[terirapt]

Thank you all for the advises, really appreciate it.

As for tube rolling, has been reading through this forum and probably looking at Psvane CV181 TII and Acme 300b. I am more into Jazz and Classical, and looking for details, holographic soundstaging with proper instrument placing, airiness (especially for strings), warmth/sweetness but not too slow and thick. Not sure if I make sense? Any advise on possible tube combinations? Headphones are He1000se, Utopia and Abyss TC. DAC is Rockna Wavelight fed with Aurender X100.

One more question : regarding the 22DE4, they don’t seem to be that expensive now but looks like not easily available especially in quad. Do they last long on the HA-300, or should we start getting spares before High demand-Low supply drive the prices up? And as they don’t seem to be easily available in quad, can I mix and match different brands?

And wishing all a Merriest Christmas!

 

[jambaj0e]

Thank you all for the advises, really appreciate it.

As for tube rolling, has been reading through this forum and probably looking at Psvane CV181 TII and Acme 300b. I am more into Jazz and Classical, and looking for details, holographic soundstaging with proper instrument placing, airiness (especially for strings), warmth/sweetness but not too slow and thick. Not sure if I make sense? Any advise on possible tube combinations? Headphones are He1000se, Utopia and Abyss TC. DAC is Rockna Wavelight fed with Aurender X100.

One more question : regarding the 22DE4, they don’t seem to be that expensive now but looks like not easily available especially in quad. Do they last long on the HA-300, or should we start getting spares before High demand-Low supply drive the prices up? And as they don’t seem to be easily available in quad, can I mix and match different brands?

And wishing all a Merriest Christmas!

Yeah, that's what I had, except I upgraded the CV181 TII to a NOS pair of Sylvania 6SN7W Metal Tubes. It's stunning how much more wider and larger the soundstage is compared to my HUGO TT2's headphone amp. There's also a bit more midrage sweetness, too. I much prefer it over the TT2/

 

[jambaj0e]

Oh hello upgraded power cable! Gotta say, going from my Morrow Audio MAP3 1m power cable ($379) to the Audioquest Thunder 2m power cable ($999) immediately brought SO much more clarity, separation, dynamic range, and so much texture to the Cayin HA-300! (Box cutter to show size)



It is as if another veil that I didn't even realize was there got lifted. This is so much more noticeable w/ cymbal and hi-hats where I can really hear more texture, but also applies to electric bass guitar. Voices are also more purer-sounding.

Songs listened:
- Fleetwood Mac: The Chain (2001 remaster)
- Friday Night Plans - HONDA
- Dead Can Dance - Song of the Stars (remaster)
- Yerin Baek - Popo (How deep is our love?)
- Flannel Graph - Pure Imagination
- Seatbelt - Tank! (Cowboy Bebop OST)
- Selena Gomez - Lose You to Love Me
- Julia Michaels - Issues
- Polo & Pan - Baraka
- Billie Eilish - Listen Before I go
- Billy Joel - The Ballad of Billy the Kid
- Jung Seung Hwan - Across the Universe
- Victor Wooten - Back to India
- Great White - Rock Me (2001 remaster)
- Jacques Loussier Trio - JS Bach: Fugue in G minor (Arr for Jazz Trio)

Only bad thing is that this cable with its braiding is very very stiff. As you can see, I can't push the HA-300 close enough to its original position



Here's how it looks compared to my Morrow Audio MAP3:



Here's the closeup of the termination ends. That device attached to one end is their "noise-trapping" DBS pack (Dielectric Bias System):

Audioquest DBS Pack

Here's the box and carrying/protective case:






Now, I'm waiting for the PS Audio Stellar Power Plant 3 to arrive, but once that arrives, the Thunder will go from the wall to the P3, while the HA-300 will get the Morrow Audio MAP3... although I am now pretty damn tempted to get a 2nd 1m Thunder to go from the Power Plant 3 to the HA-300!

 

[Sampajanna]

Hi. Love the sound from my Cayin HA300. Anyone know why the stock tubes would make a stuttering noise in the right channel that completely goes away when I switch the tubes? It seems like one is made for right and one for left. Could that be? Odd...

Those metal base Sylvanias are now very expensive and some sites say they have a high failure rate. I already tried a Ken rad 6sn7, which failed and then teh "Bad Boy," which I thought were worse than the stock tubes. Thinking of either the Psvanne or maybe Melz 1578 now....

Also, I have to say, in case it matters to anyone, IMO Cayin's customer service is really lame. They just shuffle you back to your dealer no matter what your issue is, even if asking for advice. Maybe that is just my bad luck or dude was having a bad day on the occasions I contacted them, but over 8 months I asked 3 questions and got a very curt email back each time saying basically: go ask ur dealer. They seem polite in these forums, but I found them unhelpful to say the least. And I dont have a good relationship to my dealer or any at all, in fact. So I would recommend buying this amp from a good dealer that can help you if you have any issues and not expect Cayin to be of much help.

 

[Andykong]

Thank you all for the advises, really appreciate it.

As for tube rolling, has been reading through this forum and probably looking at Psvane CV181 TII and Acme 300b. I am more into Jazz and Classical, and looking for details, holographic soundstaging with proper instrument placing, airiness (especially for strings), warmth/sweetness but not too slow and thick. Not sure if I make sense? Any advise on possible tube combinations? Headphones are He1000se, Utopia and Abyss TC. DAC is Rockna Wavelight fed with Aurender X100.

One more question : regarding the 22DE4, they don’t seem to be that expensive now but looks like not easily available especially in quad. Do they last long on the HA-300, or should we start getting spares before High demand-Low supply drive the prices up? And as they don’t seem to be easily available in quad, can I mix and match different brands?

And wishing all a Merriest Christmas!

Just check with the engineers, the 22DE4 as rectifier tube can last almost forever. Well, put that into the context of a tube amplifier, that probably means 5 to 10 years.

The four 22DE4 are supposed to work independently from each other, their whole point is to minimize the interference between different power supply circuit, so if you want or need to replace them, you can do that per piece without any matching.

 

[Andykong]

Hi. Love the sound from my Cayin HA300. Anyone know why the stock tubes would make a stuttering noise in the right channel that completely goes away when I switch the tubes? It seems like one is made for right and one for left. Could that be? Odd...

Those metal base Sylvanias are now very expensive and some sites say they have a high failure rate. I already tried a Ken rad 6sn7, which failed and then teh "Bad Boy," which I thought were worse than the stock tubes. Thinking of either the Psvanne or maybe Melz 1578 now....

Also, I have to say, in case it matters to anyone, IMO Cayin's customer service is really lame. They just shuffle you back to your dealer no matter what your issue is, even if asking for advice. Maybe that is just my bad luck or dude was having a bad day on the occasions I contacted them, but over 8 months I asked 3 questions and got a very curt email back each time saying basically: go ask ur dealer. They seem polite in these forums, but I found them unhelpful to say the least. And I dont have a good relationship to my dealer or any at all, in fact. So I would recommend buying this amp from a good dealer that can help you if you have any issues and not expect Cayin to be of much help.

Have you tried to swap back the tube to right channel? If the stuttering goes away, then its likely a bad contact during tube installation. On the other hand, it can be the vacuum tube has a different level of sensitivity to interference, and in your case, the "right" tube is more sensitive then the "left" tube, so the right tube position has more interference then the left tube position, so when you swapped the tube, the more sensitive tubes goes to the less interference position and solved the problem. This happens with NOS tubes but less common with stock tubes which are fresh from tube manufacturer production line.

 

[Sampajanna]

Have you tried to swap back the tube to right channel? If the stuttering goes away, then its likely a bad contact during tube installation. On the other hand, it can be the vacuum tube has a different level of sensitivity to interference, and in your case, the "right" tube is more sensitive then the "left" tube, so the right tube position has more interference then the left tube position, so when you swapped the tube, the more sensitive tubes goes to the less interference position and solved the problem. This happens with NOS tubes but less common with stock tubes which are fresh from tube manufacturer production line.

If I switch them back it comes back but switch again and compleytely gone ... So it mast be this sensitivity issue. These are the stock tubes though. Not NOS

 

[Andykong]

If I switch them back it comes back but switch again and compleytely gone ... So it mast be this sensitivity issue. These are the stock tubes though. Not NOS

I know, that's why I said this is less common.

The noisy position in near the center of the amplifier?

 

[Sampajanna]

I know, that's why I said this is less common.

The noisy position in near the center of the amplifier?

No it is in the right headphone only... sputtering sound. then switch the two 6sn7 and issue is gone.

 

[Dave01236]

Hi fellow headfiers. I bought the cayin ha300 in June 2020. 7 months of fun, and it's not over yet. I tried many tubes (many of them are 6n8s melz tubes) and in the past few months that's all I've been rolling. I tried different years of manufacture (1948-1950-1952) I also have two matched pairs of melz 1578 (the real ones with 5 holes in the plates) one pair from 1963 and one from 1980 I believe. My conclusion : year 1948,1950 and 1952 are the best ones. If you can get two of the same year, even if they're not a matched pair, they will sound very similar to a matched pair from 1963, and they're 3 times cheaper. I managed to get some tubes from those years of manufacture (1948-1950-1952) for only $30 each. Nowadays you get a matched pair of 1578's for up to $150. I'm pretty confident to say that the Melz tubes, whether they're 6n8s or 1578, are in the top 3 of the best tubes you could use in the cayin ha300. Plus, they're very cheap and easy to get

Of course if you are into tube rolling, you will want to try as many 6sn7 tubes as possible. Because tubes will sound different for everyone, and especially on every amp. So far I have tried the tung sol 6f8g's with adapters, sylvania 6sn7w metal base, melz tubes, the sylvania bad boys and the stock tubes. The bad boys did glow in my cayin ha300 but gave me no sound. I tried them in my woo audio wa22 and oddly enough, I did get sound. Unfortunately the cayin is a much bigger beast so I do not use the wa22 anymore. Sadly I had to send the bad boys back to the seller. They are supposed to work in the cayin ha300 since 6sn7GT is supported by the amp. Unfortunately, it wasn't the case for me. I wonder if anyone has had issues like this one with their ha300 on any pair of tubes?

I will rate the tubes below :

1: Tung Sol 6f8g
2: Melz tubes
3: Sylvania 6sn7w metal base
4: Stock Tubes

I won't say much about the stock tubes because meh, they are stock tubes. They're not bad, far from that. But they just don't compare to many, many tubes out there. The sylvania metal base tubes, let's just say I was disappointed. Many, many claim that they are the best 6sn7 tubes out there. Now I say : it depends. For me, they sounded boring. I'm not sure if it's because of the amp or my headphones the he1000SE. Maybe I got a bad pair. Maybe I just don't like their sound. Plus, they are very, very expensive. I'm pretty sure that the guy who I sold the tubes to will be 3 times happier with the sylvania tubes than I was !

Now the melz tubes and the 6f8g's. So far these are my favorite tubes in the cayin ha300. Their midrange is simply magnificent. Vocals are great, acoustics are great. You have amazing bass as well. I had a lot of difficulty choosing one pair or the other. In the end, I feel like the 6f8g's offer a slightly bigger soundstage. I also prefer the tone of the 6f8g's. They just sound very natural and they don't add any coloration to the sound. You can get adapters for these on ebay no problem, and they aren't that expensive either.

Conclusion : I like this amp very much, compared to my woo audio wa22 it has a huge soundstage. Better bass (on some albums I did not hear many details, but now I do) , better instrument separation (thanks to the 300B magic) , now cymbals are more detailed than ever. The kick drums have a lot more impact. I could go on and on and on but I'm not very good at describing what I hear. Just being honest. I just know that I do not regret my decision buying this amp, simply because it kicks ass! And that the 300B tubes that I currently own (takatsuki 300B) are definitely the main factor in my amp right now. These are getting very rare, and lately they've been selling for absurd prices. People often compare them to the western electric's, and for good reason. I like them very much, let's just say I don't miss the stock 300B'S at all.

If anyone has recommendations for tubes to roll in this amp, please tell me because I'm not done yet !

 

[terirapt]

How do I know if I am clipping the HA-300?

I read that the ideal speakers for the 300b amplifiers are the high sensitivity (preferably high 90s?) and/or flat high impedance ones (I see that HA-300 manual states 4-8 ohms). However I am using a pair of Spendor Classic 3/1 (rated 88 sensitivity, 8 ohms, 25-150 watts ), and I am concerned of damaging the speakers due to underpower. I read that speakers will distort when the amp clips, but also read that tube amp may not result in audible distortion when clipping? Thus I am confused how would I know if I am clipping the HA-300? Does the VU meter help ie. do not operate above the 100/0 mark?

Thank you.

 

[dadracer2]

Hi fellow headfiers. I bought the cayin ha300 in June 2020. 7 months of fun, and it's not over yet. I tried many tubes (many of them are 6n8s melz tubes) and in the past few months that's all I've been rolling. I tried different years of manufacture (1948-1950-1952) I also have two matched pairs of melz 1578 (the real ones with 5 holes in the plates) one pair from 1963 and one from 1980 I believe. My conclusion : year 1948,1950 and 1952 are the best ones. If you can get two of the same year, even if they're not a matched pair, they will sound very similar to a matched pair from 1963, and they're 3 times cheaper. I managed to get some tubes from those years of manufacture (1948-1950-1952) for only $30 each. Nowadays you get a matched pair of 1578's for up to $150. I'm pretty confident to say that the Melz tubes, whether they're 6n8s or 1578, are in the top 3 of the best tubes you could use in the cayin ha300. Plus, they're very cheap and easy to get

Of course if you are into tube rolling, you will want to try as many 6sn7 tubes as possible. Because tubes will sound different for everyone, and especially on every amp. So far I have tried the tung sol 6f8g's with adapters, sylvania 6sn7w metal base, melz tubes, the sylvania bad boys and the stock tubes. The bad boys did glow in my cayin ha300 but gave me no sound. I tried them in my woo audio wa22 and oddly enough, I did get sound. Unfortunately the cayin is a much bigger beast so I do not use the wa22 anymore. Sadly I had to send the bad boys back to the seller. They are supposed to work in the cayin ha300 since 6sn7GT is supported by the amp. Unfortunately, it wasn't the case for me. I wonder if anyone has had issues like this one with their ha300 on any pair of tubes?

I will rate the tubes below :

1: Tung Sol 6f8g
2: Melz tubes
3: Sylvania 6sn7w metal base
4: Stock Tubes

I won't say much about the stock tubes because meh, they are stock tubes. They're not bad, far from that. But they just don't compare to many, many tubes out there. The sylvania metal base tubes, let's just say I was disappointed. Many, many claim that they are the best 6sn7 tubes out there. Now I say : it depends. For me, they sounded boring. I'm not sure if it's because of the amp or my headphones the he1000SE. Maybe I got a bad pair. Maybe I just don't like their sound. Plus, they are very, very expensive. I'm pretty sure that the guy who I sold the tubes to will be 3 times happier with the sylvania tubes than I was !

Now the melz tubes and the 6f8g's. So far these are my favorite tubes in the cayin ha300. Their midrange is simply magnificent. Vocals are great, acoustics are great. You have amazing bass as well. I had a lot of difficulty choosing one pair or the other. In the end, I feel like the 6f8g's offer a slightly bigger soundstage. I also prefer the tone of the 6f8g's. They just sound very natural and they don't add any coloration to the sound. You can get adapters for these on ebay no problem, and they aren't that expensive either.

Conclusion : I like this amp very much, compared to my woo audio wa22 it has a huge soundstage. Better bass (on some albums I did not hear many details, but now I do) , better instrument separation (thanks to the 300B magic) , now cymbals are more detailed than ever. The kick drums have a lot more impact. I could go on and on and on but I'm not very good at describing what I hear. Just being honest. I just know that I do not regret my decision buying this amp, simply because it kicks ass! And that the 300B tubes that I currently own (takatsuki 300B) are definitely the main factor in my amp right now. These are getting very rare, and lately they've been selling for absurd prices. People often compare them to the western electric's, and for good reason. I like them very much, let's just say I don't miss the stock 300B'S at all.

If anyone has recommendations for tubes to roll in this amp, please tell me because I'm not done yet !

Have you tried any of the PSVANE 6SN7 valves at all?

 

[dadracer2]

How do I know if I am clipping the HA-300?

I read that the ideal speakers for the 300b amplifiers are the high sensitivity (preferably high 90s?) and/or flat high impedance ones (I see that HA-300 manual states 4-8 ohms). However I am using a pair of Spendor Classic 3/1 (rated 88 sensitivity, 8 ohms, 25-150 watts ), and I am concerned of damaging the speakers due to underpower. I read that speakers will distort when the amp clips, but also read that tube amp may not result in audible distortion when clipping? Thus I am confused how would I know if I am clipping the HA-300? Does the VU meter help ie. do not operate above the 100/0 mark?

Thank you.

It depends also on your room size and what volume you consider normal, but I found I needed 96db sensitivity speakers in our mid sized listening room. They have a very smooth impedance curve with no big drops or peaks that is close to 8 ohm across the spectrum. These 2 issues are key so you could have a 99db speakers but it had a 4 ohm impedance and sharp drops then this would not be as ideal as say a 95db speaker with a more gentle impedance curve. Also some manufacturers overstate their sensitivity as they measure to a modified standard. So for example Klipsch seem to measure their speakers at around 3db more than reality.

If you were constantly running you amp at max into your speakers and then clipping or distortion would become a potential issue. Even though a valve amp clips more softly than SS amps they do have higher distortion levels (especially a SET amp!) but these are generally even order harmonics and so your ear does not hear that so much of a distortion as it is. Does that make sense?

So maybe you will either have play at lower levels (below 3 o'clock on the volume dial) or consider getting some new speakers if you want/need more volume.

Just my thoughts FWIW.

 

[Level5]

I know, that's why I said this is less common.

The noisy position in near the center of the amplifier?

Has there been any silent revisions? Looking to pick one up again to cure my HD800S. Its the only amp that gave me goosebumps! Once you hear a proper 300b, its hard to be satisfied with anything else.

 

[jambaj0e]

Hi fellow headfiers. I bought the cayin ha300 in June 2020. 7 months of fun, and it's not over yet. I tried many tubes (many of them are 6n8s melz tubes) and in the past few months that's all I've been rolling. I tried different years of manufacture (1948-1950-1952) I also have two matched pairs of melz 1578 (the real ones with 5 holes in the plates) one pair from 1963 and one from 1980 I believe. My conclusion : year 1948,1950 and 1952 are the best ones. If you can get two of the same year, even if they're not a matched pair, they will sound very similar to a matched pair from 1963, and they're 3 times cheaper. I managed to get some tubes from those years of manufacture (1948-1950-1952) for only $30 each. Nowadays you get a matched pair of 1578's for up to $150. I'm pretty confident to say that the Melz tubes, whether they're 6n8s or 1578, are in the top 3 of the best tubes you could use in the cayin ha300. Plus, they're very cheap and easy to get

Of course if you are into tube rolling, you will want to try as many 6sn7 tubes as possible. Because tubes will sound different for everyone, and especially on every amp. So far I have tried the tung sol 6f8g's with adapters, sylvania 6sn7w metal base, melz tubes, the sylvania bad boys and the stock tubes. The bad boys did glow in my cayin ha300 but gave me no sound. I tried them in my woo audio wa22 and oddly enough, I did get sound. Unfortunately the cayin is a much bigger beast so I do not use the wa22 anymore. Sadly I had to send the bad boys back to the seller. They are supposed to work in the cayin ha300 since 6sn7GT is supported by the amp. Unfortunately, it wasn't the case for me. I wonder if anyone has had issues like this one with their ha300 on any pair of tubes?

I will rate the tubes below :

1: Tung Sol 6f8g
2: Melz tubes
3: Sylvania 6sn7w metal base
4: Stock Tubes

I won't say much about the stock tubes because meh, they are stock tubes. They're not bad, far from that. But they just don't compare to many, many tubes out there. The sylvania metal base tubes, let's just say I was disappointed. Many, many claim that they are the best 6sn7 tubes out there. Now I say : it depends. For me, they sounded boring. I'm not sure if it's because of the amp or my headphones the he1000SE. Maybe I got a bad pair. Maybe I just don't like their sound. Plus, they are very, very expensive. I'm pretty sure that the guy who I sold the tubes to will be 3 times happier with the sylvania tubes than I was !

Now the melz tubes and the 6f8g's. So far these are my favorite tubes in the cayin ha300. Their midrange is simply magnificent. Vocals are great, acoustics are great. You have amazing bass as well. I had a lot of difficulty choosing one pair or the other. In the end, I feel like the 6f8g's offer a slightly bigger soundstage. I also prefer the tone of the 6f8g's. They just sound very natural and they don't add any coloration to the sound. You can get adapters for these on ebay no problem, and they aren't that expensive either.

Conclusion : I like this amp very much, compared to my woo audio wa22 it has a huge soundstage. Better bass (on some albums I did not hear many details, but now I do) , better instrument separation (thanks to the 300B magic) , now cymbals are more detailed than ever. The kick drums have a lot more impact. I could go on and on and on but I'm not very good at describing what I hear. Just being honest. I just know that I do not regret my decision buying this amp, simply because it kicks ass! And that the 300B tubes that I currently own (takatsuki 300B) are definitely the main factor in my amp right now. These are getting very rare, and lately they've been selling for absurd prices. People often compare them to the western electric's, and for good reason. I like them very much, let's just say I don't miss the stock 300B'S at all.

If anyone has recommendations for tubes to roll in this amp, please tell me because I'm not done yet !

I'm very surprised that the 6SN7W metal base tube didn't work out for you, but I found it to be a massive improvement over the previous Shuguang tubes, the Psvane CV-181-TII, and the 3-hole Sylvania bad boys I had. Then again, I did managed to get a NOS pair, but even the not as new pair I auditioned from my friend sounded fantastic. Coupled with the Psvane ACME 300b, I found the on my Audeze LCD-3F headphones, I had bigger soundstage, clearer air, faster/snappier more-defined texture, sweeter midrange voice, and tighter bass. I didn't have as much boy in the midbass and bass as I'd like, but the PS Audio Stellar Audio Power Plant 3 and the Sablon Audio 2020 Panatella Reserva USB cable added that while improving everything all around. Right now, I can't even listen to the Chord Hugo TT2's stock headphone amp without feeling like I'm missing a lot of special sound when I go through the HA-300 instead.