Disagree vehemently. NDH-30 has plenty of faults, and IMO more of them than things less than half the price. NDH-30 has quality control/unit variation issues, headband discomfort, too much weight, significant positional variance, midrange suckout (2kHz) and overly-dulled treble. I’d say HD650 only shares about half of those problems.
IMO there’s just no reason to spend $650 on NDH-30 when you can spend 30% of that on HD650, which has better QC, comfort, build, and sonics across the board except for perhaps raw bass extension.
NDH-30 continues the trend that 560S started where bass extension seemingly as a major design goal causes them to introduce significant acoustic impedance and heavily damp the system to bring bass SPL relatively higher. It results in it being an incredibly dull listen.
With 660S2 they did this by lowering driver F0, which is no doubt a better way to do this, but IMO still not worth it to do when people already like the driver like with HD 800S.
These products *are precisely* the reason we are worried about bass extension being overly harped on, as it leads to (in the cases of 560S, 8XX, NDH-30) overdamping the system.
660S2 was a genuine improvement over the 660S, but not over the previous predecessors. But the trend of Sennheiser’s recent releases focusing on bass extension is hard to debate, as basically everything since the first 660S has targeted bass extension as a goal (and been marketed to reflect that goal).
I want to be clear, I’m not saying we’re against bass. I’m saying, acoustically the compromises that come with how you add more bass to a headphone are predictable in how they would negatively affect other metrics, and the trade off just isn’t worth it usually IMO.
I am sorry to conclude that this is an answer from someone who can not even start to imagine how the NDH 30 sounds or feels. It is clear that you have never touched one (not even talking about listening to it). These are just random collected complaints irrelevant with the actual product - apart from the "very heavy" ...352 gr! Heavier than the HD-800S by the vast amount of 22gr !!! LoL (I will comfort you by saying that my pair weighs 372gr actually). Let's be serious about weight...
Product variation is something I hate and can hardly forgive. I can't comprehend how many manufacturers accept it. If this happend to Neumann too, they know how to solve it, once and for all. Moreover, Sennheiser says for Neumann (exact words):
"Neumann is incredibly strict on tolerances for this model (NDH 30)
in a way that it's on the edge of what's possible in headphone series production, which may contribute to positive characteristics like soundstage".
A slight and very careful implemented midrange "suckout" of the NDH 30, practically inaudible, scares an HD-800 admirer??? Strange, since the HD-800 has a larger and deeper one (crinacle, solderdude, and others), but you love it as it is.
Headband discomfort? Yes, sometimes I forget to take my headphones off after the music stops, while working in my office. If I have been listening for 2-3 hours, an extra idle hour might annoy me and remind me that I am wearing them without reason. I would like a wider headband with a little deeper foam. Uncomfortable it is not!
Significant positioning variance? No, only SLIGHT because of the off-centered and angled drivers. The hype about this started by an unfortunate user (NDH 30 thread) who didn't realize he was wearing the headphones reversed, with the drivers firing almost from behind his ears. It has been proven much later. That way, the variance is big and the sound has much less treble. Wearing them correctly a few times (cable on the RIGHT) makes the user position them exactly and intuitively. We are talking about a non existing problem after the first uses.
Incredibly dull listen??? I am 53 but have always cared for my hearing. My high frequency loss is minimal for my age. Sometimes I feel I need more treble with the NDH 30, sometimes less. It is the recordings not the headphones. With the HD-800 almost all young persons dislike the excess of treble, I certainly did and rejected it many years ago. HD-800S repaired the treble issue but not completely. If you read somewhere that the NDH 30 is dull, please read the NDH 30 thread, filtering out all that you think is hype. The rest is enough. Or much better, dare to listen to it. But I warn you, it will ruin it for you. You will be forced to reconsider many things as many already did. The world advances, it is not magic, it is technology and knowledge combined by two major makers Sennheiser and Neumann.
[When you will listen to it, you are going to laugh remembering that you compared it to the HD-650. Which is my most loved headphone through the years. Bought in 2003 and again in 2022, two fine working and extremely enjoyable pairs. But the NDH 30 is a big improvement in everything sonically.]
