best open headphones under 250?
Nov 5, 2010 at 5:04 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 24

moore1041

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hi, im new to head fi and currently have this set up.
mb quart 805hs
onkyo htr560 and sony a/v receiver's for amp/dac connected via spdif to computer.
shure se110 iem's
and im looking for a good pair of open headphones to buy. i love my quarts but i need better soundstage, detail and clarity that an open headphone can provide "i hope". these will be used for basically everything from music to movies/games. but if i had a musical preference it would have to be good with soft acoustic/classical music because the quarts cover the opposite. they have to have very good highs "and not too bright" and mids, and not overpowering bass but at least tight and accurate. so basically im looking for detail, clarity, and GOOD soundstage. and they should be less than 250 unfortunately 
frown.gif

thanks in advance! 
 
Apr 22, 2011 at 7:48 AM Post #6 of 24
I would put the AKG K702 on your list.  It can be had for around $250 give or take a few dollars.  I received my pair yesterday and while I am aware of the lengthy burn-in period I am already amazed at the clarity and soundstaging of these cans. 
 
Apr 22, 2011 at 1:46 PM Post #7 of 24
Many happy listenings, Draven!
 
The K701 are my favorite headphones.  There are things others do better, especially in midrange.  But all in all, these are top for me.  They are very underpriced in my opinion.  Some people bash them, but you have to realize that they are also very unique - no headphone I know of sounds anything like them.  So if you enjoy their sound, nothing really comes close.
 
If you like them now, you'll be extremely pleased after they've had 100+ hours on them.  That's when they started getting sweeter for me, and they just kept improving over time.  Truly amazing.
 
Sometips:
 
1.  Be sure to really power them with a powerful high quality amp.
 
2.  The K701/2 needs a bit of volume to shine, while other headphones (DT880) sound just as great at lower volumes.  You'll see what I mean by fiddling with the volume knob, until you find the place they start to really sparkle and come alive.
 
3.  Depending on your amp, a strong resistance cable really helps as well.  I ran them with a tube amp built for 300-ohm minimum headphones. The K701 is only 65.  By adding a able that took them up to 350-ohm or so, it dramatically improved the sound.
 
Have fun!
 
 
 
Apr 22, 2011 at 3:12 PM Post #8 of 24


Quote:
Many happy listenings, Draven!
 
The K701 are my favorite headphones.  There are things others do better, especially in midrange.  But all in all, these are top for me.  They are very underpriced in my opinion.  Some people bash them, but you have to realize that they are also very unique - no headphone I know of sounds anything like them.  So if you enjoy their sound, nothing really comes close.
 
If you like them now, you'll be extremely pleased after they've had 100+ hours on them.  That's when they started getting sweeter for me, and they just kept improving over time.  Truly amazing.
 
Sometips:
 
1.  Be sure to really power them with a powerful high quality amp.
 
2.  The K701/2 needs a bit of volume to shine, while other headphones (DT880) sound just as great at lower volumes.  You'll see what I mean by fiddling with the volume knob, until you find the place they start to really sparkle and come alive.
 
3.  Depending on your amp, a strong resistance cable really helps as well.  I ran them with a tube amp built for 300-ohm minimum headphones. The K701 is only 65.  By adding a able that took them up to 350-ohm or so, it dramatically improved the sound.
 
Have fun!
 
 


You know, I have been meaning to get my hands on the K701/702s for a long time now and everytime I got close to buying them I would read a couple negative posts about how they are too thin sounding and the treble was really harsh.  This was always enough to make me think twice about buying them.
 
The other day I just put my foot down and you know what, I can't remember when I was this satisfied about a headphone purchase.  I really don't see where all of the negativity comes from regarding these cans.  Sure, they may not be for everyone but what they do, they do so exceptionally well. 
 
Oh and I am running them out of my Matrix M-stage and as far as I can tell they are a great match. 
 
Heck, I can't wait to get back home and listen to them more.  That is another first for me.  All of this tells me that I will have these headphones for a long time to come.  Oh and sorry to OP if I got a little off topic here but I would not hesitate to recommend these to anyone looking for headphones in this price range.
 
Apr 22, 2011 at 3:22 PM Post #9 of 24
Man, I feel exactly as you do.  They were thin and brittle sounding for the first few hours out of the box.  But after I ran them for three straight days, they completely changed.  The M50 is like that too, after about 100 hours the treble mellowed out.
 
Also, the K701 is crap with no amp or an underpowered one.  With the right amp, they sing.  And you're right: what they do, they do exceptionally well.  I remember running home to spend the evening hearing them too!  I listen to them for Vocal Trance exclusively, and their layering, soundstage, and separating characteristics are unmatched anywhere near their price range, at least with all the cans I've heard.
 
These days I'm moving, so I had to sell them and my amp, and what a tearful parting that was.  I"m using a BSG CMoy and my ER-4, and just ordered an AT AD700 that I'm hoping will "keep me" for a few months before I go.  Though indeed... it may not.
 
(Hence, my interest in this thread)
 
Apr 22, 2011 at 11:43 PM Post #11 of 24
try to see if you can get a pair of senn hd-580. they can definitely be had used for <200 easily. i don't know if i'd say they have great highs, but i think they are great headphones, not really overpowering in any area and super comfortable. you do need a proper amp to really make them sound their best though.
 
Apr 23, 2011 at 1:42 AM Post #12 of 24
VanCitySound:
 
Here's what I'm looking for in a headphone with Vocal Trance:  
 
1.  Superb layering effects, as you know all those complex and constant effects are just hitting you from every direction and you don't want them to muddle up and ruin the effect.
 
2.  Superb panning, so you can really hear the sound going around your head in (dare I say it?) 3 dimensions.  (There I go, I said it).
 
3.  Creamy, lush, realistic and intimate vocals, highlighting the female voice and making it seem real and close to you.
 
4.  LIGHT bass - there's so much in Trance, that I get sick of it slamming my head and covering over other details in the music.  I'm not in a club, after all.
 
5.  Incredible analytical detail, allowing every tiny little effect and instrument to come through and be clearly heard, despite Trance's supremely complicated arrangements.
 
6.  Unbelievable, head-expanding soundstage, as the goal of Trance is to take you literally into the skies and beyond.
 
 
The K701 really met all of these impressive requirements, far FAR better than any headphone I've ever heard, with the rather sad exception of #3.  
 
After a while, because of this alone, I moved on to the Beyerdynamic DT880 600-ohm.  A completely, totally different headphone, they impressively met #3, and excelled with everything else except (tragically) #1.  Though with the exception of #3 and #4, the K701 was far better at everything listed.  The DT880 was still an excellent can though.
 
The K701 has very tight, very detailed bass.  And the bass goes far deeper than, for example, the DT880.  However, it really has no punch at all.  You get the sound of the bass, even at very low frequency, but no rumble or slam.  The DT880 and HD650 was far more dramatic.  The K701 reminded me of an un-amped ER-4.  Then again, that wasn't a priority for me, I wanted lighter bass, having sold my D2000 (modified) to buy the K701 precisely because the bass was too heavy.
 
I used a Glow Audio Amp One, a tube amp, and as I understand, a SET / Valve tube amp, whatever that means.  (I wish that I knew).  To get past the ohm requirements of the Glow, which the K701 did not meet, I used a custom-made resistance cable, with brought the impedance of the K701 up to about 375.  And then, you had to burn in the K701 for a long time, and get some volume into it to really make it sing.  With that combination, I could hardly even imagine a better, more clear and natural sound.  It seemed literally endless.  I just couldnt' imagine anything better.
 
With all that, with the sole exception of intimate midrange, the K701 was incredible with Trance, as long as you enjoy lighter bass.  It really did take me to another world.  The only flaw was the midrange, it was a bit recessed.  But with (I hope) the exception of a T1, I can imagine and recommend no better headphone than the K701 for Vocal Trance.
 
Apr 23, 2011 at 3:00 AM Post #13 of 24
[size=small]Thanks Kouzelna, I’d love to hear the K701 on some good tubes.  Of course its hard to talk about subjective sound but I worry a bit about the recessed mids and “subtle” bass given my musical preferences.  Heck I’d love to do a back to back listen with the K701, DT880 and the HD600 on some vocal trance.  For closed cans I’ve found the SHR840’s fairly satisfying with vocal trance.  Bass is reasonably restrained, female vocal range is warm, detail and separation are decent, but they do lack the soundstage IMHO.  That’s why I am looking for some new open HPs. [/size]
 
Apr 23, 2011 at 3:32 AM Post #14 of 24
If you don't like recessed mids and light bass, I fear you won't like the K701.  
 
For me, it was always a painful trade off.  I did the back to back you mentioned, with the HD650 equipped with a Cardas cable, and using my Glow.  All are superior headphones, and of course, preference is the final judge.  
 
But my overall feelings in brief:
 
The HD650 has a beautiful fit, I love the oval ear cups (like the M50), they fit right.  Neither of the others are near as comfy, they are just fine in themselves.  And you didn't have to move the HD650 around sometimes to find the sweet spot, as with the K701 when you're laying down, it just stayed put.  However, despite the strongest bass of the three, and a fabulous reputation for quality, it simply did not have either the soundstage nor clarity of the other two.  It tends to lean on the darker side of tonal balance.  Others say it's neutral, while the DT880 and K701 are notoriously bright.  I can see that.  However, for me, the HD650 is too laid back a headphone to really make Trance sparkle and sing, which is what it's produced to do, and therefore the complex details, panning and soundstage of the music didn't work on the HD650.  I sold it the day after I bought it.  (It was already burned in somewhat by a former owner).
 
The DT880 had a nice, clear bass with some nice impact, for an open headphone.  Just enough, but not too much.  (It was owned by a friend, and totally burned in).  It did cut off in the deeper frequencies, which took some of the drama out of certain tracks, but just those that really got things rumbling.  But that's a very small gripe, not enough to worry about.  Because where it really shined is in the vocal presentation - fantastic.  As I said above, very intimate, warm, and sexy - just what you want in Trance.  It's soundstage was terrific, and as was its ability to reproduce subtle effects.  However, where it distinctly lacked was in clarity and separation.  Yes, it's a great headphone for those things, but with Vocal Trance specifically, the massive amount of layering and detail often simply got muddied up.  And because of that, many details were not so much lost completely, but they failed completely to have their effect.  When things were simpler, the DT880 did well.  When they got very layered, as in the lengthy instrumental passages that come in the middle of most Trance songs, they kind of fell apart.  Many details were thus lost, and that "music in space" feeling Trance can give you did not take place.  Make sense?  You probably know what I mean if you're a Trance listener.  Bottom line, is that they worked impressively well for me with Trance, and I really spent some time enjoying them, but they aren't made for Trance music.
 
Now, the K701, I think, is the headphone made for Trance.  As much as I might have appreciated certain things about the other two, a lot actually, when I put the K701 on I knew that this was the one. Layers upon layers, upon more layers, never slowed it down at all.  All effects were audible exactly as they were supposed to be, perfectly spaced, they sparkled, and they took me into that other world which is why we listen to Trance.  And the soundstage is so totally wide, it really is impossible to describe these headphones without listening to them.  You love 'em or hate 'em, and I loved 'em.  You don't really listen to them, so much as experience them.  So my long evenings were, in truth, an experience - again, that's why I listen exclusively to Vocal Trance in headphones.  For me, that's what headphone listening is all about.  
 
Now, I was willing to sacrifice on the bass, simply because when I listen to Vocal Trance I tend to do all-nighters - sometimes 5, 6 or even 8 hours of straight listening.  Punchy bass can really be fatiguing for me, over time.  So the K701s light bass was doable for me.  After all, my other headphone is the ER-4.  The good news, is that the bass on both the K701 and ER-4 are extremely accurate, in fact flawless.  They both go very deep, especially the K701, and are very precise and clear.  So that kinda makes up for the lack of punch, though not totally.  It's something I can live with though.  What I really couldn't live with, over time, was the recessed mids.  Keep in mind, they aren't recessed to the point of making you unhappy with any other type of music.  And on Trance, they sound great too.  They are not THAT bad.  But the centerpiece of Vocal Trance is the lush, sexy vocals.  The K701 set them back to the point they just kind of blended into the rest of the sounds as one more layer, rather than being the focal point.  For me, that was a great loss.
 
OK, somehow my short posts always become long reviews.  Sorry for the rest of you, that don't care about this conversation!
 
But my point, VanCitySound, is this:  
 
If I had to do it all over again, I was very happy with the DT880 600-ohm, and really enjoyed them.  But in the end, the K701 is the headphone that Trance was made for.  They allow the music to come to its full potential.
 
If I had $1,500 to blow, which I don't, I would buy both the DT880 and K701 and seek out a perfect amp pairing, and recabling, that might solve the difficulties I mentioned on each, and see which one worked out best in the end.  If I could solve the K701's recessed mids, (as the Blue Dragon cable from Moon Audio is supposed to do), then it would be the K701 hands down.  If not, and I could improve the muddiness of the DT880 on complex passages, then that would be my headphone and I'd be thrilled with it.
 
Hopefully, this all gives you a more detailed presentation in which to make a judgment.  Both headphones are easily resellable - took me one day on each to sell.  And if you buy from Amazon or Headroom for example, you could buy both and return the one you liked least, as long as you kept it and the box it came in looking brand new.
 
Please, let me know how it all works out!!!
 
 

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