[techfreakazoid]

Interesting impressions, RADI0HEAD.  I was contemplating about the ER4 for their isolation, but the thinner sound is a dealbreaker.
 
I'd go for the CK10 for its speed, precision and excellent cable.  Fit is the stickler so YMMV with tip options.

 

[RADI0HEAD]

Interesting impressions, RADI0HEAD.  I was contemplating about the ER4 for their isolation, but the thinner sound is a dealbreaker.
 
I'd go for the CK10 for its speed, precision and excellent cable.  Fit is the stickler so YMMV with tip options.

The Ety house sound is definitely an acquired taste. I'm quite used to it though having owned three pairs of er-6i over the years (still have two).

When listening to the ER-4S I'm never wanting more bass but when I switch to the CK-10 I'm like oh that's what I was missing. I'm not a bass head by any means, the Westone 4 are bordering a little too much sometimes to me but that's another story.

The er4 are definitely keepers but the CK10 to me are very special. At this point in my journey if I could only keep one iem for the rest of my life it would be the CK10 in a heartbeat.

By the way I use Ety style triple flanges with the CKs and the isolation is very admirable.

 

[luvs2squizz]

I wouldn't recommend buying from eBay,
Amazon has the er4p/s for $240
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0007WZLDC

 

[techfreakazoid]

Quote:

Quote:

Interesting impressions, RADI0HEAD.  I was contemplating about the ER4 for their isolation, but the thinner sound is a dealbreaker.
 
I'd go for the CK10 for its speed, precision and excellent cable.  Fit is the stickler so YMMV with tip options.

The Ety house sound is definitely an acquired taste. I'm quite used to it though having owned three pairs of er-6i over the years (still have two).

When listening to the ER-4S I'm never wanting more bass but when I switch to the CK-10 I'm like oh that's what I was missing. I'm not a bass head by any means, the Westone 4 are bordering a little too much sometimes to me but that's another story.

The er4 are definitely keepers but the CK10 to me are very special. At this point in my journey if I could only keep one iem for the rest of my life it would be the CK10 in a heartbeat.

By the way I use Ety style triple flanges with the CKs and the isolation is very admirable.

I agree.  The CK10 are special and have a comparable sound signature to the DT880 with great details, airiness and imaging.  Do the Ety flanges fit securely on the CK10 nozzle?  I find the Shure black olives have the best isolation.  Have you used them on the Westone 4?  If so, how's the isolation compared to the ER4 and CK10-Ety flanges?

 

[RADI0HEAD]

I agree.  The CK10 are special and have a comparable sound signature to the DT880 with great details, airiness and imaging.  Do the Ety flanges fit securely on the CK10 nozzle?  I find the Shure black olives have the best isolation.  Have you used them on the Westone 4?  If so, how's the isolation compared to the ER4 and CK10-Ety flanges?

Yes, the Ety flanges are very secure on the CKs, even more secure than on the ER4.

I've used the included Westone triple flanges(essentially the same as Etys) on the W4 but found they cut back a lot of the highs. The Monster triples give me more highs and work best for me with the W4.

The isolation is pretty equal on all three when used with the Ety flanges.

Speaking of triple flanges, I've grown fond of these. I like the almond long stem version(something Ety doesn't offer) which can be cut to size. This is my choice of tip for the CKs. http://earplugstore.stores.yahoo.net/roauprtrflti.html

 

[Haonan]

ER4 sounds more precise, analytical and fast than ATH CK10 and UE TripleFi 10, It's truth?

Can't comment on the ER-4S or P version since I haven't heard them personally, but in my local forum's community among general audiophiles it's true that Etymotic Research have some of the best analytical, precision and speed when it comes to balanced armature in-ear monitors. Did auditioned the HF5 version recently which I heard from many were saying that it is a more balanced out version by Etymotic catered for a much easier, non-fatigued listening experience, in that they actually toned down the actual highs/sibilance issues originally found on the ER-4S/P, while introducing a slightly wee bit more of the lower frequency ala bass. Someone actually gave a well-summarised review of both UE Triple Fi 10 and the HF5 before earlier this year while I was searching for reviews on, and I would probably agree with rangerid in his review in that in terms of treble details and quality they are much better than Triple Fi 10, which did not impressed me at all in terms of vocal details (but that's probably because I already own some of the best vocals/mid-range IEM on the market currently, which is the ATH-CK100) So it should be correct to say, for ER4 (both S and P version) they should be much more analytical in terms of treble clarity and quality, against Triple Fi 10 for sure since ER4 is considered to be much more analytical and refined in the highs, compared to the HF5/HF2 versions from what I understand.

Can't compare the ER4 to Audio-technica CK10 in my case here (since I never heard the ER4 like I mentioned earlier) but in terms of micro-details, treble clarity, speed performance the ATH-CK10 certainly gets my vote over Triple Fi 10.

It may be hard to believe, but JVC FX700 is the most analytical IEM I've heard because I can easily pick out all details with it. Everything is clearly separated and the dynamic range is vast which ensures that subtle details don't stand out more than they are supposed to and do not create a false sense of extra detail. ER4 is also very detailed, but it pushes more detail forward due to a more compressed dynamic range, making things easier to hear, but less natural sounding. With FX700 you can analyze not only detail but the dynamic range of the music as well.

Uh Pianist, no offends to you personally but cut it out already. You have been going to almost every thread on Head-fi to boast about the JVC FX700, even back in the DBA-02 thread when we were talking about bass properties regarding the DBA-02. Please look at the original threadstarter's post again, he stated that he wants a precise, fast and analytical reproduction of the sound signature, and we all know in terms of balanced armature drivers they would always be much more superior compared to dynamic transducers when it comes to both precision speed and analytical detailed presentation (at least according to what I have read here and also from my personal listening experience all these years, which is why I have mainly stayed away from dynamic-based IEMs for my own collection, since I preferred that aggressiveness and analytical sound when it comes to my listening genres as well)

I don't deny in terms of dynamic range, dynamic-based in-ear monitors like JVC FX700 or Sony MDR-EX1000 can be much more superior than current balanced armature monitor phones (which is why I always turn to my headphones like RS1i or CD900ST/MDR-7506 instead for listening to orchestra and classical genres) but in terms of dub-step/rap/progressive trance/electronic music, I think no-one can deny here that balanced armature IEMs can accomplish with a much better performance than dynamic IEMs for sure (not referring to headphones though).

My 2 cents.

 

[Haonan]

Yes, the Ety flanges are very secure on the CKs, even more secure than on the ER4.

Yes I can confirm that Ety Tri-flange tips does work on the CK10/CK100, they share basically the same nozzle tip size, it was a nice surprise since I originally bought them for my DBA-02 (which I later sold it off earlier this month to one of my local forum mate in my country) and was glad to find out they work finely on my ATH-CK100 as well. (providing the best isolation compared to the default Audio-technica ER-CK100 foamies or silicone tips, while in terms of best comfort usage I generally turn to Sony Hybrids or the ER-CK100 foamies usually for my case)

Anywway RADI0HEAD, if you don't mind me asking. Judging from yr experience do you think the ER4S is a better buy for me or the HF5? After selling the DBA-02 recently I'm starting to miss that analytical sound presentation in my songs (my CK100 is probably considered much more laid-back, akin to UM3x so I won't say they are anywhere near to DBA-02 or the CK10 in terms of that aggressive, analytical presentation in terms of the sound) which is why I might be considering to look for an alternative IEM again, and currently I think in terms of choices I'm stuck between the ER4S or HF5, especially when it comes to the cabling options and microphonics issue for both models. I do understand that the ER4S is much more detailed than the HF5 and their drivers are hand-matched by their US engineers, as compared to HF5 which is probably mass-produced in China, but the microphonics issue seems to bother me and since I will be driving these mainly with my portable DAPs like my Sony or iPod Touch 4G, I thought maybe the HF5 would be more suitable for me. (they come in nice colors as well)

So do you think I should sacrifice the usability issues for a better sound performance? I'm okay with the price differences for both Ety models, as I can afford either one but currently the usability factors and probably a longer housing shell on the ER4 seems to cause me quite a dilemma here, so I hope to seek a second opinion on both models, which one would suit me more.

 

[RADI0HEAD]

Sorry, I have not heard the HF5. The ER4 is legendary, by looking at the specifications alone I don’t think the HF5 will ever reach the status of the flagship model. The included clip helps with the microphonics of the stiff ER4 cabling. You also have the option of buying an after-market cable, something I'm looking into. My Nano is driving the ER4S fairly well between 50-70% volume . Eventually I'll purchase an amplifier to unlock their full potential.

For a direct comparison you can look at these threads:
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/452289/etymotic-er-4p-vs-hf5-opinions

http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/391551/the-etymotic-hf5-it-s-new-it-s-etymotic-but-is-it-good-work-in-progress-review

 

[techfreakazoid]

Quote:

Yes, the Ety flanges are very secure on the CKs, even more secure than on the ER4.

I've used the included Westone triple flanges(essentially the same as Etys) on the W4 but found they cut back a lot of the highs. The Monster triples give me more highs and work best for me with the W4.

The isolation is pretty equal on all three when used with the Ety flanges.

Speaking of triple flanges, I've grown fond of these. I like the almond long stem version(something Ety doesn't offer) which can be cut to size. This is my choice of tip for the CKs. http://earplugstore.stores.yahoo.net/roauprtrflti.html

Good to know about the Ety flange fit on the CK10.  Have you tried the frost ER4-15SM and glider ER4-17 tips on the CK10?  If so, how's the isolation, highs compared to the ER4-18 and earplugstore flanges?

 
 
Quote:

Yes I can confirm that Ety Tri-flange tips does work on the CK10/CK100, they share basically the same nozzle tip size, it was a nice surprise since I originally bought them for my DBA-02 (which I later sold it off earlier this month to one of my local forum mate in my country) and was glad to find out they work finely on my ATH-CK100 as well. (providing the best isolation compared to the default Audio-technica ER-CK100 foamies or silicone tips, while in terms of best comfort usage I generally turn to Sony Hybrids or the ER-CK100 foamies usually for my case) 

 
Thanks for chiming in, Haonan.  The Sony hybrids are comfortable, but I can't get a good seal making my CK10s useless on city streets.  I felt the ER-CK100 foamies at a meet and they are hard as a rock, compared to the soft Shure foamies.  They're like the Monster foam tips which fit fine on the CK10 nozzle, but can't get any seal in my ears.

 

[RADI0HEAD]

The frosted ER4-15SM can fit on the CK10.(too small for me)

The gliders have a silicone core surrounded by foam. The core can fit but in the process the foam tore around the core, not good. Despite the foam tearing around the core they still sounded good and I had a perfect seal. They had good isolation. In my not so scientific method of testing I think the earplugstore triples isolate a little more.

Just realize the CK10 nozzle is a good 1.5 millimeters larger than the Ety nozzle. You have to stretch the tips a bit but they do fit.

 

[Haonan]

Thanks for chiming in, Haonan.  The Sony hybrids are comfortable, but I can't get a good seal making my CK10s useless on city streets.  I felt the ER-CK100 foamies at a meet and they are hard as a rock, compared to the soft Shure foamies.  They're like the Monster foam tips which fit fine on the CK10 nozzle, but can't get any seal in my ears.

Hey no worries there techfreakazoid. Regarding the fit for Sony Hybrid silicone tips, my personal suggestion for you would be to maybe try one size larger than what you normally wear for silicone tips. I usually wear S size only for silicone tips that comes with my individual IEMs, but for Sony Hybrids I found that their M size (green color cores) fits me the best. Their S size cores are in orange color, and another smaller sizing avail in SS size with red color cores, so maybe when you're shopping for a larger size authentic Sony Hybrids depending on which sizing you're using currently, just double-check yourself to make sure you're getting the correct size/color.

As for the original ER-CK100 foamies by Audio-technica, I found them to be actually the same quality as original Shure foamies to me (but without the rubber cores), at least for my case since my ATH-CK100 was purchased directly from JP and I also asked my friend to purchase a separate box of ER-CK100 foam tips for me as replacement/backup. They are quite comfortable in my ears out of the box, although no-where near Sony Hybrid's comfort level so I would suspect that in terms of fit, it probably varies from people to people so your mileage may vary. Also for the last 4 months since I had my CK100s, I'm still on my first pair of the ER-CK100 foamies and they don't seem to degrade at all, unlike Comply foam tips which seems to stain and degrade easily over time.

Sorry, I have not heard the HF5. The ER4 is legendary, by looking at the specifications alone I don’t think the HF5 will ever reach the status of the flagship model. The included clip helps with the microphonics of the stiff ER4 cabling. You also have the option of buying an after-market cable, something I'm looking into. My Nano is driving the ER4S fairly well between 50-70% volume . Eventually I'll purchase an amplifier to unlock their full potential.

For a direct comparison you can look at these threads:
http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/452289/etymotic-er-4p-vs-hf5-opinions

http://www.head-fi.org/forum/thread/391551/the-etymotic-hf5-it-s-new-it-s-etymotic-but-is-it-good-work-in-progress-review

Thanks for the advice RADI0HEAD. It's unfortunate to hear that you have no personal experience with the HF5, thought that I could get a real second opinion on both ER4 and HF5 from you guys. I think judging by the cabling/microphonics issue and housing shell design, I think I may be more inclined to go with HF5 instead, not really a fan of braided-reinforced cables on the ER4 and from the reviews all over Head-fi, it seems to imply that ER4S/P does have very much worse microphonic issues compared to HF5/HF2 (despite people saying braided cables will always have the least minimal microphonics), which is a factor I have to consider since this is supposed to be my alternative IEM for my portable rig so I can rotate them with my Audio-technicas whenever I like. I suppose if I'm not satisfied with the HF5 sound signature with my gears, I can probably sell it off and upgrade to the ER4P instead, at a later time.

If anyone else wants to chime in with their own recommendation of analytical IEMs, please feel free to voice them out as I'm all ears for it, but currently as of this moment I'm not interested in phones like ATH-CK10 (has a similar sound sig to my CK9, so don't think I wanna go for something similar again), Fischer Audio DBA-02 (already had them before and sold) or Brainwavz B2.

Thanks.

 

[techfreakazoid]

 
Quote:

The frosted ER4-15SM can fit on the CK10.(too small for me)

The gliders have a silicone core surrounded by foam. The core can fit but in the process the foam tore around the core, not good. Despite the foam tearing around the core they still sounded good and I had a perfect seal. They had good isolation. In my not so scientific method of testing I think the earplugstore triples isolate a little more.

Just realize the CK10 nozzle is a good 1.5 millimeters larger than the Ety nozzle. You have to stretch the tips a bit but they do fit.

Thanks for the Ety tip info.  I have the earplugstore tips on order so will see if they work in my ears.


Quote:

Hey no worries there techfreakazoid. Regarding the fit for Sony Hybrid silicone tips, my personal suggestion for you would be to maybe try one size larger than what you normally wear for silicone tips. I usually wear S size only for silicone tips that comes with my individual IEMs, but for Sony Hybrids I found that their M size (green color cores) fits me the best. Their S size cores are in orange color, and another smaller sizing avail in SS size with red color cores, so maybe when you're shopping for a larger size authentic Sony Hybrids depending on which sizing you're using currently, just double-check yourself to make sure you're getting the correct size/color.

As for the original ER-CK100 foamies by Audio-technica, I found them to be actually the same quality as original Shure foamies to me (but without the rubber cores), at least for my case since my ATH-CK100 was purchased directly from JP and I also asked my friend to purchase a separate box of ER-CK100 foam tips for me as replacement/backup. They are quite comfortable in my ears out of the box, although no-where near Sony Hybrid's comfort level so I would suspect that in terms of fit, it probably varies from people to people so your mileage may vary. Also for the last 4 months since I had my CK100s, I'm still on my first pair of the ER-CK100 foamies and they don't seem to degrade at all, unlike Comply foam tips which seems to stain and degrade easily over time.
 

 
I've been alternating between the peach and green Sony hybrids.  If you like the green, try the medium Phonak silicone sleeves.  They're designed for smaller diameter nozzles, but easily stretch onto the CK10 nozzle.
 
If the ER-CK100 foamies are as soft as the Shures, then I might give them a shot.  I'm wondering why the ones I felt were so hard.  I recall they were oily so perhaps the ear wax was absorbed into the foam.  Complys are the softest and most comfortable foam tips, but they attract dirt easily and lose their resiliency quickly.

 

[RADI0HEAD]

 


Thanks for the Ety tip info.  I have the earplugstore tips on order so will see if they work in my ears.

I hope they work out for you. I use them on the CK10, ER-4 and as of late on the W4. The W4 has a short nozzle but with the long stem tips it's very easy to get a deep fit.

 

[techfreakazoid]

Quick update on the earplugstore flange.  They're really designed for the Shure nozzle, but can be stretched onto the CK10.  They're not cooperating and can't get them to sit in my ears so no isolation whatsoever.  The flanges also protrude out so it destroys the discreet look of the CK10.  That being said, the Comply T-200 foam tips work with the CK10 and isolation is almost as good as the Shure foamies.

 

[snoopy-u]

Quote:

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ETYMOTIC-ER4-IN-EARPHONE-CABLE-ADAPTOR-B-/290411840568?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item439de50438
 
It looks like a good proof of possibility to replace cable on er4
 
Also exactly today my friend from Russia accidently break cable on CK10 near earphone itself and now he have no idea how to repair it. I even offer him to send it to me by post, maybe I can do something with it. I have some skills in repairing things that not designed for repairing, and also it's possibility for me to hear CK10 if my attempt will be successfull.
 
But I don't say that build quality of CK10 is bad, I think that any cable breaks earlier or later by it's nature, so replaceable cable is ultimate solution for that problem.

very interesting mod.. i wonder how good it works..