Originally Posted by White Mike /img/forum/go_quote.gif Would those be the same "younger people" that have record amounts of personal debt, multiple credit cards and think it's perfectly fine to buy everything on credit without paying it all back in the same billing cycle?
It's pretty clear that you don't understand how the US economy functions.
Originally Posted by gorgak /img/forum/go_quote.gif It's pretty clear that you don't understand how the US economy functions.
Don't be silly. I was not referring to the US economy specifically. More that there's a generation of kids that have been racking up debt for so long that a correction like this might just teach them a few lessons about money.
Americas (and many other nations) addiction to cheap credit was not just about bankers playing with CDOs but consumers who don't understand how to manage and reduce thier exposure to personal debt.
Originally Posted by Hardwired /img/forum/go_quote.gif There will still be a few mature trees left to start over with.
I'm afraid Paulson is throwing fertilizer on some that should be left to die.
But this ex-Goldman guy wouldn't save Lehman, would he? Lehman needed to be bailed out, with appropriate sanctions. Failing to do so is the absolute direct cause of the credit market halt. Block a major artery and cardiac arrest follows. He knew damn well how much of the market's cash flowed through Lehman, and just didn't care. Someone big had to fail to satisfy the blood-thirsty mob, so why not let it be his (former) arch competitor?
Barclays saved the jobs of lots of honest, worthy, smart Lehman people. Barclays got a good deal, and did a good thing. Hats off to them. I'm buying Barclays ETFs to reward them (not that they will notice or care about my tiny amounts). Some Barclay ETFs are based on Lehman index calculations ... there's a conflict of interest waiting to happen. That's like Sterophile reviewing a set of headphones they manufacture. Well not quite. Anyway, I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed this, so it'll get fixed, but life right about now sure is "funny".
Listening to great music thru super HPs is a wonderful way to forget about the markets.
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I now feel better about spending way too much money on audio gear during the past 8 years or so. Those funds have lost less than half of their original value!
In general when it's time of crisis people tend to spend less. This could also aply on audio gear. So maybe if a lot of people cancelled orders, the waiting time for say a pico would go down - thats positive right?
The local currency just had its biggest drop against foreign currencies overnight; +/- 18% agains the likes of the Euro, AUD, USD and GBP. Talk about putting a dent in purchasing plans! And as mentioned, that was just overnight....lost an additional +/- 15% in the past few weeks so we are over 30% worse for wear
Seriously; I read an article just the other day that pointed this out. That kids; especially Girls, but even Boys, are having a hard time even admitting to their friends that they like Math because it's considered a bad thing and leaves them open to ridicule and consternation due to the aversion to Math presented in the Popular Culture prevalent in the US today and during the past couple of decades.
I totally agree. I just got finished reading (well listening to it on CD audiobook) "The World is Flat" and Friedman does a really good job at discussing what the current trends in the shifting world markets, globalization of companies, and outsourcing says for what the job market will look like in the next 10-20 years. More and more jobs will be requiring someone with a sound fundamental background in math and science. People who self proclaim "I am not really that good or that interested in math or science" will seem a lot less valuable in a future where more and more manufacturing or remedial taks are being outsourced to other countries or to a computer program. To be a value to a company of the future will require that you have a a strong multidisiplanary education that can allow you to take on the more advanced tasks. Other Countries as of late seem to clearly value science and math more in their education system than does the US. I really think that in the next 50 years we are going to see the decline of American as the sole global power and countries like India and China are going to have even more influence on the world economy, possible overtaking the US. Of course it is not a zero sum game, therefore it is possible that America will still see its standards of living increase while our position relative to other countries falls. Call it the Dream Team effect (Bronze at Athens), we became too complacent with our position at the top. We didn't realize that while we were watching the Laguna Beach some little Indian boy or Chinese girl was hard at work studying because their poor parents told them they will never make it in life unless they are the best in their country so that they can emmigrate to America. We are already starting to see that the best and brightest of these countries no longer "need" to come to America to make it, they can make top dollar in their home country, adding to the shortage of skilled engineers and scientists in the US.
I don't know if putting kids in debt the rest of their lives is the best way to teach lessons Mike.
I hope our communities get to know and be able to trust one another again. Gas prices are predicted to keep dropping and help steady to rising inflation on food and other products. Maybe we will start meeting in houses instead of bars and not continue turning into a society of beggars and whiners.
Originally Posted by manaox2 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't know if putting kids in debt the rest of their lives is the best way to teach lessons Mike.
I hope our communities get to know and be able to trust one another again. Gas prices are predicted to keep dropping and help steady to rising inflation on food and other products. Maybe we will start meeting in houses instead of bars and not continue turning into a society of beggars and whiners.
Excellent thoughts except I really disagree with lower gas prices - short term maybe, but long term there is now way that the oil producers can produce enough oil to keep up with global demand plus all the new cars going on the road in places like China and India. Not a chance, plus add to that the likelihood of an eventual weaker U.S. Dollar and that spells double trouble.
Originally Posted by Hadden /img/forum/go_quote.gif Maybe this is the end of shallow, spoiled brat culture. Hardtimes make people get real.
No more people being famous for nothing?!? Ha! What on earth do you expect Jane & Joe Public to watch on TV? Since the 16th century we've had an entire caste of people who do nothing productive but instead spend an ungodly amount of money on fashionable clothes, wild parties, and generally behave exactly like the town drunk, but with lesser jail terms and boatloads of money. And in return the other 99.9% of humanity is allowed to collectively ridicule, hate, and lust after them. Only now we do it with 1080p HD televisions instead of having to take a Jubilee-year vacation from the farm to watch the fops & dandies in London towne.
If anything crippling economic hardship will only serve to make us loathe these people even more when they get all junked-up on Jupiter oil and drive the Rolls-Royce into their indoor swimming pool. Without this "moral scapegoat" class of people, humanity would descend into chaos! Cats would lay with dogs, frogs will rain-down from the sky and Belize will become a world superpower.
Originally Posted by Hadden /img/forum/go_quote.gif Maybe this is the end of shallow, spoiled brat culture. Hardtimes make people get real.
I agree.
One other thing I've noticed, now that the market is down more than 30 percent: Less smugness from the yuppie stock market & real estate "experts" in this area.
The downturn is a good reminder that real estate prices do go down as well as up, and an equities remain unpredictable.
This has been a suitably humbling experience for many.
It's important to know the difference between lucky and good.
On a different subject (perhaps for another thread), I fully expect a cratering of the credit card companies. Financiers have "discovered" that even secured credit's a bitch. Just wait until they get a taste of mass unsecured defaults.
A few miles away from Casa Bob lies the worldwide headquarters of Capital One--they have built a lovely & large new corporate "campus" here. I checked out their balance sheet and cash flows recently. If I had the guts to short it, I would be doing so with all my might.
Originally Posted by Robert Linthicum /img/forum/go_quote.gif I agree.
One other thing I've noticed, now that the market is down more than 30 percent: Less smugness from the yuppie stock market & real estate "experts" in this area.
The downturn is a good reminder that real estate prices do go down as well as up, and an equities remain unpredictable.
This has been a suitably humbling experience for many.
It's important to know the difference between lucky and good.
On a different subject (perhaps for another thread), I fully expect a cratering of the credit card companies. Financiers have "discovered" that even secured credit's a bitch. Just wait until they get a taste of mass unsecured defaults.
A few miles away from Casa Bob lies the worldwide headquarters of Capital One--they have built a lovely & large new corporate "campus" here. I checked out their balance sheet and cash flows recently. If I had the guts to short it, I would be doing so with all my might.
Yuppie & real estate class: maybe it's a kind of self-loathing that makes me despise these type so -- it's my status I think, when it comes down to it -- at least my very middleclass background.
There just seems to be so many puffed up occupations that provide and produce nothing of value. Nothing begets nothing. All part of a way of thinking that makes people who earn less than 30g take on massive morgages with blissful delusion.
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