[dakanao]

Don't look for Nighthawk-specific pads. Follow this guide and have any size-fitting pads work on your hawks: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/aud...scussion-thread.749762/page-107#post-12209435

Ideal pad size is 105x85mm, but 110x90mm fit too and are easier to find.

Warning: those would change the sound a bit.

 

[Ronengeller]

I was looking into IEM’s that sound like the Nighthawk and the Westone w40 and more so w50 (which Skylar maybe worked on developing) come up. Also the Empire Ears Phantom which probably is the best option since it’s more modern and Empire Ears is really great all around

 

[catom]

I have a pair of Nightowls and they're great. I got a pair of Focal Elegias not long after and gravitated toward them mostly. Though the Nightowls are much more comfortable and I found myself coming back to them often. I do rotate between headphones honestly. I think the Focal is the "better" headphone all around if I want something more engaging. The Nightowls are way more relaxed and easy to listen for long periods of time. So they both have strengths. As do many headphones really.

So I was thinking about also getting a pair of the Nighthawks. ... Do I need another pair really? More importantly, are these two good to compare and contrast? Or are they too close to one another that it's a waste of money?

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

Ever thought about EQing your owls? You would find them much more engaging that you'd think, and they could even become the "better" headphone.
IMHO the hawks are way too close to the owls to justify having both of them. They're almost identical, except for the closed vs. semi-closed thing.
That being said, I have two hawks. But that's only because of their looks (one Wood, one Carbon).

 

[catom]

Ever thought about EQing your owls? You would find them much more engaging that you'd think, and they could even become the "better" headphone.
IMHO the hawks are way too close to the owls to justify having both of them. They're almost identical, except for the closed vs. semi-closed thing.
That being said, I have two hawks. But that's only because of their looks (one Wood, one Carbon).

I have EQ'd the Nightowls. The Focal Elegia is far more resolving and dynamic. There's zero way the Nightowls can compete on that way. Of course I also swapped pads on the Elegia and added a tiny touch of EQ there too...but I'm still not even sure the Nightowls get close to Focal stock.

That said, it's just a different sound too. It's not that the Nightowls are bad. The sound is dark and more atmospheric, liquid, I'd say. It's a super relaxing headphone which is dynamic and has bass and all...just not as in your face as the Focal. Not as much energy or it's energy at a distance. Nightowls are just smoother and more comfortable for longer sessions. Less fatiguing.

Anyway, I do go between them all the time. I enjoy both. I just didn't know if both were worth it. Thanks!

My only open back are Hifiman HE400i and I'm thinking my next pair of headphones should be open back and since I was familiar with Nightowls wanted to see if Nighthawk made sense. I think I might go for a dramatically different headphone so I can keep exploring all the different "house sounds" from each brand.

Then again a spare set of Audioquest ear pads may not be a bad idea. Expensive backup pair

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

I have EQ'd the Nightowls. The Focal Elegia is far more resolving and dynamic. There's zero way the Nightowls can compete on that way.

Of course I assume that you've EQed both to the same target curve, using Oratory presets, and not by yourself. Even so, the owls remain closed so that may be the issue.

The hawks are more closed than they are open, that's for sure. If you want to go really open and radically different, then try a Sundara. Or a DT 1990 Pro. Or many others.

 

[catom]

Of course I assume that you've EQed both to the same target curve, using Oratory presets, and not by yourself. Even so, the owls remain closed so that may be the issue.

The hawks are more closed than they are open, that's for sure. If you want to go really open and radically different, then try a Sundara. Or a DT 1990 Pro. Or many others.

Cool. Yes I used a file for most of the EQ and then added a touch in areas for preference.

I haven't owned a Beyer Dynamic yet, I might look there. Also haven't ever had the fan favorite Senheiser HD 600. I thought about the Sundara as Hifiman had a sale or is having maybe still...but the HE400i may have turned me off of Hifiman. I listened to it for years and did love it, but it was really missing the bass impact. The speed and detail/texture was there, but it never really "moved" me. It was a bit anemic and too laid back. The speed of it was it's saving grace. The planar magnetic is nice, but I'd have to really audition more from Hifiman to get another. I'd say I may just have grown out of or don't like planar, but I guess I do have a planar with more impact with a T50RP I got to mod.

Hmm plus I'm not really after TOTL with budget so thanks for the Beyer Dynamic idea I almost forgot about them. That may be good. That or AKG was also in my head.

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

Well, I have a HD 600, and a Sundara (plus my hawks of course). If bass impact is important for you, then don't get any of them.

• The HD 600 is great. I love it, it my be my favorite headphone. But it lacks bass out of the box, and even EQed it's far from the hawks.
• The Sundara is a planar, it does many things right, but you'll keep missing the bass impact.
• So yeah, maybe a DT 1990 Pro, if you can tame its treble.

 

[catom]

Well, I have a HD 600, and a Sundara (plus my hawks of course). If bass impact is important for you, then don't get any of them.

• The HD 600 is great. I love it, it my be my favorite headphone. But it lacks bass out of the box, and even EQed it's far from the hawks.
• The Sundara is a planar, it does many things right, but you'll keep missing the bass impact.
• So yeah, maybe a DT 1990 Pro, if you can tame its treble.

Really? Interesting. I didn't really read that before so that's very good to know about the HD 600. Thank you. I figured as much from the Sundara though. Cool, definitely going to check out the DT. Thanks again!

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

Really? Interesting. I didn't really read that before so that's very good to know about the HD 600. Thank you. I figured as much from the Sundara though. Cool, definitely going to check out the DT. Thanks again!

Really? The HD 600's frequency response is well known since 1997, lol. Even EQed you will lack bass. Check this: https://www.dropbox.com/s/dm0m6u3s3b4zqzl/Sennheiser HD600.pdf?dl=0
HD 600 are all about their magical midrange, but bass will never be their forte. They are absolutely great, if you love an open headphone with a natural sound (on strings, guitars, vocals, etc.) and a really small, intimate soundstage.
Anyway, sorry all for the off-topic.

 

[dakanao]

Well, I have a HD 600, and a Sundara (plus my hawks of course). If bass impact is important for you, then don't get any of them.

• The HD 600 is great. I love it, it my be my favorite headphone. But it lacks bass out of the box, and even EQed it's far from the hawks.
• The Sundara is a planar, it does many things right, but you'll keep missing the bass impact.
• So yeah, maybe a DT 1990 Pro, if you can tame its treble.

Please don’t spread misinformation. The HD600, Sundara and DT 1990 literally sound the exact same after being EQ’ed to the target curve

 

[Tano]

Please don’t spread misinformation. The HD600, Sundara and DT 1990 literally sound the exact same after being EQ’ed to the target curve

No, they don't. They might sound similar but the physical construction the headphones, driver etc... would make them sound different, specially in the imaging and soundstage department.
I owned both and HD600 and a Sundara, EQd both to the Harman target and they didn't have the same soundstage by any mean.

 

[Jose Hidalgo]

Just so everybody knows, dakanao has been on my ignore list for a couple of years, so I'm not interacting with him anymore.
Plus his post doesn't even make any sense anyway. In my post I was only talking about bass impact (not bass depth). IMHO the HD 600 and the Sundara both lack bass impact for different reasons that have nothing to do with their FR, with or without EQ.
So like I said, maybe the DT 1990 Pro could do better impact-wise, if catom can tame their treble (which literally means 'by EQing them' of course).
I hope that makes everything clear for (almost) everybody.

 

[Arcamera]

Just wanted to share another happy NightHawk moment: Last night I was having that occasional sonic restlessness, that 'audiophilia nervosa-- switching up headphones, nothing sounding right, or satisfying. These were higher-end cans, which I usually really like: from Meze, Audeze, Kennerton, etc. All excellent, but nothing doing it for me in the moment. Put on some sweet chill-down music of Zero 7, pulled out the NightHawks, and ahhh....Yes. Totally hit the spot. Man, these headphones. Sound magic. What is the pixie dust Skylar dropped in here. The funny thing is, they're clearly not sonically 'perfect.' But they present the music in such a way that is so immersive, they have such a beguiling tone, and a mellow dynamism, if I could put it that way. Sorry, getting too wordy. Words can't capture it. This sentiment has been expressed before anyway. All to say, these modest cans continue to be some of my fave, most highly regarded headphones ever.

 

[dakanao]

Just so everybody knows, dakanao has been on my ignore list for a couple of years, so I'm not interacting with him anymore.
Plus his post doesn't even make any sense anyway. In my post I was only talking about bass impact (not bass depth). IMHO the HD 600 and the Sundara both lack bass impact for different reasons that have nothing to do with their FR, with or without EQ.
So like I said, maybe the DT 1990 Pro could do better impact-wise, if catom can tame their treble (which literally means 'by EQing them' of course).
I hope that makes everything clear for (almost) everybody.

Distortion differences are placebo, only fr response matter audibly. There’s no such thing as differences in bass impact.

The Nighthawk with a Harman EQ is all you need for perfect sound reproduction.