Best Smartphone for audiophile Part II (Updated: Jan 2020)
Feb 15, 2022 at 10:59 AM Post #4,546 of 5,166
Sorry if this is already covered in earlier posts. I want to get an inexpensive used LG V20 or V30 phone just as an apple music player. I only use earphones with low impedance(20-40 Ohm) with 3.5mm direct connection. My question is:

1. Does apple music use V20 or V30 phones' quad dac to decode ALAC high-res lossless?
2. How does the impedance check on V20 or V30 effect sound quality, and do I need some impedance trick to get around it?
3. Is the phone's EQ system-wide and works when Apple music plays?

Thanks for any input.
 
Feb 15, 2022 at 2:32 PM Post #4,547 of 5,166
Sorry if this is already covered in earlier posts. I want to get an inexpensive used LG V20 or V30 phone just as an apple music player. I only use earphones with low impedance(20-40 Ohm) with 3.5mm direct connection. My question is:

1. Does apple music use V20 or V30 phones' quad dac to decode ALAC high-res lossless?
2. How does the impedance check on V20 or V30 effect sound quality, and do I need some impedance trick to get around it?
3. Is the phone's EQ system-wide and works when Apple music plays?

Thanks for any input.
The V30's quad dac matches the impedance of your headphones so it pairs well with any headphone/iem up to 600ohms. Generally speaking, there are 3 modes:
-HiFi mode (<50ohms)
-High Impedance (>50ohms)
-Auxiliary mode (line out).
As for Apple Music, I can't advise as I don't use Apple.
 
Feb 15, 2022 at 2:35 PM Post #4,548 of 5,166
The V30's quad dac matches the impedance of your headphones so it pairs well with any headphone/iem up to 600ohms. Generally speaking, there are 3 modes:
-HiFi mode (<50ohms)
-High Impedance (>50ohms)
-Auxiliary mode (line out).
As for Apple Music, I can't advise as I don't use Apple.
I have a range of iems and headphones up to 250ohms and all play well on the V30 at moderate volume levels.
 
Feb 16, 2022 at 5:22 PM Post #4,549 of 5,166
The V30's quad dac matches the impedance of your headphones so it pairs well with any headphone/iem up to 600ohms. Generally speaking, there are 3 modes:
-HiFi mode (<50ohms)
-High Impedance (>50ohms)
-Auxiliary mode (line out).
As for Apple Music, I can't advise as I don't use Apple.
Thanks for the input.

Any Apple Music users on LG phones?
 
Feb 18, 2022 at 4:05 AM Post #4,552 of 5,166
Hi everyone,

I've been roaming these forums for over a year now mainly to gather as many perspectives in reviews of a given IEM in addition to other review sites and Youtube before pulling the trigger to buy it. You guys are really awesome in that respect since it gives a good reality check on whether a pair of headphones is "just good" or actually REALLY good. My methodology is not fool proof by any measure but I would like to believe that if 95% or more reviewers rate a pair of headphones a 4-5/5 or 8-10/10 not only in sound signature, but in detail and soundstage as well then it is very likely worth the buy over those that do not seem to meet those standards.

So far my audio setup in the past year has been...........

> daily driving a Huawei P20 Pro (very balanced dual speakers with Dolby Atmos)

> Realme X2 Pro for gaming (dual front speakers trades some deep bass for more sparkle & treble detail as well as 20% more volume than the P20 Pro which makes it good for stuff like clear diction on Zoom calls and blasting music. A convenient headphone jack is also present but is otherwise nothing special)

> LG V50 (dual front speakers have least bass compared to the two phones above and DTS:X seems to only boost the earpiece speaker instead of add fullness & soundstage like Dolby Atmos. The ESS Sabre 9218 is a pretty nice upper-midrange Quad-DAC which seems to explain why the speakers sound relatively lacking as well as the plastic rims -- a respectable design decision if the budget was somehow reduced back in 2019.)

I use it as my dedicated DAP with multiple gigabytes of custom YT Music playlist songs I have downloaded to listen to while traveling or testing or EQing headphones. My V50 happens to weigh virtually the same as my P20 Pro so it's pretty comfortable in the hand though for its size I wish hit had 10-15% extra battery capacity. It of course also doubles as a phone if my P20 Pro begins failing. To my relief it still seems to still work on Mint Mobile as of December 2021 -- maybe T-Mobile has somehow let MNVOs (budget cell carriers that bulk-buy expendable bandwidth from major carriers what own physical network infrastructure) decide if they want to discontinue or extend network support of certain phone models like the V50. :fingers_crossed:

I was able to snag all three of these phones for under $250 and before inflation hit due to the shipping delays which is pretty sweet in hindsight 2020 into 2021 see what I did there? xD

> Finally is a brief summary of the DAC-AMP dongles, headphones, IEMs, and Bluetooth TWS earbuds I use most often:

As far as external DAC-AMPs I have invested in the Audioquest Jitterbug for noise filtering (I'm guessing it reduces signal noise more noticeably with certain sensitive or headphone-amp pairings?), the Hidizs S9 Pro for the Sabre ES9038Q2M (also available in the Shanling UA2 and bulkier, more expensive amps), build quality, and positive reviews, the Charjenpro Microstick since it works with phone cases and its width is around the same as a 6-inch/15cm phone making it a good USB-C hub with a USB-C, USB-A, HDMI, and 3.5mm jack that happens to amplify well up to 80, maybe even 120 ohms.

Wired headphones ~ Dankpods-recommended Meze 99 Neo & "K240 Killer" Samson SR850s both with fur-feeling Defean Velour earpads which come in sizes for virtually any model of mass market over-ear cans currently on the market.

IEMs/wired earbuds ~ my "cheap n' faithful" Panasonic ErgoFits that I recently replaced with the $20 Tanchjim Tanya, the S.e.n.f.e.r D.T.6 since they pack DD-Piezo-BA tribrids if what's probably the best bang-for-buck in SQ/AQ technical capability for the forseable near future, the KZ CRN for their combo of comfort and great Crinacle-inspired 'balanced' tuning (at 35 bucks!), the Fiio FA1 for being near-flush comfortable in my ears (probably the best "active ANC alternative" when paired with foam tips) as well as the single large BA config that's quite unique in the sub-$100 price range, the BGVP Zero's compact size & dark/mids-bass weighted sound signature, and finally the BQEYZ KC2 for its balance and soundstage (now bested by the more comfy KZ CRN).

As for TWSs I've tried 3 pairs ~ the Lypertek Soundfree S20, Jlab Jbuds Air, and Taotronics SoundLiberty 94 (I'm trying to sell the first two so feel free to message me if you're interested).

The S20 I got after hearing Crinacle raving about the Lypertek Tevi/Purplay Z5 sounds satisfactory with some balance but not what I am accustomed to in soundstage -- the build quality is solid and it has physical "pinch-style" buttons instead of the ear-mashing variety which definitely makes it a good buy for half the Z5's price despite probably being slightly but noticeably worse in almost every other aspect. The Jbuds Air I got for free since it was sent to me by mistake instead of the Soundpeats H1 (for the low gaming latency) I had ordered & recieved a fund for; it sounds noticeably last-gen in clarity and is pretty bassy which is to be expected of mass-market TWS earbuds on the cheap end of the price spectrum. Finally the Taotronics 94 (sound signature wise it's a bit more relaxed than the Lypertek S20s and the fit takes a bit of fanagling, but stays fairly secure and comfy for at least 2-3 hours at a time) I got since was one of the few sub-$40 models I could find with consistent reviewers commending it for good low-end ANC for which they were right which has turned out to be perfect for flying around the holidays this past December no matter what part of the cabin I sat in.

Usefully the Wavelett app allows you to EQ wireless earbuds as well. It does seem to bug out on my P20 Pro and LG V50 in that the EQ presets don't kick in for wired headphones I use with the app after use with the wireless ones so I have had to delete and reinstall Wavelett a few times to get it working again for the 3.5mm jack stuff.

I will give input regarding a couple of your thoughts since Page 259 in my next post..........
 
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Feb 18, 2022 at 6:24 AM Post #4,553 of 5,166
LG V20, V30 and G6: ESS Saber ES9218P Quad DAC (B&O tuning)
LG V40 and G7: ESS Saber ES9218P Quad DAC (Meridian tuning)
LG V50, G8 and G8X: ESS Saber ES9218P Quad DAC (Meridian tuning)
LG V60: ESS Saber ES9219 Quad DAC (probably LG tuning)

Most LG smartphones of the V and G series (from the G6 onwards) carry the same Quad Dac (there are some exceptions like the G8s, which does not). The difference is in how the sound is "tuned", whether by Meridian, by B&O or by LG). None is better or worse in this sense, that is already personal taste, depending on how you prefer it to sound warmer, more natural ...

Very useful to know. Added it to my Quora post if you don't mind:

https://qr.ae/pGmCj5

Main answer thread: https://qr.ae/pGQ1Cx

I got the ROG 5.

While it's not a full on DAP like my WM1A, it does perform better than any "dongle" and snake oil I've purchased for iphone X.

I am now using Onkyo app to push out DSD / FLAC files out of the 3.5mm.


The instrument separation and amount of detail is improved, I'd say about 65% of wm1a. Bass sinks deeper. The output power is good. This is quite impressive.

However I'd dock points for flat timbre and soundstage/layering. I guess for those qualities you need capacitors and better circuitry. Also I'm worried about a lack of security updates and overall dislike for android devices. Other than that, the ROG is a nice device.

Yeah I was using an Apple USB-C to 3.5mm adapter dongle for a while and the chip in the dongle kept draining my battery even during hours of the day when I had no headphones plugged into it. Maybe it's "smart" when paired with iPads & Macbooks and the power through the USB-C port is cut when no output device is connected, but I definitely noticed that my P20 Pro died a few hours sooner when I had the adapter plugged in all day.

Hence why I got a few yesteryear flagships with 3.5mm jacks for "enthusiast" use cases (don't mind jackless phones as daily driver though cuz TWS are good enough when I'm out and about).

I do wonder........anyone have any experience comparing the ROG Phone 5's ES9280 Pro to the ES9038PRO and ES9038Q2M found in a bunch of other dongles & desktop amps?

As far as I know "Pro" variants of ESS DAC-AMP chips sport 8 channels as opposed to 4 channels in their something2M variants (thanks to those that clarified this on the Audio Science Review forums).

Tbh, BTR5+any smartphone will be unbeatable. For that matter, any modern smartphone with a DAC or a DAC dongle will blow away a standalone smartphone even if it's a Sony. BTR5 is TOTL level of performance when it comes to portable audio with super convenience.

Their promo video on YT suggest that Sony won't have any dedicated DAC will simply use the Snapdragon's existing DAC with a 3.5mm jack. They're using 360° audio and DSEE Ultimate to power their audio experience, honestly that's not much different than what Samsung does with Dolby Atmos. But Sony has 3.5mm jack which Samsung doesn't have. And in terms of overall package+experience, both Samsung and Sony are top draw. You won't be disappointed if you choose either of them and yes, BTR5 will complement either of them.

Yeah that's what I would recommend too for the average person since it does it all both as a DAC-AMP for headphones and a wireless adapter that connects any wired headphone to any device that plays back music and can connect via Bluetooth.

There's another Fiio product that's pretty high on my wishlist: the UTWS3 MMCX.

51p0oF69q7L._AC_SL1000_.jpg


It's basically a more compact & waaay lighter BTR5 with that goes over-ear with earhooks that connect either to MMCX or 2-pin (should work with all variants ~ rectangle/oval "C-Pin" 0.78mm and 0.75mm). Though if you get one version there are MMCX-to-2pin, 2pin-to-MMCX, 2pin-to-3.5mm, and MMCX-to-3.5mm adapters for $15-$30 you can get to use these with the fast majority of mass-market IEMs and wired headphones in existence.

The idea of being able to turn any IEM into Bluetooth earbuds is honestly a genius selling point.

I'm going for MMCX as I will be using it most with my pairs of Fiio FA1, S.e.n.f.e.r D.T.6, and BGVP Zero.

Other headphone-related devices on my wishlist include various "ultra-enthusiast"/amateur professional IEMs in the $150-$275 range, custom-molded wired & wireless earbuds (the upcoming UE FITS 2 for example), and these TWS models when they go on major discount: Liberty 3 Pro, Life P3, Soundpeats H1.

Ok so Asus has made our choice simple.There is only one if you want a quality 3.5 mm jack in 2021..The Asus ROG 5..Learn to like it.Honestly its not a bad phone..great screen,battery,performance etc..

There's more options than one would would think as shown in the list pictured at the bottom -- virtually all Android unless you decide to DIY hardware mod a headphone jack into your iPhone like Scotty from Strange Parts.

Of course models with a dedicated AMP-DAC and large 4500-7000mAh battery are the best if you can find them and/or afford them. :ok_hand:

I'm actually considering to snag the Galaxy M51 in the coming year for it's massive 7,000mAh battery as well as being 65-75% cheaper than a Fiio M15. I know it doesn't have the specialized knob, the multiple audio jack sizes and whatever other special software & features the M15 sports, but it has almost the same battery capacity that will pair well with my Hidizs S9 Pro/ES9038Q2M dongle as well as a SoC-CPU that is 60% faster and a nicer AMOLED display (the phone thing as well if all my other phones become unusable for some unforseen reason).

youll love iphones when you realise they last forever. This kind of thing is so common with androids, my android from 2015 and bu dads S6 are long gone. My iPhone SE from the same year is still as fast and in one piece 6 years later.

I wouldnt buy an Lg when Xperias sound better according to the people here. Its a much better phone

Yeah I still occasionally login to my OG iPhone SE from 2016 to keep up on my virtual stock portfolio on a stock trading simulator called "Best Broker". And iOS 15.3 just arrived on it too!

My beef with Apple isn't the longevity and long-term software support of the devices they offer, but with how they made hardware reparability progressively more tedius since the iPhone 6 appeared with a glued display & battery and exponentially less accessible and expensive after the iPhone 11 series. I keep up with the Right to Repair movement as well as how they stand ethically in their supply chain hence why do not plan to buy anything new from them and recommend their products as little as possible.

Can someone update this table? i dont see smartphones after 2018.

The list of "phones that still have headphone jacks" released in the past 3-4 years is probably the only part of the spreadsheet-database I still update, but I am trying to maintain and update each quarter for the foreseeable future. You can find it under the "MNVO PLAN MATRIX:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1i66tISjiF83RJDjqdrP68IBjfmK9AB5GSQ-hvH2a9KM/edit?usp=sharing
B0bAFPt.png

(edit: added the Blackberry Key2/Key2 LE)

And some phones that that were released 5-6 years ago:

https://www.quora.com/Which-is-the-best-smartphone-for-an-audiophile
cvrS1fA.png


Hope this helps!
 
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Feb 18, 2022 at 7:41 AM Post #4,555 of 5,166
Hmmm this looks curious..........:thinking:

Why are does it seem like all mentions of the S.e.n.f.e.r D.T.6/D.T.6 Pro seem censored (auto-overwritten entirely in asterisks) as well as potentially the review page scrubbed from this site if it ever existed?
 
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Feb 18, 2022 at 2:51 PM Post #4,559 of 5,166
I do wonder........anyone have any experience comparing the ROG Phone 5's ES9280 Pro to the ES9038PRO and ES9038Q2M found in a bunch of other dongles & desktop amps?

As far as I know "Pro" variants of ESS DAC-AMP chips sport 8 channels as opposed to 4 channels in their something2M variants (thanks to those that clarified this on the Audio Science Review forums).



Yeah that's what I would recommend too for the average person since it does it all both as a DAC-AMP for headphones and a wireless adapter that connects any wired headphone to any device that plays back music and can connect via Bluetooth.

There's another Fiio product that's pretty high on my wishlist: the UTWS3 MMCX.

51p0oF69q7L._AC_SL1000_.jpg


It's basically a more compact & waaay lighter BTR5 with that goes over-ear with earhooks that connect either to MMCX or 2-pin (should work with all variants ~ rectangle/oval "C-Pin" 0.78mm and 0.75mm). Though if you get one version there are MMCX-to-2pin, 2pin-to-MMCX, 2pin-to-3.5mm, and MMCX-to-3.5mm adapters for $15-$30 you can get to use these with the fast majority of mass-market IEMs and wired headphones in existence.

The idea of being able to turn any IEM into Bluetooth earbuds is honestly a genius selling point.

I'm going for MMCX as I will be using it most with my pairs of Fiio FA1, S.e.n.f.e.r D.T.6, and BGVP Zero.

Other headphone-related devices on my wishlist include various "ultra-enthusiast"/amateur professional IEMs in the $150-$275 range, custom-molded wired & wireless earbuds (the upcoming UE FITS 2 for example), and these TWS models when they go on major discount: Liberty 3 Pro, Life P3,

Fiio UTWS3/5 both are extremely good options to have hi-fi audio with convenience. I agree with you on this. Future is to go either with BT DAC/Amp or with TWS modules whether folks like us like it or not. Because BT audio will have better innovation over next 5 years as opposed to smartphones having a dedicated DAC and 3.5 mm jack because of obvious business implications. I would give my heart out to a smartphone which has dedicated DAC+3.5mm jack with state of the art of functionality. But unfortunately, capital greed won't let us have the retro joy of Sony Ericsson and Xperia wherein it was a norm.
 
Feb 18, 2022 at 3:14 PM Post #4,560 of 5,166
Fiio UTWS3/5 both are extremely good options to have hi-fi audio with convenience. I agree with you on this. Future is to go either with BT DAC/Amp or with TWS modules whether folks like us like it or not. Because BT audio will have better innovation over next 5 years as opposed to smartphones having a dedicated DAC and 3.5 mm jack because of obvious business implications. I would give my heart out to a smartphone which has dedicated DAC+3.5mm jack with state of the art of functionality. But unfortunately, capital greed won't let us have the retro joy of Sony Ericsson and Xperia wherein it was a norm.
You need more than just a good DAC in a phone though. The true bottleneck is the quality of the amplifier. Even if you have the best DAC in your phone while the amp sucks you basically get close to zero quality. Stand-alone DACs, even the cheapest dongles, truly outshine 99% of smartphones because of the amp. Differences are exacerbated if your IEMs are quite demanding, for instance because of their sensitivity, impedance, or impedance behaviour across the whole frequency range. An amp with a lot of headroom can handle these things much better than an amp that barely has enough power to drive any IEM, and then we're not even talking about sound quality because of better quality parts.

drftr
 

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