[FredA]

Hi guys,

I have tried v4.075 and v4.076, but i do not get the experience you seem to get.
3d soundstage with pinpoint location... nope, instead boomy decays that make recording with ambient/room information pretty much unlistenable. Like a foggy soundscape where here and there instruments coming through. Which also means, micro details are not as defined as they should be etc.

I have:
Cisco Switch > optical LAN > Ether Regen > Aries Femto > USB > DI20HE > I2S > HE7 2020 > ACSS > HE9 > HD800, HE6, K812 or Adam A7x

All audio stuff has its own power line/phase. Except of room lights with dimmers. But when listening, lights are turned off. Or are the dimmers doing harm, even not in use?

Any ideas what the problem might be?

cheers,
Daniel

I don't know. Dimmers can be noisy indeed. Try another usb cable (wild guess). Or to turn off the lights completely.

 

[blackpepperjam]

I don't know. Dimmers can be noisy indeed. Try another usb cable (wild guess). Or to turn off the lights completely.

Hi Fred,

the lights are turned off when I am listening. I am using 2 USB cables. One of them is an after-market cable that beats the Audioquest Diamond USB. At the moment, the Diamond is in use (just to be sure). I have tried 2 different HDMI I2s cable, the Moshou 8k and the BlueJeans FE, but it doesnt solve the issue.
https://www.amazon.de/gp/product/B07JF3KWTL/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I have tried the AES out of the DI20HE as well with a very high quality cable... without luck.

regards,
Daniel

 

[FredA]

Is burn-in done with all your gears? Did you try 4.07b3? If so, was it good with imaging?

 

[Wynnytsky]

boomy decays that make recording with ambient/room information pretty much unlistenable. Like a foggy soundscape where here and there instruments coming through

that could be 4.076 + really discerning ears.

but imho the soundstage is almost artificially huge and has less attack and a much better decay and micro details are pushed, i.e. echo...cool!.

And as cool as those elements may be, those are the first things that will drive you away from this firmware as they will show up in every song you listen to - no escape! It's even worse in speaker-fi because our walls allow notes to live longer than they do in the recording.

 

[FredA]

@blackpepperjam I am with the monoprice m570 (ridiculously good headphones for the money, they trounce the he560s with my main setup). Listening to Frisell East/west. Imaging is super, decays, details. Depth. Verify that all your power cable are well inserted.

Why 2 usb cables?

 

[FredA]

@blackpepperjam

With a heaphone setup, acheiving the perfect sound is very tricky. Headphone are so different from one another, i'd say it is not possible to have an optimal setup for all headphone sets. For instance, the latest fws gave nice improvments with the m570s. The ones before were not as good while performing well with speakers. With headphones, details are put forward and imaging is different.

I find 4.075 just wonderfull with the m570s, as was 4.07b3. What characterize these is their well developped mid range. Also a relatively present upper range. Very present highs but smooth highs. They are a steal. And a great match with audio-gd.

They need 300h of burn-in, for the bass to fully develop, and after that, frankly, i shake my head and laugh everytime put them on. Like now.
Great balance and res, big smile on my face.

 

[FredA]

While i have the headphones on, it's interesting to swap between the internal and external clock.

Tonality is again better with the internal, with a bit of a fuller midrange. But the soundstage/imaging are obviously not as 3D. The internal is bit more relaxed and musical. But it sounds 2D, like everything is at the same depth. It is so obvious with headphones.

 

[PLGA]

Hi guys,

I have tried v4.075 and v4.076, but i do not get the experience you seem to get.
3d soundstage with pinpoint location... nope, instead boomy decays that make recording with ambient/room information pretty much unlistenable. Like a foggy soundscape where here and there instruments coming through. Which also means, micro details are not as defined as they should be etc.

I have:
Cisco Switch > optical LAN > Ether Regen > Aries Femto > USB > DI20HE > I2S > HE7 2020 > ACSS > HE9 > HD800, HE6, K812 or Adam A7x

All audio stuff has its own power line/phase. Except of room lights with dimmers. But when listening, lights are turned off. Or are the dimmers doing harm, even not in use?

Any ideas what the problem might be?

cheers,
Daniel

Hi Daniel
You have top notch Audio-gd and other gear. It's hard to believe you are not getting the best sound possible.

How is your experience with other firmwares on the DI-20HE? How was the sound?

I have a similar digital chain as you, but with lower quality and my system never sounded as good as now.

 

[marcelnl]

An overly 3d soundstage often is artificial )npt saying this one is but giving caution', try pinpoint instruments in a live session. In my experience one needs to be very sceptical when 3d imaging is described as holgraphic etc, usually dynamics are lacking, which often is a giveaway to investigate phase behaviour over the whole bandwidth. GREAT to see that the developer puts so much effort in FW updates though, that is rare!

trionor is growing...the framework stands, mono as concept so MacGyvering a lot...but still, it should give a good insight in its capabilities tomorrow or tonight.

 

[marcelnl]

Frisell ROCKS, most of his recordings are top notch!

 

[FredA]

Frisell ROCKS, most of his recordings are top notch!

I would not say 4.075 is overly 3D. Le me explain. Having instruments as distinctly (not precisely) located as possible given the recording is a valid goal. I feel that the issue you describe is when a specific audio band is enhanced (some cables do this) and this makes imaging pin point. That is what i call artificial imaging. On the other hand, a better rendition of depth is not artificial IMO. It's in the recording, and sometimes it gets lost through the audio chain, most often at the source.

 

[FredA]

Now listening to Chet Baker/Paul Desmond Together. Not a spectacular album. But it's very inspired, rythhmic, masterfully played, it has fantastic solos. Desmond and Baker are great, but also the guy on keyboards is excellent throughout. At some point he makes a fast solo that i won't be tired of hearing in 20 years from now.

 

[rsbrsvp]

4.075/parallel/usb in, hdmi out/ external clock with external clock on R-7HE as well is the most analogue, musical, 3D sound I have heard on my system. R-7HE in NOS has more detail, in 8X upsample is more full and smooth,

Same set-up with 4.076 has better detail, more forward, one step less musical but still extraordinarily musical.

I could hear how someone could call the new FW's foggy. It is a matter of perception. What I call honey glazed analogue smoothness someone else may perceive as fog. For those who want a more clinical non foggy sound- revert to 4.07b1 or any of the 3.9's....

 

[marcelnl]

I'm not saying there cannot be depth or staging (also in depth), just that often with seemingly pinpoint 3D phase linearity is messed up over the bandwidth and dynamics suffer. Many folks are so dazzled by the 3D they do not miss the dynamics.

 

[FredA]

I'm not saying there cannot be depth or staging (also in depth), just that often with seemingly pinpoint 3D phase linearity is messed up over the bandwidth and dynamics suffer. Many folks are so dazzled by the 3D they do not miss the dynamics.

Dynamics are great too here. I used to have an issue with dynamics in my setup. I fixed it with a cable that enhances the upper mids.

There are many variables you can work with. Power cables is another.