[Whitigir]

Happy new year to Cayin and Andy

 

[b0ssMax]

For those that received theirs, when you remove the c9 from the box, underneath there is a square cutout , not very deep, as if a card or something should be there, but there is nothing in mine. Did anyone else notice this?

Nothing should be there, but there there is a pull down on the front (outside) and you slide out like a drawer the accessories. The cutout actually peeks into the area of that drawer. if that makes sense.

 

[Whitigir]

The C9 has a very precisely controlled volume wheels

*Ways better than DMP Z1
*Ways and Ways better than MAX alone

I gotta say that it allows adjustments so finely that listening to an IER-Z1R with a very powerful amp is very “Enjoyable”

I previously was never able to enjoy the Z1R this way, Eventhough I like the Z1R and always prefer to have more power to drive it, neither DMP nor the Max is preferable. Why ? Because I was never able to finely adjust the volume the ways I wanted, it is either too loud or too low....and most of the time would have a slight channel imbalances that throw the imaging and sound scape off balances

Cayin ! Congratulations!!! With the C9, you have demonstrated to me and my very personal experiences that you can do, and so is your C9, in my opinion, the finest Portable amplifier to date!!! Whether it is driving HD800S or my IeR Z1R

 

[Whitigir]

Do I need an additional Amplifier for portable system if I only use In ear buds ?
This has been the question forever for our folks. Please allow me a moment to share my thoughts with everyone.

First of all, dedicated Amp are also into different segments, and mostly can be categorized into Mid and High end tier (2 tiers). If you specifically speaking into C9, then C9 is the High-End tier, no doubt.

Now, Practicality, There is never enough power. How so ? The density of the tonal body, the level of controls on each notes, plays, bridges, and then the textures, the details, the finesses. All in all, an amplifier job is to amplify an analog signal to be more powerful and remain constant in it power distributions. That is given the movements of your playback gears, the impedance changes according to all the frequencies, and so a good amplifications is ideally never starving out or lacking the power to amplify the signal to the level at any given specific frequencies. It is easier said than done for anything in life.

1/ Why an Amp ? Because with a separate battery and power supply rails, the external amplifier will always have it own to run on, and technically speaking, that is already an improvement over any All in One solution. The cross talks would improve.

2/ Why not to stack up an Amp ? Because it is a stack, and you will lose the ability to carry it around as you will need additional space, cables, charger, and the ability to pocket it

I am still confused....Do I need an amp ?
It depends on what you are looking to achieve. Most of the time 80% of it, having an additional amp will almost always improve your playback experiences and performances. But because you are into portability world, the gain VS the practicality will be diminished on a scale. Let’s look into the %20 of why you don’t need an Amp.

1/ If you have invested heavily into flagship players, and mostly Expensive one. Why ?
Yes, I know the HiFiMan joke about it being expensive, it has to sound good. But the fact is that, being expensive just means that the R&D to Production cost VS MSRP have to be sustainable in any business models. So, in the market where Competitions are everywhere, there is no room for errors. Given the facts that when customers perceive a flaw in your execution of a product whether in Price/performances/support/reliability. Your reputation is damaged and it is less likely that specific customer would return.
For those reasons alone, as a customer, you are almost guaranteed that an expensive products are always a good call to judge a company products
So, once you have invested into a Flagship of a company DAP, for example, do you need an amp ? The answer is that , Yes you Do and also No you dont

A/ Yes: It only makes senses to seek for a very high end and flagship Amplifier to pair with your flagship DAP. Why ? Because the implementations, the level of engineering, the cost to develope and produce such a niche Amplifier is substantial and that would mean that most of the time these Amplifier are very expensive, but is also at the top top of the engineering scale. And because form/size is always matter, together with being a dedicated device. You are almost guaranteed to have an improvements. Howmuch % of improvement will you gain ? Whether it is worth it ? That is your call, and I say let your ears be the judge

B/ No, you don’t need an Amp: this is true when you only looking to amplify your system with a flagship DAP and a cheap Mid tier Amp. Why ? Because Even-though given it being dedicated, the development and cost to productions were too low to guarantee a good engineering level for any company to perceive it as a substantial business model. In this case, most of the time, there will be degradations of sound as it would have to conduct through multiple connections. Though the fact that being a separated device, you would still benefit with an improved cross talk. However, you would be trading in for the compromises of less Dynamic range as the amplifiers were never invested in the degree to guarantee a constant power delivery for all frequencies, and sometimes even Harmonic distortions would hugely be degraded due to the architecture of an amplifiers.
So in the case of looking for a low cost external amplifier ? For your high end DAPS ? I would say No, because not worth it. Not because you don’t benefit from it
What to look for when choosing an amplifier ? Power output is one factor. The most important is THD (total harmonic distortion) and (Dynamic Range).

So why do I call C9 as a being of a very high end portable Amplifier ? For Paper tiger fun alone. I challenge anyone to compare any other portable Amplifier on the market to outperform the C9 in all 3 essential aspects: Power output, THD, Dynamic Range

Now, as I said, let one’s ears be the judge. For my own experiences, the C9 stands as a top of this mountain, where proper amplifications and portability are counted for. The performances is nothing short of breathes taking. Your experiences will varies, and so please be your own judge.
Would C9 be a worthy investment ? Yes! A huge Yes, especially if you are into portability. It can not get better than this at the moment....I can’t speak for the future. But given the nature of the C9 as being a very sophisticated high end amplifier, the C9 can do your Source and gears justices Guaranteed, regardless if you are using mid tier DAPs as a source or high end DAPS. The C9 will always show improvements for your systems..... and of course the better the source, the better the C9 will show it potentials. For example, my Dx300-M8-Max, and Max clearly stood out

Allow me to repeat, one of the special feature of the C9 is that it was designed with In Ears and sensitive gears in mind. The C9 has flawless Volume controls, Gain controls, and that level of Blackness in the Background !!!!

 

[noplsestar]

Do I need an additional Amplifier for portable system if I only use In ear buds ?
This has been the question forever for our folks. Please allow me a moment to share my thoughts with everyone.

First of all, dedicated Amp are also into different segments, and mostly can be categorized into Mid and High end tier (2 tiers). If you specifically speaking into C9, then C9 is the High-End tier, no doubt.

Now, Practicality, There is never enough power. How so ? The density of the tonal body, the level of controls on each notes, plays, bridges, and then the textures, the details, the finesses. All in all, an amplifier job is to amplify an analog signal to be more powerful and remain constant in it power distributions. That is given the movements of your playback gears, the impedance changes according to all the frequencies, and so a good amplifications is ideally never starving out or lacking the power to amplify the signal to the level at any given specific frequencies. It is easier said than done for anything in life.

1/ Why an Amp ? Because with a separate battery and power supply rails, the external amplifier will always have it own to run on, and technically speaking, that is already an improvement over any All in One solution. The cross talks would improve.

2/ Why not to stack up an Amp ? Because it is a stack, and you will lose the ability to carry it around as you will need additional space, cables, charger, and the ability to pocket it

I am still confused....Do I need an amp ?
It depends on what you are looking to achieve. Most of the time 80% of it, having an additional amp will almost always improve your playback experiences and performances. But because you are into portability world, the gain VS the practicality will be diminished on a scale. Let’s look into the %20 of why you don’t need an Amp.

1/ If you have invested heavily into flagship players, and mostly Expensive one. Why ?
Yes, I know the HiFiMan joke about it being expensive, it has to sound good. But the fact is that, being expensive just means that the R&D to Production cost VS MSRP have to be sustainable in any business models. So, in the market where Competitions are everywhere, there is no room for errors. Given the facts that when customers perceive a flaw in your execution of a product whether in Price/performances/support/reliability. Your reputation is damaged and it is less likely that specific customer would return.
For those reasons alone, as a customer, you are almost guaranteed that an expensive products are always a good call to judge a company products
So, once you have invested into a Flagship of a company DAP, for example, do you need an amp ? The answer is that , Yes you Do and also No you dont

A/ Yes: It only makes senses to seek for a very high end and flagship Amplifier to pair with your flagship DAP. Why ? Because the implementations, the level of engineering, the cost to develope and produce such a niche Amplifier is substantial and that would mean that most of the time these Amplifier are very expensive, but is also at the top top of the engineering scale. And because form/size is always matter, together with being a dedicated device. You are almost guaranteed to have an improvements. Howmuch % of improvement will you gain ? Whether it is worth it ? That is your call, and I say let your ears be the judge

B/ No, you don’t need an Amp: this is true when you only looking to amplify your system with a flagship DAP and a cheap Mid tier Amp. Why ? Because Even-though given it being dedicated, the development and cost to productions were too low to guarantee a good engineering level for any company to perceive it as a substantial business model. In this case, most of the time, there will be degradations of sound as it would have to conduct through multiple connections. Though the fact that being a separated device, you would still benefit with an improved cross talk. However, you would be trading in for the compromises of less Dynamic range as the amplifiers were never invested in the degree to guarantee a constant power delivery for all frequencies, and sometimes even Harmonic distortions would hugely be degraded due to the architecture of an amplifiers.
So in the case of looking for a low cost external amplifier ? For your high end DAPS ? I would say No, because not worth it. Not because you don’t benefit from it
What to look for when choosing an amplifier ? Power output is one factor. The most important is THD (total harmonic distortion) and (Dynamic Range).

So why do I call C9 as a being of a very high end portable Amplifier ? For Paper tiger fun alone. I challenge anyone to compare any other portable Amplifier on the market to outperform the C9 in all 3 essential aspects: Power output, THD, Dynamic Range

Now, as I said, let one’s ears be the judge. For my own experiences, the C9 stands as a top of this mountain, where proper amplifications and portability are counted for. The performances is nothing short of breathes taking. Your experiences will varies, and so please be your own judge.
Would C9 be a worthy investment ? Yes! A huge Yes, especially if you are into portability. It can not get better than this at the moment....I can’t speak for the future. But given the nature of the C9 as being a very sophisticated high end amplifier, the C9 can do your Source and gears justices Guaranteed, regardless if you are using mid tier DAPs as a source or high end DAPS. The C9 will always show improvements for your systems..... and of course the better the source, the better the C9 will show it potentials. For example, my Dx300-M8-Max, and Max clearly stood out

Allow me to repeat, one of the special feature of the C9 is that it was designed with In Ears and sensitive gears in mind. The C9 has flawless Volume controls, Gain controls, and that level of Blackness in the Background !!!!

Here is a more technical post about why volume levels itself isn’t the problem but does the amp have enough current and are the dynamics of the headphone really being reveiled?
This is an interesting posting by @Liberatus if anyone wants to did deeper in that topic:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/dia...byss-headphones.777618/page-172#post-15884384

Also @Whitigir concerning your „challenge“ to beat the C9. Do you by any chance have the possibility to compare the Romi Audio BX-2+ with the C9? Should be a fun TOTL portability amp shootout

 

[jonstatt]

The C9 has a very precisely controlled volume wheels

*Ways better than DMP Z1
*Ways and Ways better than MAX alone

I gotta say that it allows adjustments so finely that listening to an IER-Z1R with a very powerful amp is very “Enjoyable”

I previously was never able to enjoy the Z1R this way, Eventhough I like the Z1R and always prefer to have more power to drive it, neither DMP nor the Max is preferable. Why ? Because I was never able to finely adjust the volume the ways I wanted, it is either too loud or too low....and most of the time would have a slight channel imbalances that throw the imaging and sound scape off balances

Cayin ! Congratulations!!! With the C9, you have demonstrated to me and my very personal experiences that you can do, and so is your C9, in my opinion, the finest Portable amplifier to date!!! Whether it is driving HD800S or my IeR Z1R

What about the sound quality compared to the admittedly beautiful but quirky dmp-z1 ?

 

[jonstatt]

Another thing to keep in mind, my ATH-R70x is 3.5mm terminated, not balanced. So, I was running C9 in low gain with a volume set to 50% from SE output. If I would to run it off the BAL output, volume would have been much lower since:

Do you have a Thummim to try with the C9. I can't get over the synergy of this combination.

 

[Whitigir]

Here is a more technical post about why volume levels itself isn’t the problem but does the amp have enough current and are the dynamics of the headphone really being reveiled?
This is an interesting posting by @Liberatus if anyone wants to did deeper in that topic:
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/dia...byss-headphones.777618/page-172#post-15884384

Also @Whitigir concerning your „challenge“ to beat the C9. Do you by any chance have the possibility to compare the Romi Audio BX-2+ with the C9? Should be a fun TOTL portability amp shootout

The reasons why I did not invest into BX2 + Even-though it was cheaper

1/ It does a lot of LDO conversion to raise and boost the voltage rails from 3.7V into higher . The C9 runs straight from 8.8V rails directly (Dual)

2/ BX2 + doesn’t have dual Korg, Pre in, Class A/AB

3/ BX2 have no removable 18650

Hence I said the C9 is a very sophisticated high end Amplifier. Yes, the other specifications the BX2 + is very competitive. But Power supply and the battery supplied voltage is the heart of every Battery devices. The less conversions is the better.

Unfortunately, I don’t have raining $ into the pocket, So I don’t think I am going to invest into BX2 just for the sake of comparison. For this purposes, I will take @twister6 impressions as is

 

[Whitigir]

Hahahaha....yes I forgot that class A can run pretty hot. Is there a major sound difference between A and AB tube?

This is SS as timbres of choice.....Yes, class AB has faster transient and better controls where class A is almost tube like but at a better textures and resolutions than Korg Tubes timbres.

The AB has more punches than Class A due to this better controls. Very addictive with EDM kinda music , especially Daft

 

[noplsestar]

The reasons why I did not invest into BX2 + Even-though it was cheaper

1/ It does a lot of LDO conversion to raise and boost the voltage rails from 3.7V into higher . The C9 runs straight from 8.8V rails directly

2/ BX2 + doesn’t have dual Korg, Pre in, Class A/AB

3/ BX2 have no removable 18650

Hence I said the C9 is a very sophisticated high end Amplifier. Yes, the other specifications the BX2 + is very competitive. But Power supply and the battery supplied voltage is the heart of every Battery devices. The less conversions is the better.

Unfortunately, I don’t have raining $ into the pocket, So I don’t think I am going to invest into BX2 just for the sake of comparison. For this purposes, I will take @twister6 impressions as is

But it is smaller
Jokes aside, I get it. Though, specifications aside, the Romi Audio amp seems to deliver a more transparent signal, more true to the source, which might be a good thing, or might not, depending on the source/chain (i.e. cable) as well as of course the headphone itself. Alas Twister only has the BX-2, the older version of the BX-2+, but it’s better than nothing I guess

 

[Whitigir]

But it is smaller
Jokes aside, I get it. Though, specifications aside, the Romi Audio amp seems to deliver a more transparent signal, more true to the source, which might be a good thing, or might not, depending on the source/chain (i.e. cable) as well as of course the headphone itself. Alas Twister only has the BX-2, the older version of the BX-2+, but it’s better than nothing I guess

Should be an excellent choice for affordability while cutting off the timbres and classes of amp as an options. But then again, if you want everything the C9 offers, you may want to 4x the price of the BX2+ . Now that would also put the BX2 arguably into flagship design isn’t it ? Whether they can or not doing it is another matter.

Not sure if being more transparent is a better thing than having a fuller body and textures. In my opinions and experiences, having compromises of the body density will yield a better airiness and transparency....but do I want my Organic guitar to sound like an Electric guitar ? Definitely Not

The one thing with KORG on C9 is that it takes at least 20 minutes to start to sound more refined. This is the thing most of the sophisticated tubes amps do inherit though.

 

[Deffy]

This is gorgeous! Wish I could afford it right now but definitely something to save towards to Cayin makes beautiful stuff, top of the line and esthetically Pleasing!

 

[Whitigir]

This is gorgeous! Wish I could afford it right now but definitely something to save towards to Cayin makes beautiful stuff, top of the line and esthetically Pleasing!

Talk about aesthetically pleasing. The design is flawless, symmetrical everywhere....even the perfections of weight distributions from side to side and front to back with batteries installed. I would think that this weight distributions is a super car in design

 

[Deffy]

Talk about aesthetically pleasing. The design is flawless, symmetrical everywhere....even the perfections of weight distributions from side to side and front to back with batteries installed. I would think that this weight distributions is a super car in design

And as far as I can tell by the way you described it in your posts it performs like one as well It seems very much that this is the item I should get and never want for anything else

 

[aaf evo]

Okay so I have a stupid question. If I already have an ibasso dx220 max and 300, what benefit for my iems do I get for adding a Cayin C9 to the equation? I’m new to amps.