfoneshop and http://www.altronicsstereo2000.com are selling it for that price.

Messaged him and asked about the case.

 

[groucho69]

@Andykong as you can see we are abandoned in Canada. Consider allowing us to order from the Cayin store.

 

[twister6]

@Andykong as you can see we are abandoned in Canada. Consider allowing us to order from the Cayin store.

Did you try MusicTeck? I'm pretty sure Andrew will ship to Canada, though I'm not sure about the shipping rate.