Bowers & Wilkins PX Noise-Cancelling Over-ears

Jan 15, 2018 at 12:33 PM Post #1,681 of 2,912
unfortunatelly ill have to bid farewell to you, good people of this topic, the px has to be sent back.
some people in the future might find my experiences helpful so here is why.

(((the story so far. my christmas gift from my family was a pair of noise cancelling headphoes of my choice. my use was to be home use with a pc, excluding the damned noisy neighbours of my life. most sources acclaimed the bose qc 35 and sony wh-1000xm2. as the bose doesnt support aptx i chose the sony. i was quite content with it, anc is superb, sq is good, comfortable, extensive app options. on the bad side noticeable latency - i set my video player to -150ms i think -, plasticky feel, stupid auto turn-off. then, after 2-3 days i could hear a constant pink noise-like hissing on the left and i sent it back. the second pair of sony showed the same issue on the right side after only one day (NOT my ears!), plus the dreaded headband cackling. sent it back, and thought about my next move. of the sennheiser hd1 only the pink floyd edition is available in my country, expensive as hell and ugly, the pxc 550 pricey and reportedly inferior anc compared to the bose and sony, i didnt want the bose because of the lack of aptx, there arent too many good opinions around of the plantronics - so i started to read up on the px and the b&o h9. there werent direct comparisons in the matter of anc to the bose/sony level, so i asked around here - thanks folks for the replies! - and chose the px.)))

first day.
-these are one sexy pair of headphones. not as pretty as on the pictures but photoshop could make even me prettier.
-there was a lot of pressure on my head (i think i have a medium-sized head) + a very uncomfortable sense of pressure in my ears, both resulting in a feeling just this side of a headache. still, im a you-break-me-in i-break-you-in kinda guy (had a few martens boots in my youth) and didnt lose hope.
-range is great, they almost never skipped when venturing to the kitchen or bathroom. the sony was worse.
-build seems to be very convincing. they look and feel as they could last a decade or more (at least structurally).
-on/off sensors are stupid. i take them off, nothing happens, take them back on, the music stops. still this can be adjusted in the phone app, so again i didnt care much (i dont own an android or apple phone, playing with the app requires of me a short trip to my brother)
-connecting to pc is a hassle. after sending the cans and my pc (and myself) to sleep and wake all the aforementioned up in different order the px connects automatically to the pc (via a logilink aptx capable csr dongle) but theres no sound. i had to open bt devices, enter the headphone profiles window, disconnect the a2dp profile and reconnect it. this is absurd to do twice a day, there was no need to jump such hoops with the sony. i did everything i could (power management in windows, pm of the dongle, setting autoconnect in the bt software), nothing helped.

second/third day.
-comfort got much better.
-became a hesitant believer of the burn-in theory though im still not sure if the cans burn in or my ears get used to their sound. (< means sound got better for me.)
-played around a bit and to my greatest surprise i found that there is no noticeable bt lag. to my knowledge it is unheard of with aptx hd headphones!!!
-played around with anc. my greatest grief with my neighbours is the thumping noise of the kids running around and drumming, same family, two floors(!) above so in my case the anc has to do a good job in low frequencies. the sony did a great job of this, so did a bose qc 25 that was lent to me. a quick test revealed (me beating my desk with my nails, me thumping a wall with my palm, neither of them hard) that the px does next to nothing with these kind of noises. i didnt get desperate (yet) as i (dis)remembered i read somewhere that the default level of anc is not the strongest and voice pass-through might be enabled - lets see the app first, i thought.
-in the garden next to our house people did some work (20 meters at least). my window was open a bit (10cm) and though i couldnt hear what they talk about i could very clearly hear them - with anc on. again, i didnt lose hope, see the point above.

fourth day.
-its weekend, my neighbours are most active this time of the week. anc didnt do much with the incoming sensory assaults, so i rode to my brother - lets see that app! a most disappointing result: anc was on its maximum already and voice passthru was off. so i had to realize: from this pair of cans i can only expect this much (next to nothing) in the matter of defending me from the outside world - desperation beckons... i decided to leave the pair with my brother to play with them a bit and i will send them back next week...

i left out a few things that many people discussed before, yes, sq is usb-c > bt aptx; anc off > anc on. the 8x pairing, 2x connection is great.

im not sure where to go from here. anything that might be better is even more expensive. i think ill get a denon ah-gc20 which is far from being acclaimed much but according to the measurements of rtings.com they do a great (not excellent) job on low frequency noise cancelling. if thats not enough ill move backwards (mobility, possibly sq-wise), bite the bullet and acquire a bose qc 25...

anyway, i was warned and can only repeat: these are great cans, plenty to love here but if youre looking for a pair of anc headphones, forget these. think of the anc of the px as an added extra feature - you shouldnt buy these with anc in mind.

so so long and thanks for all the fish (and replies and advices and information)!

Without a phone how did you upgrade the firmware? How did you play with the different ANC settings to see what does and doesn't work in your environment?

Not defending the ANC, as I don't particularly like it but without a smart phone the PX's are pretty dumb by default.
 
Jan 15, 2018 at 1:06 PM Post #1,683 of 2,912
I may have missed it, but has anyone already tried using the PX on Android with an USB-C to USB-C cable?
 
Jan 15, 2018 at 3:58 PM Post #1,684 of 2,912
I may have missed it, but has anyone already tried using the PX on Android with an USB-C to USB-C cable?

I was able to use the the stock USB-C cable that came with the PX, plus a USB Type-A to Mini USB converter to play audio over USB with my S7.

I don't think there should be any issue playing audio over USB-C, but I don't have the hardware to test it out.
 
Jan 15, 2018 at 4:27 PM Post #1,685 of 2,912
I ordered a Belkin Duratek USB-C -> USB-C cable .. It will arrive tomorrow. Will then test whether it works on my Note 8 and LG V30 ... Would be great because it would mean that there's no more need for that USB-C to USB-A OTG adapter that I am now carrying along all the time ..
 
Jan 16, 2018 at 8:27 AM Post #1,686 of 2,912
I ordered a Belkin Duratek USB-C -> USB-C cable .. It will arrive tomorrow. Will then test whether it works on my Note 8 and LG V30 ... Would be great because it would mean that there's no more need for that USB-C to USB-A OTG adapter that I am now carrying along all the time ..

And ... works flawlessly ... So for those who do not have high-end USB DACS connected to their Android devices, but still would like to benefit from the PX 24/48 DAC without having to carry an USB-A to USB-C OTG/adapter, a simple USB-C to USB-C male-male adapter works fine ... And with this cable USB Audio Player PRO allows you to play the Tidal MQA streams in 24/48 resolution ...
 
Jan 16, 2018 at 8:33 AM Post #1,687 of 2,912
And ... works flawlessly ... So for those who do not have high-end USB DACS connected to their Android devices, but still would like to benefit from the PX 24/48 DAC without having to carry an USB-A to USB-C OTG/adapter, a simple USB-C to USB-C male-male adapter works fine ... And with this cable USB Audio Player PRO allows you to play the Tidal MQA streams in 24/48 resolution ...

That's great news. I'm curious how this effects battery:

1. Does the headphone battery still drain?
2. Does the phone battery drain more compared to BlueTooth?
3. If the PX were at 0% battery, could you use them via USB C - USB C

Any ideas?
 
Jan 16, 2018 at 8:45 AM Post #1,688 of 2,912
And ... works flawlessly ... So for those who do not have high-end USB DACS connected to their Android devices, but still would like to benefit from the PX 24/48 DAC without having to carry an USB-A to USB-C OTG/adapter, a simple USB-C to USB-C male-male adapter works fine ... And with this cable USB Audio Player PRO allows you to play the Tidal MQA streams in 24/48 resolution ...

On Windows and Mac the maximum rate the PX operate is 16 bit, 48000 Hz. Is it different on Android?
 
Jan 16, 2018 at 8:53 AM Post #1,690 of 2,912
That's great news. I'm curious how this effects battery:

1. Does the headphone battery still drain?
2. Does the phone battery drain more compared to BlueTooth?
3. If the PX were at 0% battery, could you use them via USB C - USB C

Any ideas?

1: The battery on the PX will be charged from the Android phone. No change compared to a OTG adapter + stock USB-C cable setup.
2: Not tested yet.
3. Irrelevant because if the PX were at 0% battery it would recharge from the Android device anyway.
 
Jan 16, 2018 at 8:54 AM Post #1,691 of 2,912
You just convinced me not to buy them.
No 24-bit? No go.

Rash conclusion on incorrect info. On Android, the PX function in 24 bit / 48khz mode. In WIndows, the PX function in 16-bit mode. But not because of the PX but because of the lack of a driver. To my knowledge there are no headphone manufacturers yet who supply a 24-bit Windows driver with their headphones. That currently is limited to USB DAC manufacturers ...
 
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Jan 16, 2018 at 8:59 AM Post #1,692 of 2,912
That's great news. I'm curious how this effects battery:

1. Does the headphone battery still drain?
2. Does the phone battery drain more compared to BlueTooth?
3. If the PX were at 0% battery, could you use them via USB C - USB C

Any ideas?
1. of course digital analogue conversion needs power
Rash conclusion on incorrect info. In windows as well as on Android, the PX function in 24 bit / 48khz mode ...

By default, that is the maximum. Maybe you can use some other drivers to unlock 24bit?
 
Jan 16, 2018 at 9:16 AM Post #1,693 of 2,912

Rash conclusion on incorrect info. On Android, the PX function in 24 bit / 48khz mode. In WIndows, the PX function in 16-bit mode. But not because of the PX but because of the lack of a driver. To my knowledge there are no headphone manufacturers yet who supply a 24-bit Windows driver with their headphones. That currently is limited to USB DAC manufacturers ...

I did not say the PX is incapable of operating at 24-bit. I said on Windows and Mac it is operating in 16-bit mode. Maybe I was wrong with the Mac.
But I think it is irrelevant if the PX supports but the OS does not, you still have bottleneck of 16-bit (which by the way I think is enough for the most of us).
 
Jan 16, 2018 at 11:23 AM Post #1,694 of 2,912
1. of course digital analogue conversion needs power


By default, that is the maximum. Maybe you can use some other drivers to unlock 24bit?

When driven by an appropriate Android app (for instance USB Audio Player Pro or Neutron) the PX can be driven at 24bit/48khz ..(as long as the audio file has this resolution or higher)
 
Jan 16, 2018 at 4:22 PM Post #1,695 of 2,912
And ... works flawlessly ... So for those who do not have high-end USB DACS connected to their Android devices, but still would like to benefit from the PX 24/48 DAC without having to carry an USB-A to USB-C OTG/adapter, a simple USB-C to USB-C male-male adapter works fine ... And with this cable USB Audio Player PRO allows you to play the Tidal MQA streams in 24/48 resolution ...
I have the PX but havent found a usc-cable that works so i just took your advice and ordered one from Amazon. Question: when used with normal 3.5 cable there is a hissing sound. Is that not present when running with the usb-c cable?
 

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