[cb3723]

The difference is, Beats has released mostly lemons.

Popularity doesn't equal quality. Justin Bieber was the biggest thing in music for a while, but you won't find me pumping him through my system (well, maybe "Baby" )

Of course. If a competitor is making money without the product to back it up, you better copy what they're doing right. Beats did their marketing right, even if it wasn't to an audiophile's liking. No one's trying to deny that.

One, only the ones buying the Solo2 are getting quality sound for the price. Apparently their other models are still okay at best. Two, it takes more than good gear to be an audiophile. It's a hobby, not a purchase.

Sure, you're exactly right we shouldn't judge the Solo2 because of the brand!

Likewise, though, we shouldn't judge the brand by the Solo2. Every company produces lemons, and every company produces happy mistakes. From their first headphone, Beats has produced expensive headphones with a focus on style and branding, with sound quality ranging from okay to downright bad. They've produced a couple good headphones, including one that's very competitive for the price, but that doesn't invalidate the rest of their product line. I'll respect the Solo2, assuming other reviews are in line with Tyll's or I get a chance to hear them myself, but I'm not ready to respect Beats yet. Let's see if the trend towards quality continues first, hm?

I like the cut of your jib - you make for some intelligent debate - not trying to sound patronising - also like your username

A lot of the points you make, I've covered in my review of the beats solo2 in color red which is linked a few posts up from this, but what I will add is this:

Beats hating and criticism of many of the older models such as the original beats studio were IMO way disproportional to what they actually were and I don't think the audiophile community gave beats a fair time of it, but that fell on deaf ears here on Head-Fi and that bullying bias has been relentless and still would be in full flow if it weren't for but a handful that led to the one person that could - Tyll Hertsens, whom by his YT video appears genuinely excited about the solo2.

He even recommends at the end of his YT review that "maybe you should just run out and buy one and see for yourself."

And that's my advice too, including you as you may have yourself an "eargasm" - lol (another term of Tyll Hertsens).

And we can all do with a good eargasm, I think you'll agree

Party

 

[cb3723]

Yeah but how many sold them for $300?

What made it worse for Beats is that, on top of that, you'd get people who haven't heard anything else saying it's absolutely the best (like when someone with a Lifestyle system says a Yamaha receiver with Monitor speakers are ugly and the sound sucks based on the price being a fraction of the Bose), and then say that German headphones are ugly (as if a headphone that looks like one kind of rice cake counts for taste).

Well, you could argue the same for beats haters too - most of those hadn't even heard a single beats out of a pair of beats (schiity pun intended) yet joined the bandwagon regardless, so I guess two wrongs don't make a right.

 

[ProtegeManiac]

Well, you could argue the same for beats haters too - most of those hadn't even heard a single beat out of a pair of Beats (Schiity pun intended) yet joined the bandwagon regardless, so I guess two wrongs don't make a right.

 
I can only speak for those who stood in an Apple store to try them (or have had someone they know hand them one for a few minutes), both of which I've done (the latter more times than I'd care to remember).

 

[navii]

  So Tyll Hertsen seems to be the Jesse Jackson of headphone owners. And just curious has anyone owned anything by beats or the Yamaha Pro 500. And when I say own more then a month. 

 
Yes I own them (pro500s). They have a great powerful sound. There is a thread here on them with quite a few people being impressed by them.
 
IMO Yamaha made a mistake of styling them on the beats, so no audiophile wanted to touch them and people who wanted beats bought beats.

 

[cb3723]

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view6/3536825/why-can-t-be-have-both-o.gif

I must have missed that memo when it circulated cos I've got both and don't buy into the (now massively weakened) beats Vs other headphones malarkey for sure

I love the Yamaha Pro 500 on beats Studio steroids design just as much as I like the original design that Yamaha ripped off took inspiration from, that Beats thought took a little too much inspiration from and started legal proceedings against for infringement

 

[TheGame21x]

I don't think Beats are inherently bad for any particular reason, I just think they're overpriced considering their level of sound quality and that you can do far better for much less money in many cases.
 
It doesn't help matters that they have the tightest grip on the price retailers are allowed to sell their headphones for this side of BOSE.

 

[cb3723]

I don't think Beats are inherently bad for any particular reason, I just think they're overpriced considering their level of sound quality and that you can do far better for much less money in many cases.

It doesn't help matters that they have the tightest grip on the price retailers are allowed to sell their headphones for this side of BOSE.

One part of the beats equation that isn't factored in to many people who don't get beats in general - beats is not just an audio but lifestyle products - something that every other manufacturer wish they had also - it's like the X factor.

You can buy a white plain polo shirt for $10 or a plain polo shirt with a Ralph Lauren polo player logo on the top left of chest for $95 - some people wouldn't pay the premium for the small logo and some people wouldn't be seen dead in anything unbranded - it's all about the individual I guess and beats has passed into this type of lifestyle fashion market. But you don't get branded polo shirt haters, but you get this phenomena who hate beats - What? If somebody chooses beats - so what? Why the hate?

Saying that, the new solo2 is very well priced and not excessive compared to other similar performing models from other brands such as Sennheiser and v-moda so beats haters have never been so short of reasoning to their..hate

 

[Folex]

  I don't think Beats are inherently bad for any particular reason, I just think they're overpriced considering their level of sound quality and that you can do far better for much less money in many cases.
 
It doesn't help matters that they have the tightest grip on the price retailers are allowed to sell their headphones for this side of BOSE.

 
That is the typical response to beats. I'm asking if the beats sounded good, had drivers from a respected company, had a good cable and were priced reasonably would you consider them ?

 

[cb3723]

That is the typical response to beats. I'm asking if the beats sounded good, had drivers from a respected company, had a good cable and were priced reasonably would you consider them ?

No,it's not and I've already answered you on this already.

My participation on this thread is over.

Good day, and don't go forgetting about Dre..

K?

Good

 

[TheGame21x]

One part of the beats equation that isn't factored in to many people who don't get beats in general - beats is not just an audio but lifestyle products - something that every other manufacturer wish they had also - it's like the X factor.

You can buy a white plain polo shirt for $10 or a plain polo shirt with a Ralph Lauren polo player logo on the top left of chest for $95 - some people wouldn't pay the premium for the small logo and some people wouldn't be seen dead in anything unbranded - it's all about the individual I guess and beats has passed into this type of lifestyle fashion market. But you don't get branded polo shirt haters, but you get this phenomena who hate beats - What? If somebody chooses beats - so what? Why the hate?

Saying that, the new solo2 is very well priced and not excessive compared to other similar performing models from other brands such as Sennheiser and v-moda so beats haters have never been so short of reasoning to their..hate

 
Well, yeah, but that carries with it a certain quality expectation. I've worn cheap, non Ralph Lauren polos before and there's a distinct difference in quality between the cheap polo and the real thing with the logo on the chest. The stitching is better, the fabric feels better, the workmanship is clearly better. When I compare other headphones to Beats, I don't get the sense that Beats are made better when I hold them in my hands and they certainly don't sound as good as my less expensive headphones so it doesn't win in terms of any particular quality metric in my book.
 
But I'm fully aware that Beats are less about the headphones themselves and more about the status they attribute to their owners. In fact, I wrote a paper about that when I was still in University. They're expensive and carry that mystique. They advertise that the wearer has $300 to spend on something as trivial (to the average listener) as a pair of headphones and their brand has flourished and taken over the market because of it. Beats did a great job of putting their headphones in celebrity hands, which did wonders for the image they have now created.
 
I'm reserving judgment on the new Studio and Solo 2 as I've heard good things about those and I haven't yet heard them myself but the originals were certainly not up to the standard their price would indicate.
 

   
That is the typical response to beats. I'm asking if the beats sounded good, had drivers from a respected company, had a good cable and were priced reasonably would you consider them ?

 
So basically you're asking, if they were completely different headphones, would I consider them? Well, yeah. Heck, I'm considering them as they are now, given that the new Beats headphones are getting good reviews for their sound and not just their image.
 
I'm not a Beats hater in the sense that I wouldn't ever consider them, they're just not high on my list since there are (at least in my opinion) better headphones to be had for less money.

 

[Folex]

No,it's not and I've already answered you on this already.

My participation on this thread is over.

Good day, and don't go forgetting about Dre..

K?

Good

 
I wasn't talking to you, this is why I used a quote on the person I was.

 

[Folex]

  So basically you're asking, if they were completely different headphones, would I consider them? Well, yeah. Heck, I'm considering them as they are now, given that the new Beats headphones are getting good reviews for their sound and not just their image.
 
I'm not a Beats hater in the sense that I wouldn't ever consider them, they're just not high on my list since there are (at least in my opinion) better headphones to be had for less money.

 
 
As a fun experiment I'm tempted to take the beats and make them good, but while still maintaining the same look for about $150 total. And then seeing if I can convert people into liking them. I personally don't like beats because I dislike closed headphones. I've only heard them at best buy and I'd never personally own them due to being closed and too expensive. 

 

[cb3723]

I wasn't talking to you, this is why I used a quote on the person I was.

My apologies - I am dumber than I appear

Nonetheless, it's not a question if beats sound good, have good drivers etc - they already do have majority if not all this criteria, no better exampled than with the current model, the solo2

And that's backed up by the big guy himself, Tyll Hertsens.

Perhaps your thread title would be more accurate and representative if you start from a up to date stand point of the solo2, Studio 2.0, Studio Wireless, mixr, solo HD monochromatic (all current models) that they already have achieved most if not all criteria you state, rather than your current out of date position that your thread title suggests to be otherwise and perhaps more suited to when Monster made beats headphones?

"Beats by Dre question...do you now like them now they have critically acclaimed sound, excellent drivers etc"

In light of the celebrated solo2, this thread and it's timing could be viewed as a passive aggressive form of beats hating in itself as it ignores that model and current crop - just saying

Anyhow, adios, & best of luck with your thread which I can't help but think it's title and premise is fundamentally flawed IMO

 

[Folex]

My apologies - I am dumber than I appear

Nonetheless, it's not a question if beats sound good, have good drivers etc - they already do have majority if not all this criteria, no better exampled than with the current model, the solo2

And that's backed up by the big guy himself, Tyll Hertsens.

Perhaps your thread title would be more accurate and representative if you start from a up to date stand point of the solo2, Studio 2.0, Studio Wireless, mixr, solo HD monochromatic (all current models) that they already have achieved most if not all criteria you state, rather than your current out of date position that your thread title suggests to be otherwise and perhaps more suited to when Monster made beats headphones?

"Beats by Dre question...do you now like them now they have critically acclaimed sound, excellent drivers etc"

In light of the celebrated solo2, this thread and it's timing could be viewed as a passive aggressive form of beats hating in itself as it ignores that model and current crop - just saying

Anyhow, adios, & best of luck with your thread

 
I'm just trying to get at the core of the beat hating. The more I think about it the more it seems inline with any of the ism. I know for a fact part of the culture on here blindly hates on beats because of what other people have said. Don't get me wrong there is also a good amount of people who have tried beats and dislike them. I just can't fully understand the hatred they get when you mention the word "beats". And to the other extreme I can't fully understand the praise for the AT m50x. I love the AT company but I really felt underwhelmed by the m50x's.

 

[Billheiser]

As a fun experiment I'm tempted to take the beats and make them good, but while still maintaining the same look for about $150 total. And then seeing if I can convert people into liking them.

1. How do you propose to redo them ("make them good")?
2. I don't understand - who would need to be "converted"? Those who like good sound would like good sound and hardly need conversion.