Audeze LCD i4 TOTL In-Ear Monitor Discussion

[sorrick]

This has not been my experience. I bought a b stock i4, with no cipher cable. Messaged Audeze customer service for assistance. Their response was, they have no way of knowing which specific accessories goes into each b stock. Therefore, if I want the cipher cable, I should go buy one. Msrp.

Very p.o.'d first time buyer here.

Ummmm, you got a $2500 iem for $1000, one that is explicitly b-stock so by definition not going to be exactly as stock, and are pissed you may need to pay for an extra accessory? Sorry, I can understand being “Very p.o.’d” about that response if you payed MSRP, but...

If memory serves me right, many b-stocks in the past have included the cipher and I believe that in the past they may have even comped them for those who got b-stocks arrived without them and then asked nicely.

 

[Junmoe62]

Hi guys!

It’s been a while since my last post on the forum, nearly 3 years I believe. For what it is worth, I’ve been listening to my i4 + Beat Audio Billow cable since their release and they still blow my mind as much as they did on day one (with proper EQ obviously). I have yet to find something that could be considered as an upgrade in the portable world. I’ve tried quite a few nice iems (64 Audio 12, 16, 16s, 18, fourte, noir, VE 8, VE Elysium, FiR M5, EE Odin, KSE 1500,...) while they are very good, in my opinion they don’t provide the overall experience the i4 provides and didn’t trigger my GAS just yet! That’s been nearly 4 years guy!!! What?!! I guess, what I’m trying to say is : ”well done Audeze” big time!

Anyways... As you can tell I’m not here to find a replacement for my i4s but to improve my setup for them. So here are a few questions for you :

- Which DAP would you recommend for the i4? My current DAP is my old Ibasso DX200 with Amp 3. It’s a pretty decent sounding DAP but the hardware is quite clunky (battery drains fast and volume button broken) and software UI feels dated. So far I’ve tried few DAPs like AK SP2000, L&P P6, DX220 Max, Cayin N8 and LPGT Titanium. From my brief listening session I’d say they are all awesome sounding and I’d be happy with any of them, but my sonic preference leaned slightly towards LTPG Titanium and DX220 Max. Now where things get more complicated is that the i4 needs EQ and except DX220 Max, none have satisfactory PMEQ. The SP2000 PMEQ is useless, it has very little effect on the sound for some reason... L&P P6 doesn’t have custom EQ, N8 doesn’t have PMEQ and LPGT Ti has a decent PMEQ but it only seems to have 5 bands, 3 filters and a Q# that can’t go beyond 1... The only one that does it right is DX220 Max but it’s huge, heavy and it’s sold out...
I’m currently waiting for the DX300 to be released and try it out. I’m not sure if it could compare to the DAPs mentioned above though... they are not really in the same price range... If you guys have other suggestions I’d really appreciate!

- Do you know of any successful upgrade mod for the Cypher cable V2? My cable is broken so I’m wondering if replacing the cable with high grade cables and modifying the DAC and amp could provide substantial improvements. Also, I remember reading a comment, from @normie610 I believe, stating that he’s got awesome sound with the cypher plugged on his Hibi R8. So if the cable can be upgraded that could be a great option for ultimate portable i4 sound!

Thanks in advance for your help!

Cheers,

Julien.

 

[Infoseeker]

Hi guys!

It’s been a while since my last post on the forum, nearly 3 years I believe. For what it is worth, I’ve been listening to my i4 + Beat Audio Billow cable since their release and they still blow my mind as much as they did on day one (with proper EQ obviously). I have yet to find something that could be considered as an upgrade in the portable world. I’ve tried quite a few nice iems (64 Audio 12, 16, 16s, 18, fourte, noir, VE 8, VE Elysium, FiR M5, EE Odin, KSE 1500,...) while they are very good, in my opinion they don’t provide the overall experience the i4 provides and didn’t trigger my GAS just yet! That’s been nearly 4 years guy!!! What?!! I guess, what I’m trying to say is : ”well done Audeze” big time!

Anyways... As you can tell I’m not here to find a replacement for my i4s but to improve my setup for them. So here are a few questions for you :

- Which DAP would you recommend for the i4? My current DAP is my old Ibasso DX200 with Amp 3. It’s a pretty decent sounding DAP but the hardware is quite clunky (battery drains fast and volume button broken) and software UI feels dated. So far I’ve tried few DAPs like AK SP2000, L&P P6, DX220 Max, Cayin N8 and LPGT Titanium. From my brief listening session I’d say they are all awesome sounding and I’d be happy with any of them, but my sonic preference leaned slightly towards LTPG Titanium and DX220 Max. Now where things get more complicated is that the i4 needs EQ and except DX220 Max, none have satisfactory PMEQ. The SP2000 PMEQ is useless, it has very little effect on the sound for some reason... L&P P6 doesn’t have custom EQ, N8 doesn’t have PMEQ and LPGT Ti has a decent PMEQ but it only seems to have 5 bands, 3 filters and a Q# that can’t go beyond 1... The only one that does it right is DX220 Max but it’s huge, heavy and it’s sold out...
I’m currently waiting for the DX300 to be released and try it out. I’m not sure if it could compare to the DAPs mentioned above though... they are not really in the same price range... If you guys have other suggestions I’d really appreciate!

- Do you know of any successful upgrade mod for the Cypher cable V2? My cable is broken so I’m wondering if replacing the cable with high grade cables and modifying the DAC and amp could provide substantial improvements. Also, I remember reading a comment, from @normie610 I believe, stating that he’s got awesome sound with the cypher plugged on his Hibi R8. So if the cable can be upgraded that could be a great option for ultimate portable i4 sound!

Thanks in advance for your help!

Cheers,

Julien.

I would want an upgrade for bass slam. None of those iems you mention have that?

 

[EagleWings]

@Junmoe62 , wow, you nailed the EQ capabilities/limitations of these DACs. The limited Q setting of Lotoo DAPs is really annoying. But if you can live without a narrow band filter, then the LPGT Ti won't be a bad option, especially since you had personally tried it and liked it. Else, your best bet is to go with an Android DAP and use an app with good PMEQ like the Neutron or the UAPP. Your options are the upcoming DX300 and the Hiby R8. Or if you are okay with stacking, then perhaps an android phone paired with a portable DAC/Amp.

As for modding the cipher cable, I looked into this. From what I gathered, some boutique cable-makers/amp-makers/modders/DIYers located in Asia have successfully modded it. But it is almost impossible to reach them and have it done, unless you have friends in those countries, who could help you with the process.

 

[normie610]

Hi guys!

It’s been a while since my last post on the forum, nearly 3 years I believe. For what it is worth, I’ve been listening to my i4 + Beat Audio Billow cable since their release and they still blow my mind as much as they did on day one (with proper EQ obviously). I have yet to find something that could be considered as an upgrade in the portable world. I’ve tried quite a few nice iems (64 Audio 12, 16, 16s, 18, fourte, noir, VE 8, VE Elysium, FiR M5, EE Odin, KSE 1500,...) while they are very good, in my opinion they don’t provide the overall experience the i4 provides and didn’t trigger my GAS just yet! That’s been nearly 4 years guy!!! What?!! I guess, what I’m trying to say is : ”well done Audeze” big time!

Yeah also for me the i4 is still the one-above-all IEM

- Do you know of any successful upgrade mod for the Cypher cable V2? My cable is broken so I’m wondering if replacing the cable with high grade cables and modifying the DAC and amp could provide substantial improvements. Also, I remember reading a comment, from @normie610 I believe, stating that he’s got awesome sound with the cypher plugged on his Hibi R8. So if the cable can be upgraded that could be a great option for ultimate portable i4 sound!

Thanks in advance for your help!

Cheers,

Julien.

Wow this is the first I’ve heard the cipher can be modded and upgraded! Perhaps you or @EagleWings can provide more info on who can do the mods? Although I can’t really think how to improve the sound, to me it’s just perfect as it is. If you want more bass, you just add a couple of dBs using Audeze iOS app (I added 4 dBs and it sounds amazing ). Rather than tinkering with PMEQ or graphic EQ on a DAP, I think it’s more practical and convenient to use the cipher with DAPs that have USB-C connection.

 

[Junmoe62]

I would want an upgrade for bass slam. None of those iems you mention have that?

What do you mean by bass slam? are you after bass quantity &/or visceral impact?

From memory, Odin, M5 and Noir have very good bass impact. After, I’m not sure if it’s an upgrade to the i4s. With the right amp and EQ the i4s are no slouch either.

@Junmoe62 , wow, you nailed the EQ capabilities/limitations of these DACs. The limited Q setting of Lotoo DAPs is really annoying. But if you can live without a narrow band filter, then the LPGT Ti won't be a bad option, especially since you had personally tried it and liked it. Else, your best bet is to go with an Android DAP and use an app with good PMEQ like the Neutron or the UAPP. Your options are the upcoming DX300 and the Hiby R8. Or if you are okay with stacking, then perhaps an android phone paired with a portable DAC/Amp.

As for modding the cipher cable, I looked into this. From what I gathered, some boutique cable-makers/amp-makers/modders/DIYers located in Asia have successfully modded it. But it is almost impossible to reach them and have it done, unless you have friends in those countries, who could help you with the process.

LPGT Ti is indeed an awesome DAP. It’s probably the best sounding DAP I’ve heard so far and it’s ticking a lot of boxes. It’s not too big, it looks great, the built quality is the best (with SP2000), it’s powerful, it’s fast, has decent EQ and good overall functionalities. Now the downsides are obviously the price, limited PMEQ, no streaming and the worst and most stupid part : its software language is linked to the region where you buy it and can’t be changed... Since I currently live in China, that’s a significant issue... I can speak Chinese quite OK but I can’t read, so spending $4000 on a DAP you can’t read, that’s somewhat a downer...

So I guess it’s better to check other options before committing.

Concerning the Cipher modding, do you have more informations? I’m living in Shanghai, do you know which boutique offered the service and where they are based?
Do you know if it’s got a significant impact on SQ?
Do you know how much they modify the device? I mean, I’m OK if it’s a little bigger but I don’t want to hang a desktop amp around my neck either!!
Do you have any link to share about that or pointing a direction where I should look for to gather more information?

Thanks a lot for your help!

Yeah also for me the i4 is still the one-above-all IEM



Wow this is the first I’ve heard the cipher can be modded and upgraded! Perhaps you or @EagleWings can provide more info on who can do the mods? Although I can’t really think how to improve the sound, to me it’s just perfect as it is. If you want more bass, you just add a couple of dBs using Audeze iOS app (I added 4 dBs and it sounds amazing ). Rather than tinkering with PMEQ or graphic EQ on a DAP, I think it’s more practical and convenient to use the cipher with DAPs that have USB-C connection.

Well... regarding the mod, I don’t have any information. It was just a wild guess from my part. Since many people get their DAPs modded, I guess it should technically be possible to do so for the Cipher as well. And it would be cool to optimize it to the max!


Thanks guys for your help, I really do appreciate!

Cheers,

Julien

 

[Infoseeker]

Yes I meant that visceral impact.

 

[EagleWings]

@normie610 and @Junmoe62 , last year around this time I had joined a couple of earbuds groups on FB and on one of the groups, I came across a post showing picture of the cipher cable modded with an upgrade cable. I couldn't find out what other mods the cipher cable carried, as the post was written in either Thai or Indonesian. Around the same time, I remember seeing a post on reddit that someone in Japan modifies the cipher cables and it would be nearly impossible for anyone outside Japan to get in touch with the person. I reached out to Plussound Cables and asked them if they can replace the stock cable of the cipher cable and they said it won't be possible as the wire entry hole of the lightning plug and the DAC module is way too small to accommodate their cables.

 

[normie610]

@normie610 and @Junmoe62 , last year around this time I had joined a couple of earbuds groups on FB and on one of the groups, I came across a post showing picture of the cipher cable modded with an upgrade cable. I couldn't find out what other mods the cipher cable carried, as the post was written in either Thai or Indonesian. Around the same time, I remember seeing a post on reddit that someone in Japan modifies the cipher cables and it would be nearly impossible for anyone outside Japan to get in touch with the person. I reached out to Plussound Cables and asked them if they can replace the stock cable of the cipher cable and they said it won't be possible as the wire entry hole of the lightning plug and the DAC module is way too small to accommodate their cables.

Thanks bud! Seems like the mod is impossible to get, much like the lost city of gold

 

[Junmoe62]

@normie610 and @Junmoe62 , last year around this time I had joined a couple of earbuds groups on FB and on one of the groups, I came across a post showing picture of the cipher cable modded with an upgrade cable. I couldn't find out what other mods the cipher cable carried, as the post was written in either Thai or Indonesian. Around the same time, I remember seeing a post on reddit that someone in Japan modifies the cipher cables and it would be nearly impossible for anyone outside Japan to get in touch with the person. I reached out to Plussound Cables and asked them if they can replace the stock cable of the cipher cable and they said it won't be possible as the wire entry hole of the lightning plug and the DAC module is way too small to accommodate their cables.

@EagleWings thanks for your help. I’ll keep searching if I can find someone who can do this kind of mod in China but it doesn’t seem like it’s going to be an easy task... :s
if I find something I’ll let you guys know, in case you’re interested!

 

[regit]

@EagleWings thanks for your help. I’ll keep searching if I can find someone who can do this kind of mod in China but it doesn’t seem like it’s going to be an easy task... :s
if I find something I’ll let you guys know, in case you’re interested!

@EagleWings thanks for your help. I’ll keep searching if I can find someone who can do this kind of mod in China but it doesn’t seem like it’s going to be an easy task... :s
if I find something I’ll let you guys know, in case you’re interested!

With all the discussions on having the proper EQ setting, having cypher cable converted, etc. Why not change the source files?

Not sure if this has been suggested, but what I did was to get a copy of dbPoweramp, I believe it is going for around $88. DbPoweramp has batch conversion and support vst. You can load the Audeze Reveal plugin and apply the relevant setting to the converted files. Did it with iSine10 and 20, and now with LCDi4 with great result.

This way by changing the source, you can use whatever DAP you like, use whatever fancy cable you want. You can evaluate equipment better as well since you will take out the guess work of how EQ/PEQ is implemented by different manufacturers, and just concentrate on their technical merits.

dbPoweramp has a trial I believe, so you can give it a try. Btw, I am not affiliated with dbPoweramp.

 

[regit]

Yes, using the fins that hold onto your concha of the ear. Plus the official ridged/knurled? tips.

Can never get the fin to work with my ears, nor find the hook particularly comfortable. End up wearing them left-to-right and right-to-left. Using the cable as hook, like many C/IEMs. Attached photo is what I meant.

 

[normie610]

With all the discussions on having the proper EQ setting, having cypher cable converted, etc. Why not change the source files?

Not sure if this has been suggested, but what I did was to get a copy of dbPoweramp, I believe it is going for around $88. DbPoweramp has batch conversion and support vst. You can load the Audeze Reveal plugin and apply the relevant setting to the converted files. Did it with iSine10 and 20, and now with LCDi4 with great result.

This way by changing the source, you can use whatever DAP you like, use whatever fancy cable you want. You can evaluate equipment better as well since you will take out the guess work of how EQ/PEQ is implemented by different manufacturers, and just concentrate on their technical merits.

dbPoweramp has a trial I believe, so you can give it a try. Btw, I am not affiliated with dbPoweramp.

It’s a good alternative but the effort of converting thousands of songs in my library seems pretty daunting. Also it doesn’t solve the EQ for streaming

 

[edwardsean]

Can never get the fin to work with my ears, nor find the hook particularly comfortable. End up wearing them left-to-right and right-to-left. Using the cable as hook, like many C/IEMs. Attached photo is what I meant.

Interesting. What tips are those?

 

[regit]

Interesting. What tips are those?

Stock tips, with a single comply form cut into half and stuff underneath the tips.