[RKML0007]

I got an email notification when the sale went live.

 

[gldgate]

 
Just received the Cybershaft Premium OCXO 10Mhz clock today. Product has nice solid build and comes with certificate of calibration with individual graphs (Allan Deviation and Phase Noise). The recommendation is  (like the Yggy)  to leave the clock on at all times if possible. I will let the clock run for a few hours before doing any listening.  No, I don't normally stack all my equipment like this but this was the best way to get everything in one shot. I am connecting the 10Mhz Cybershaft into the Liveclock via .5M 50-ohm BNC Cable and then running 2 1M 75-ohm cables from Liveclock to RedNet and Mutec. The Atomic clock indicator is lit up on the front  Liveclock display as well as in the Liveclock software which is a good sign that things seem to be working properly. Will provide additional feedback later after some listening sessions.

 

[gldgate]

 
Here is a tighter pix of the Cybershaft with the Atomic Clock indicator showing on the Liveclock.

 

[somestranger26]

  Here is a tighter pix of the Cybershaft with the Atomic Clock indicator showing on the Liveclock.

Looking at the phase noise numbers, this is a better buy than that Jackson Labs Fury that was posted a few pages back. Cybershaft Premium is rated -130dB/Hz at 10Hz and the Fury is -125dB/Hz. Both of these values blow away the Antelope 10MX, though, which is rated at only -87dB/Hz (100x as much noise).
 
The upcoming Mutec Ref 10 is rated for -140dB/Hz, and is rumored to cost 3000 Euro. If the Cybershaft sounds good, it's probably not worth spending so much on something like Ref 10. I think the diminishing return with such an upgrade would be massive.
 
Looking forward to your impressions.

 

[gldgate]

  Looking at the phase noise numbers, this is a better buy than that Jackson Labs Fury that was posted a few pages back. Cybershaft Premium is rated -130dB/Hz at 10Hz and the Fury is -125dB/Hz. Both of these values blow away the Antelope 10MX, though, which is rated at only -87dB/Hz (100x as much noise).
 
The upcoming Mutec Ref 10 is rated for -140dB/Hz, and is rumored to cost 3000 Euro. If the Cybershaft sounds good, it's probably not worth spending so much on something like Ref 10. I think the diminishing return with such an upgrade would be massive.
 
Looking forward to your impressions.

​I'm sure the Mutec Ref 10 will be awesome. In the end I just have a personal hang-up with spending more for a clock than for my DAC. The phase noise of my particular unit was measured at -132.9dB/Hz at 10Hz using a Symmetricom 5115A.

 

[Soundsgoodtome]

So I think I've asked this already. What's the sequence on improving your digital transport from USB?

1) Rednet
2) Mutec MC3 USB or similar (reclocker)
3) Word Clock
4) Atomic Clock
??

 

[somestranger26]

 
​I'm sure the Mutec Ref 10 will be awesome. In the end I just have a personal hang-up with spending more for a clock than for my DAC. The phase noise of my particular unit was measured at -132.9dB/Hz at 10Hz using a Symmetricom 5115A.

Wow that is a really great number. Did you measure it, or did Cybershaft do it before shipping to you?
 

  So I think I've asked this already. What's the sequence on improving your digital transport from USB?

1) Rednet
2) Mutec MC3 USB or similar (reclocker)
3) Word Clock
4) Atomic Clock
??

I believe that is the recommendation and what most people have been doing. It sounds like the word clock makes as much of a difference as the Mutec, but to get that large of a difference you need to already have both the Rednet and the Mutec. Atomic clock is unknown, but you definitely need to have either the Mutec or Word Clock before getting that since Rednet does not accept 10MHz.

 

[gldgate]

  So I think I've asked this already. What's the sequence on improving your digital transport from USB?

1) Rednet
2) Mutec MC3 USB or similar (reclocker)
3) Word Clock
4) Atomic Clock
??

​Will get back to you on Atomic Clock. Will put it through it's paces tonight. Here is how I would recommend purchases to others;
 
1) RedNet (Step one is to get off USB)
2) Mutec - Reclocking helps and the Mutec versatility is amazing
3) Antelope LiveClock - IMO it has a better clock than internal  Mutec and RedNet
 

 

[gldgate]

  Wow that is a really great number. Did you measure it, or did Cybershaft do it before shipping to you?
 
I believe that is the recommendation and what most people have been doing. It sounds like the word clock makes as much of a difference as the Mutec, but to get that large of a difference you need to already have both the Rednet and the Mutec. Atomic clock is unknown, but you definitely need to have either the Mutec or Word Clock before getting that since Rednet does not accept 10MHz.

 
Cybershaft sends out a certificate of calibration with each unit that shows Frequency value, Allan Deviation, Output level, Harmonic Distortion and Phase Noise. They also provide a listing of measurement devices used.
 
My evaluation of the Cybershaft will basically be (a) does the inclusion of the Cybershaft improve sq over Liveclock and (b) if it does do I find it worth the incremental price ($1K).

 

[jabbr]

I'm very much in doubt whether any atomic clock will be able to improve on the Grimm CC1 master clock.

The CC1 has a PLL bandwidth of just 0.1 Hz, meaning that every clock deviation, between internal clock and external 10MHz clock, greater than 0.1 Hz will be rejected and will not be used to adjust the clock frequency.

This give the CC1 an extremely stable clock signal. An additional 10Mhz clock doesn't serve any purpose on the CC1 IMO.

 

[r11bordo]

I have a stupid question : for USB audio, it exits many solutions with renderers based on media servers like LMS, Minimserver, foobar ... But with Audio over IP, what are the soft solutions to manage our audio media libraries ?

 

[jabbr]

I have a stupid question : for USB audio, it exits many solutions with renderers based on media servers like LMS, Minimserver, foobar ... But with Audio over IP, what are the soft solutions to manage our audio media libraries ?

Anything you like, because you need software to play the music into the AOIP (virtual) sound device.
It is not different to USB where you also need software to play into the USB sound device.

The difference between USB and AOIP come into player further in the chain than the playback software.

You can even use your DLNA stuff, as long as it can play into the ASIO driver of your AOIP sound device.

 

[joelha]

I'm very much in doubt whether any atomic clock will be able to improve on the Grimm CC1 master clock.

The CC1 has a PLL bandwidth of just 0.1 Hz, meaning that every clock deviation, between internal clock and external 10MHz clock, greater than 0.1 Hz will be rejected and will not be used to adjust the clock frequency.

This give the CC1 an extremely stable clock signal. An additional 10Mhz clock doesn't serve any purpose on the CC1 IMO.

Hey jabber,

The CC1 automatically adjusts sample rate to match the incoming signal?

Joel

 

[jabbr]

Hey jabber,

The CC1 automatically adjusts sample rate to match the incoming signal?

Joel

It can do in so called Slave mode.
In master mode it has better specifications though.

Do read the CC1 product page, manual and all white papers to familiarize yourself with the device before making a purchase : http://www.grimmaudio.com/pro-products/master-clocks/cc1/

 

[r11bordo]

Anything you like, because you need software to play the music into the AOIP (virtual) sound device.
It is not different to USB where you also need software to play into the USB sound device.

The difference between USB and AOIP come into player further in the chain than the playback software.

You can even use your DLNA stuff, as long as it can play into the ASIO driver of your AOIP sound device.

Clear, AOIP must be considered as a audio driver. The issue is the lack of drivers on Linux platforms. I saw only drivers for Windows or Apple OS. Perhaps it will be soon...