[Undun]

This thread is kinda unreadable

Thank the heavens for @Currawong's LCD-5 impressions thread.

 

[04gto]

Kind of makes you wonder about the claims that these headphones are burning in once received then.

 

[cantara256]

Thank the heavens for @Currawong's LCD-5 impressions thread.

And to help restore some sanity to this thread, here it is: https://www.head-fi.org/threads/audeze-lcd-5-impressions-thread-read-the-first-post.960291/

 

[Xcalibur255]

To make an analogy, have any of you ever changed your TV to it's theater or reference picture setting after watching it for a long time with it stuck in "vivid" or "sport" mode? Your first thought is going to be "yuck, it all looks really yellow" I would bet. Here's the trick though: if you change the setting then immediately turn it off and don't watch it again until tomorrow, that won't happen. The whites won't look yellow they'll just be white. This is a classic example of how your brain messes with your sensory perceptions, it is comparing the information your eyes are picking up now with what they were picking up a moment ago and doing some blending and twisting to normalize that perception and highlight perceived differences.

The same thing is true with headphones. If I pop an AKG K701 off my head and immediately listen to an LCD-2 what I hear is this thick soupy mess, and if we do it in the opposite direction I hear a super thin shrill horribly bright assault on my ears. Does that mean the LCD-2 is a flabby soupy mess or the K701 is so bright than it makes you physically cringe? Nope, it means your subconscious is extrapolating the previous and current experience and exaggerating the differences between them. Many thousands of years ago these subconscious functions helped us survive. Now they just fuel arguments on web forums and serve as a reminder that when we make a change to something we have grown used to we need to be PATIENT before drawing conclusions about that change.

 

[ThanatosVI]

or the K701 is so bright than it makes you physically cringe?

Yes

 

[Xcalibur255]

Yes

lol, okay maybe but you still get the point I'm trying to make.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

To make an analogy, have any of you ever changed your TV to it's theater or reference picture setting after watching it for a long time with it stuck in "vivid" or "sport" mode? Your first thought is going to be "yuck, it all looks really yellow" I would bet. Here's the trick though: if you change the setting then immediately turn it off and don't watch it again until tomorrow, that won't happen. The whites won't look yellow they'll just be white. This is a classic example of how your brain messes with your sensory perceptions, it is comparing the information your eyes are picking up now with what they were picking up a moment ago and doing some blending and twisting to normalize that perception and highlight perceived differences.

The same thing is true with headphones. If I pop an AKG K701 off my head and immediately listen to an LCD-2 what I hear is this thick soupy mess, and if we do it in the opposite direction I hear a super thin shrill horribly bright assault on my ears. Does that mean the LCD-2 is a flabby soupy mess or the K701 is so bright than it makes you physically cringe? Nope, it means your subconscious is extrapolating the previous and current experience and exaggerating the differences between them. Many thousands of years ago these subconscious functions helped us survive. Now they just fuel arguments on web forums and serve as a reminder that when we make a change to something we have grown used to we need to be PATIENT before drawing conclusions about that change.

Yup. This is what makes us super unique.

Mood, energy levels, internal/external factors, time of day, and so much more, all factor in on how we hear, see, taste, feel, etc. Our sense are all malleable, and never exactly the same from one day to the next.

This is why the burn in talk is just silly to me, mainly in one specific way. (not saying burn in ain't real, but this is besides the point I'm trying to make)

You can listen to a headphone from day 1 and feel...oh it's a bit bright, etc.

Take a week off not listening to them, come back on another day when you feel different, and all the sudden all the issues you had are gone. Nothing else changed, just you listening on a different day, with different mood, energy, etc, has altered the way you hear.

You step into a dark room and can't see anything. Wait a bit, and all the sudden you can see in the dark room quite well.

You can wake up and turn on a TV, and with the volumeat 7, you're like..."Damn, I'm gonna wake everyone else up.". Come back in the middle of the day, and all the sudden you can't hear much of anything until you have the volume at 30.

Or stepping in to a jacuzzi. You jump in, you're gonna get burned. You move in slowly, you'll be just fine.

Sight, hearing, touch, taste, etc, all vary by so many factors. All specific to you alone, and never exactly the same. So why is it that when people hear a change in a headphone, they refuse to believe it's their own body/ears adjusting? It's absolutely baffling to me.

It's also why I never take immediate impressions of something seriously. We do not know what their specific ears were attuned to. You only hear Grados, yeah an Audeze will sound dark, and muffled. You only hear an LCD-2, yeah, Grados will sound like metallic scratching, etc.

You gotta give everything, EVERYTHING time. Let your ears adjust to the changes from headphone to headphone.

Burn in is something we can say is debatable. Personal senses like hearing changing in varying degrees? That's just proven science.

 

[rangerid]

FWIW, my preferences seem to align very closely with @Resolve 's, so I put a lot of stock in his reviews. As well, the number of people on this thread who are reporting that they prefer the LCD-5 with EQ over the stock tuning leads me to conclude that I'm likely to feel the same way. YMMV.

The things that give me a bit of pause about the LCD-5 are that EQ is not practical for me in every listening context, plus I don't feel like anything's missing when I listen to the Susvara without EQ. If I find that the quality of the LCD-5's bass is as fantastic as folks are claiming, it might be enough for me to justify purchasing the LCD-5 (and likely dealing with EQ). TBD, but I'm currently in no rush.

Yea I find my preferences align pretty close to Resolve's as well. LCD 5s are definitely tempting and I will be trying to get a demo soon as well but at this point, having heard many of the TOTL offerings, I am looking for something that definitely beats the Susvara/TCs I have, which is a pretty tough ask. I really don't need 3 pairs of headphones for my listening habits.

The other factor to consider is I found the Susvaras to change a LOT depending on the DAC/Amp used, I've run it through like 10 different amps and probably close to 20 different DACs now and of all the headphones Susvaras seem to take on the characteristics of the chain more heavily than other headphones, like people complain about the bass/slam on Susvaras but on my current setup the only headphone that slams harder are the TCs... and it's not by a lot

 

[KMann]

"A rose by any other name would smell as sweet"

I don't think it is productive to have endless arguments whether or not burn-in is real, it is irrelevant. What matter is is at the end if you still like the headphone. Listener acclimation is a true and proven phenomenon and that is not a bad thing, nothing to be shy about. We burn-in headphones for two days for quality control purposes and if they undergo mechanical change during this period, that is not a bad thing either because we do measure them again.

For the best acclimation, I recommend listening to the headphone exclusively for about a week.

 

[ozz007]

"A rose by any other name would smell as sweet"

I don't think it is productive to have endless arguments whether or not burn-in is real, it is irrelevant. What matter is is at the end if you still like the headphone. Listener acclimation is a true and proven phenomenon and that is not a bad thing, nothing to be shy about. We burn-in headphones for two days for quality control purposes and if they undergo mechanical change during this period, that is not a bad thing either because we do measure them again.

When, I got my LCD-XC, last week, the first time I put them on, they sounded weird, so I let them play for like 6 to 8 hours, and came back, to check, they actually sounded better than when I put them on my head.

Now I was under impression that AUDEZE, burn-in all of their headphones?

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

When, I got my LCD-XC, last week, the first time I put them on, they sounded weird, so I let them play for like 6 to 8 hours, and came back, to check, they actually sounded better than when I put them on my head.

Now I was under impression that AUDEZE, burn-in all of their headphones?

This has been explained a million times before. Yes, Audeze has a burn in station for QC purposes.

As for coming back to your XC? That can be attributed to what I just said on my last post, personal senses changing. But hey... that's my opinion based on proven science.

You don't hear the same when you wake up, in the middle of the day, and when you go to sleep. Your body is constantly acclimating to internal and external factors including mood and state of mind.

Ergo, expectation bias being one such thing.

 

[bfreedma]

"A rose by any other name would smell as sweet"

I don't think it is productive to have endless arguments whether or not burn-in is real, it is irrelevant. What matter is is at the end if you still like the headphone. Listener acclimation is a true and proven phenomenon and that is not a bad thing, nothing to be shy about. We burn-in headphones for two days for quality control purposes and if they undergo mechanical change during this period, that is not a bad thing either because we do measure them again.

I fully understand that it probably isn’t possible to dedicate a measurement rig to a single set of headphones due to the need to test a continuous stream of new builds but…

It would be interesting to see if there is any measurable change on a new set of headphones that weren’t moved on the rig over a few days of “burn in”.

 

[ozz007]

This has been explained a million times before. Yes, Audeze has a burn in station for QC purposes.

As for coming back to your XC? That can be attributed to what I just said on my last post, personal senses changing. But hey... that's my opinion based on proven science.

You don't hear the same when you wake up, in the middle of the day, and when you go to sleep. Your body is constantly acclimating to internal and external factors.

You go Boy.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

I fully understand that it probably isn’t possible to dedicate a measurement rig to a single set of headphones due to the need to test a continuous stream of new builds but…

It would be interesting to see if there is any measurable change on a new set of headphones that weren’t moved on the rig over a few days of “burn in”.

Rtings has done that with various headphones, and have come up with inconslusive evidence. Meaning, nothing changed to a degree one can say it works or doesn't.

One person will say that's proof nothing changes, another will say, it's inconclusive because the changes were subtle but were there.

You'll never win, regardless of which side you're on.

 

[All Day Breakfast]

"A rose by any other name would smell as sweet"

I don't think it is productive to have endless arguments whether or not burn-in is real, it is irrelevant. What matter is is at the end if you still like the headphone. Listener acclimation is a true and proven phenomenon and that is not a bad thing, nothing to be shy about. We burn-in headphones for two days for quality control purposes and if they undergo mechanical change during this period, that is not a bad thing either because we do measure them again.

For the best acclimation, I recommend listening to the headphone exclusively for about a week.

Since you measure them again after burn-in at the factory, what would be the argument against including that measurement in the box for the end consumer?