[drp]

Thanks, 16.

Given the basis of this thread, which was using XLR-to-RCA and then RCA-to-phono plug adaptors to drive *any* headphone from a DAC's XLRs, I was actually trying to eliminate the RCA part. Your answer (which always seem viable) did confirm the diff I was looking for, so I think I'll try:

XLRleft pin 2 to phono plug tip connection
XLRleft pin 1 to phono plug sleeve

XLRright pin 2 to phono plug ring connection
XLRright pin 1 to phono plug sleeve

 

[dip16amp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by drp Thanks, 16. Given the basis of this thread, which was using XLR-to-RCA and then RCA-to-phono plug adaptors to drive *any* headphone from a DAC's XLRs, I was actually trying to eliminate the RCA part. Your answer (which always seem viable) did confirm the diff I was looking for, so I think I'll try: XLRleft pin 2 to phono plug tip connection XLRleft pin 1 to phono plug sleeve XLRright pin 2 to phono plug ring connection XLRright pin 1 to phono plug sleeve

Make sure pin 3 is not connected to anything.

Driving headphones unbalanced from the XLR connectors would not have the advantage of the output buffer (BUF634) which the headphone jack uses. The bass would not be as strong without the buffer.

 

[Distroyed]

Quote:

Originally Posted by yfei Using this setup, I feel headphone jack is better. The sound is cleaner, and more defined bass. The XLR sounds a little distorted, and bass is a little slow.

This is a good description of the changes with this mod.

 

[Grif]

drp...personally I would'nt bother with all that, you may as well use the headphone jack on the front.
The only really worthwhile way to run headphones out of the xlrs IMHO is with a proper balanced cable (which you won't have with that rig) and dip16amp's post is on the money as far as connection goes.
Judging by zool's post above, his Zu must be wired like this as his discription is exactly what I've experienced....maybe his stock cable isn't wired the same???

 

[drp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron_Dreamer As dip16 mentioned, 2x slew rate and voltage, as well as no common ground, which in this case translates into better soundstaging and bass impact, primarily. I've rigged up a adapter cable to use regular 1/4" headphones with the DAC1's XLR output (L+, R+, gnd), and my conclusion is that most, if not all of the benefit of using the XLR's is from the balanced drive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iron_Dreamer I'm currently using it to drive the 80ohm Beyers, at I even used it with the 32-ohm Grados, using an adapter cable.

Quote:

Originally Posted by 16 – Driving headphones unbalanced from the XLR connectors would not have the advantage of the output buffer (BUF634) which the headphone jack uses. The bass would not be as strong without the buffer.

I was one of the early adopters of using a balanced Senn cable on a DAC, and then watching this thread progress, I was simply motivated by ID's comment and thinking it worthwhile to build an adaptor cable so I can try other (non-Senn) headphones via the DAC's XLR out; the initial premise of this thread.

Grif – I appreciate your findings and opinion, especially since you've actually tried the multi-adaptor route (we like experience-based opinions around here) and compared this to the well-known XLR conversion. Glad you like your rig!!

I think I've at least confirmed that I won't fry my DAC by building an adaptor cable (the unspoken concern in all of this).

Best,

Dave

 

[Grif]

Hi drp...did'nt realise you knew all about the balanced stuff already, sorry about that. I'm no EE so can't comment on weather you will fry your dac.
As for the Dac1...its not the best sound I've ever heard, that goes to a cdp retailing for 2 1/2 times the price of the dac1, but its very good, even out of my average sound card (the ultralock is one of its strong points)which will allow me to sell both my headphone amps and my cdp which will cover most of the the cost of the dac....so I'm happy...especially with the balanced cable route....although, as you say, that does tie me to senns...but I'm happy with the 650's too, sonot a problem for me at least.

 

[Don Quichotte]

There's one thing I don't get: why would it be any better to drive headphones with common ground from the balanced outputs (pin 3 floating) than to use the RCA unbalanced outputs ? Isn't it basically the same thing, or even better in the second case because of skipping the XLR -> RCA adapter?

 

[dip16amp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Quichotte There's one thing I don't get: why would it be any better to drive headphones with common ground from the balanced outputs (pin 3 floating) than to use the RCA unbalanced outputs ? Isn't it basically the same thing, or even better in the second case because of skipping the XLR -> RCA adapter?

This came up last year because the RCA output had 1250 ohm output impedance and unbalanced from the XLR output has only 30 ohm output impedance.

It is not recommended to drive headphones from either unbalanced output without an amp.

Even the XLR balanced output should be used with a balanced amp to drive headphones properly.

 

[Don Quichotte]

Quote:

It is not recommended to drive headphones from either unbalanced output without an amp.

Is this only from a sound quality point of view or you imply that it could also be potentially harmful to the DAC1 (or any other CD player)?

 

[dip16amp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Quichotte Is this only from a sound quality point of view or you imply that it could also be potentially harmful to the DAC1 (or any other CD player)?

Just a sound quality point of view.

 

[laevi]

I was thinking of using the TecNec MF-MF 3.5mm female-3.5mm female and a TecNec Y-MPS-2XF 3.5mm male stereo to 2 XLR female adapter. According to a TecNec representative I emailed, the pinouts of the Y-MPS-2XF should work though XLR pin 3 on both left and right channels are grounded.

http://www.markertek.com/SearchProdu...ff=0&sort=prod
http://www.markertek.com/SearchProdu...ff=0&sort=prod

Www.globalvideoconf.com sells them for ~$8, but I don't know how much shipping costs yet.

Does anyone know if TecNec is a durable brand? Would there be any reason for me to go with the previously recommended Neutrik or Hosa products instead? Thanks.

 

[gradofan]

For what it's worth, I emailed Benchmark about using XLR outputs to drive the Senns, and this was their reply:

"Hi Tony,

Using the XLR outs is not recommended. The XLR out is designed to drive a high impedance (10kohm on up), while the headphone amp is designed for headphones which run from 30-600 ohms. The XLR will have higher distortion and lower maximum output than the hph outs. In addition, you will lose damping factor using the XLR outputs. A high damping factor keeps the headphone under better control, meaning lower distortion. Hope this helps.

Rory Rall
Sales
Benchmark Media Systems, Inc.
5925 Court Street Road
Syracuse, NY 13206-1707
http://www.benchmarkmedia.com
800-262-4675"

 

[OracleGuy]

I've been using this rig for a week now, and it sounds fantastic to me. If there's any distortion then I haven't noticed it.

It makes me wonder how much better it could possibly be, e.g., with a balanced head-amp.

I'm not planning an upgrade for a while, that's for sure.

Give it a try -- I don't think you'll be sorry.

I wonder if the "higher distortion" on the XLRs would apply when feeding a balanced amp? Would it actually sound better in unbalanced mode?

 

[Iron_Dreamer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by OracleGuy I wonder if the "higher distortion" on the XLRs would apply when feeding a balanced amp? Would it actually sound better in unbalanced mode?

No, the XLR's only have the distortion they speak of driving headphones, because of the they the impedances interact. The highest impedance headphones have an impedance of 600ohms, whereas most amps have AT LEAST 10,000ohms of input impedance. The lower the impedance of a circuit, the harder it is to drive, and hence the higher the distortion will be. Amps are designed to avoid this problem by having a very high impedance, whereas headphones cannot be.

 

[Iron_Dreamer]

damned double post!