[mainguy]

Hey if they send me another one to test and it's better then I'll be the first to amend that statement. In an ideal world I'd test like 10 of each and plot the averages and sample tolerances. But sadly that's not always doable.

That would be great but tough, ten grand of PX8s and Bathys'. Thanks for doing the measurements so diligently, it was quite something to see the variance of 5909 with ANC off and on.

Have you had a chance to directly compare vocals on PX8 and Bathys? I did find them more forward and fuller on the former and it was a noticeable difference. Would be interesting to hear your impressions of that, if you still have them on hand or did such a comparison.

Your measurements seems vastly different to DHRME review measurements.

Post in thread 'Bowers and Wilkins PX8 Wireless Discussion' https://www.head-fi.org/threads/bowers-and-wilkins-px8-wireless-discussion.964955/post-17233902

On that note B&W do have boosted bass a lot of the time, check out this P9 measurement

https://headphonetestlab.co.uk/test-results-manufacturers-a-d-bw-p9-signature

The thing with this boosted bass for me is it's a double edged sword. I have a feeling it's behind the full luscious vocals on P9/PX8 which I really like. At other times it can be overbearing. That said, I find PX8 bass nowhere near as overpowering as P9 so I was suprised by the headphones.com graph

Good lord, what is with everyone in this thread? .

I love the drama, keeps me coming back here. I'm sure Angelom will be back soon to throw some more gasoline on the fire then we can really get going.

 

[JoePR31]

The thing with this boosted bass for me is it's a double edged sword. I have a feeling it's behind the full luscious vocals on P9/PX8 which I really like. At other times it can be overbearing. That said, I find PX8 bass nowhere near as overpowering as P9 so I was suprised by the headphones.com graph.

This right here! There's no way that my PX8 has more bass than my P9, yet that's exactly what the headphones.com graph shows. I'm not some unreasonable fanboy, but that graph just doesn't reflect what I hear, and that isn't normal for me.

I typically find that graphs from most reputable sources align fairly closely with what I hear. Many times they help me gain a deeper understanding of the sound of a headphone. But, the PX8 graph in question does the opposite. It makes me question what I'm hearing.

 

[angelom]

Hey if they send me another one to test and it's better then I'll be the first to amend that statement. In an ideal world I'd test like 10 of each and plot the averages and sample tolerances. But sadly that's not always doable.

EDIT: and just to clarify, nothing about the results of this one indicate there's anything 'defective' going on here. Both channels measure like this, so that's an indication that this is at least representative to a certain extent.

Imagine that B&W sending you a second unit and this second unit is measuring really very well. And then suddenly B&W sending you email quickly saying that this second unit is actually defective but also confirming that not the first unit they sending you before because they testing that soon after they receiving the headphone.

 

[Benesyed]

Good lord, what is with everyone in this thread? . Resolve called this headphone "unlistenable", and you'd think he just called everyone's significant other ugly. It's like American politics in here. I'm seeing everything from whataboutisms, to racial slurs, to quoting other news sources to support my opinion. It's not that serious people .

In all seriousness, that is the norm with B&W headphones, people either love them or hate them. They're not tuned to be accurate and are typically not like other headphones which is one of the things I love about them. But when you're talking pure, resolving, analytical sound quality, Resolve is speaking as close as you can get to facts when it comes to sound. I too prefer the Bathys and 5909 when it comes to pure sound quality, at the same time I enjoy the PX8 too. With certain genres they sound amazing which is typical of B&W ANC headphones. However, there are times with certain genres where I feel like something's missing. Typically, it's either not enough treble detail, or a little muddiness in the bass/lower mids.

If you enjoy them, that's all that matters. Don't let criticism of your favorite headphones hurt your feelings. I promise you, Resolve will not be the last to call the PX8 unlistenable. From a technical standpoint, they will be a problem for many. Resolve is not the first I've seen who just flat out doesn't like the PX8.

For real! It's like people personally spent years researching and developing these headphones themselves!


You guys need to relax. Resolve is giving his honesty opinion. It doesn't mean they might not be great for you. One of my all time favorite videos is a reviewer having non headphone enthusiasts review headphones. The "better" pair isn't universal.
.

 

[Lakerfreak]

I don't think people enjoying the PX8 generally are doing so because of biases, or solely because of biases. Perhaps some are, but that alone just wouldn't explain the overwhelmingly positive response the headphone is getting.

I literally popped the Bathys and PX8 in front of my girlfriend, and just let her have a listen. She preferred the PX8 and said that vocals seemed more 'real' sounding. She didn't know the price, that's for sure (that's the last thing I want her to know).

For me at least all my biases were opposing this headphone. I'm already heavily into Focals, and had the expectation I'd prefer Bathys. But something about the PX8 enamoured me, vocals sound fuller, it has a more energetic, fun presentation. That's just to me, but my girlfriend did agree too - and she's got a damn good ear & has been a musician/voice actress for almost a decade. I say this only to qualify her, she's not just someone running around with airpods looking for a big bass response.

I'm not saying this to suggest PX8 is indeed exceptional, there are clearly other high performing BT headphones, only that some people do prefer it. And I think this preference is down to more complex elements than simple cognitive biases.

well said!

 

[cresny]

Yeah it's always possible - unit variation is a thing! Now... the one I tested definitely wasn't defective or anything like that, but across most headphones you can expect some variance depending on manufacturer tolerances. And yeah if I get another unit in I'll definitely measure and post the results. I expect that'll happen at some point.

Well, myself and one other here have confirmed defective units, where it seems that bad battery management is coupled with stepped down amplification. If when you charge and discharge the px8 the battery percentage seems "stuck" and does not smoothly increase and decrease, then it's likely that you also have a bad unit.

 

[tombrisbane]

If you enjoy them, that's all that matters.

So much this; if you own them and enjoy them (as I do), why does it matter?

 

[Maukey]

I don't think people enjoying the PX8 generally are doing so because of biases, or solely because of biases. Perhaps some are, but that alone just wouldn't explain the overwhelmingly positive response the headphone is getting.

I literally popped the Bathys and PX8 in front of my girlfriend, and just let her have a listen. She preferred the PX8 and said that vocals seemed more 'real' sounding. She didn't know the price, that's for sure (that's the last thing I want her to know).

For me at least all my biases were opposing this headphone. I'm already heavily into Focals, and had the expectation I'd prefer Bathys. But something about the PX8 enamoured me, vocals sound fuller, it has a more energetic, fun presentation. That's just to me, but my girlfriend did agree too - and she's got a damn good ear & has been a musician/voice actress for almost a decade. I say this only to qualify her, she's not just someone running around with airpods looking for a big bass response.

I'm not saying this to suggest PX8 is indeed exceptional, there are clearly other high performing BT headphones, only that some people do prefer it. And I think this preference is down to more complex elements than simple cognitive biases.

Your fondness for Focal and going with the PX8 makes sense to me. Sometimes we just need a headphone that's different than what we're accustomed to/what's in our collection.

I personally don't have biases when it comes to brand. We all have biases to some degree when it comes to sound based on our musical experiences, what our preferred genres are, how we've listened to music throughout our life, etc. You mentioned your wife being a musician/voice actress, well, she still has biases even with her good ear. Unless she's a musican/voice actress that's involved with all of the genres out there, and plays/understands every instrument, she has a bias based on what she sings and plays. I myself am a musician (drummer) and singer and have been for 25+years. I don't sing or play country, classical, edm, dubstep, etc. I do/have played Gospel, R&B, HipHop, Jazz, Funk, and a little Rock. Guess what, my bias tends to focus on how those genres sound, and how drums sound. I can almost guarantee that in some form or fashion, that will be completely different than what your wife listens for and to. While cymbals not sounding detailed and having the correct shimmer and tonality may bug me, for someone else that may not be an issue. They may get bugged out by the reverb of a guitar not being captured accurately or vocals being too distant. A good ear and being a professional musician don't make you less bias, I'd argue that it can make you worse.

 

[h-man]

So I’ve had my Px8 for a month now, and I do enjoy them, although they are far from “neutral”. I think the liveliness in the bass gives most of what I listen to a welcome boost. I also respect @Resolve and generally trust his measurements and opinions - so I’m hopefully going to get a pair of the Bathys too, and keep whichever one I like the most. I just think that it’s fantastic that we are getting some very decent sounding bluetooth noise cancelling options, although I think they are still far too expensive - a £299 pair of sundaras kills any of these for sound quality, but you can’t exactly wear those on the London Underground!

 

[Denkmal]

So I’ve had my Px8 for a month now, and I do enjoy them, although they are far from “neutral”. I think the liveliness in the bass gives most of what I listen to a welcome boost. I also respect @Resolve and generally trust his measurements and opinions - so I’m hopefully going to get a pair of the Bathys too, and keep whichever one I like the most. I just think that it’s fantastic that we are getting some very decent sounding bluetooth noise cancelling options, although I think they are still far too expensive - a £299 pair of sundaras kills any of these for sound quality, but you can’t exactly wear those on the London Underground!

Bathys is great. I ended up getting and most likely keeping both PX8 and Bathys.
But they are very different and good at different things. I find myself reaching for PX8 when I want to really rock out with music that has a lot of energy and drive, or recordings that may be poorly mastered, or music with lots of guitars or female voices.
Bathys has wider soundstage and a more detailed high end though which is really nice sometimes.

 

[Gweeds]

Resolve says PX8 have muddy treble but all the other reviews I’ve read like What Fi say different.
Here’s what WhatFi says:

Pros​

• +
  Outstanding clarity
• +
  Fast and punchy sonic presentation
• +
  Lovely build and impressive comfort

So I’m just puzzled .WhatFi ,even with their UK bias , is still pretty reliable.

What Hi-Fi also think the XM4 and 5 have amazing sound where to me they sound like someone has put a pillow over my ears.

 

[Denkmal]

What Hi-Fi also think the XM4 and 5 have amazing sound where to me they sound like someone has put a pillow over my ears.

Yeah I wouldnt read too much into What Hifi reviews. On the other hand I think we can conclude that 95% of the members here would agree that PX8 is neither particularly ”muddy” nor in the same league as Sony XM4/5…

 

[angelom]

Your fondness for Focal and going with the PX8 makes sense to me. Sometimes we just need a headphone that's different than what we're accustomed to/what's in our collection.

I personally don't have biases when it comes to brand. We all have biases to some degree when it comes to sound based on our musical experiences, what our preferred genres are, how we've listened to music throughout our life, etc. You mentioned your wife being a musician/voice actress, well, she still has biases even with her good ear. Unless she's a musican/voice actress that's involved with all of the genres out there, and plays/understands every instrument, she has a bias based on what she sings and plays. I myself am a musician (drummer) and singer and have been for 25+years. I don't sing or play country, classical, edm, dubstep, etc. I do/have played Gospel, R&B, HipHop, Jazz, Funk, and a little Rock. Guess what, my bias tends to focus on how those genres sound, and how drums sound. I can almost guarantee that in some form or fashion, that will be completely different than what your wife listens for and to. While cymbals not sounding detailed and having the correct shimmer and tonality may bug me, for someone else that may not be an issue. They may get bugged out by the reverb of a guitar not being captured accurately or vocals being too distant. A good ear and being a professional musician don't make you less bias, I'd argue that it can make you worse.

Is a misconception that people that playing an instrument (or singing) have better perception of good sound, and this misconception is true too even for many professional musicians.

Is not strange finding that when musicians have involvement in (re)mastering (more old) albums the results aren't always very good. This is one reason why in majority of cases other people that are not (professional) musicians, are responsible for making and creating good sounding albums.

 

[mainguy]

Your fondness for Focal and going with the PX8 makes sense to me. Sometimes we just need a headphone that's different than what we're accustomed to/what's in our collection.

I personally don't have biases when it comes to brand. We all have biases to some degree when it comes to sound based on our musical experiences, what our preferred genres are, how we've listened to music throughout our life, etc. You mentioned your wife being a musician/voice actress, well, she still has biases even with her good ear. Unless she's a musican/voice actress that's involved with all of the genres out there, and plays/understands every instrument, she has a bias based on what she sings and plays. I myself am a musician (drummer) and singer and have been for 25+years. I don't sing or play country, classical, edm, dubstep, etc. I do/have played Gospel, R&B, HipHop, Jazz, Funk, and a little Rock. Guess what, my bias tends to focus on how those genres sound, and how drums sound. I can almost guarantee that in some form or fashion, that will be completely different than what your wife listens for and to. While cymbals not sounding detailed and having the correct shimmer and tonality may bug me, for someone else that may not be an issue. They may get bugged out by the reverb of a guitar not being captured accurately or vocals being too distant. A good ear and being a professional musician don't make you less bias, I'd argue that it can make you worse.

You may be right, the PX8 gives me another signature so that is part of the appeal.

The musician/audiophile thing is interesting. Not speaking for myself but really talented, skilled musicians, they are very easily able to pick a song apart by ear, hear the individual notes and so on. I think that adds an interesting element when analysing a headphone as they often have some strong reference points. Perhaps it does introduce some bias too but I'd lean to it providing a more balanced overall picture. Active listening is a skill for sure and musicians have that ability in buckets, and it's super useful when evaluating a headphone.

Musicians use all those terms some audiophiles hate though. They describe the sound they hear in flowery terms, and they need to because how else can you communicate what the various parts of your chain do to the signal. FX and so on really do alter a guitar's sound, it's still the same note, but it has a totally different character with some Chorus slapped on, or whatever. It's the same with headphones really, I see them as modifying the original signal and introducing a 'vibe'.

 

[msr13]

Is anyone having a battery issue? Have had the PX8 for about a month and all has been fine— wonderful, actually. But for the past several days, the battery drains down super fast… out of power in about six hours. Prior they would exceed the stated duration. User error? Did I do something? Anyway, any advice would be appreciated before I call B&W for help. Thanks!