[bluesaint]

From a consumer standpoint however, you made your research, you bought V1 at retail, you didn't return it during the free return period. At that point realistically you made your decision. While hfm blows for not spending more time to polish their products, but the consumer doesn't have a valid standing to demand anything though. MrSpeakrers ether and flows were similar. Ether price dropped after flows were released and the upgrade while charges less, also changes less parts.

 

[ruhenheiM]

They do give you the new V2 as well. So they would make a total of $2650 and give away a pair of an HEK v2 for it. Thats not a bad price. Yes people who paid full $3K for V1 were in a bad place.

yeah.but you have to remember basically if you're the original owner of v1. that v2 cost 3650+shipping+tax whatever.when actually you could buy the v2 for 3000usd+shippin+tax whatever.and like roskodan said forget the used market.they basically control it.if you want to sell it you have to sell it lower than 2000usd. so either you stuck with hifiman or get the hell out of there after they finish fuc i mean "service" you
 
and yes the total lost for hifiman is $350.which means 350 less profit.but if i'm not mistaken fang said something about v2 manufacturing cost being cheaper than the v1 in the already closed edition 6 thread. and it might be true. edition xv2  price is cheaper than edition xv1. it would be nice if they just recall it.but hey apparently some people just really happy paying $650 more.maybe that's just how hifiman said you're welcome to their customer thanking them for their excellent customer service.
 

 
 
and again hifiman is not alone.some new headphone manufacturers done almost similar thing. but at least they keep their mouth shut. while hifiman keep jabbing you about how great their product is and why the price is so justified and acting like there's no problem about them.maybe the less they say things the better
 
 
price your products whatever you want.its your products.if people bitching about it.fine... let them go to other places or let them make their own products or maybe you start listening to them if its reasoning and make sense. that's kinda good feedback but please whatever approach you choose, just make sure you finish your product first and hopefully kinda justified everything
 
no product should be released before it’s time.again not everyone like paying the company to be beta tester.they're not working for your company. they on the other side of register

 

[bosiemoncrieff]

MrSpeakrers ether and flows were similar. Ether price dropped after flows were released and the upgrade while charges less, also changes less parts.

You get a little bit of wiggle room with your customers when you charge something in the ballpark of $1500 rather than $3000.

 

[Jozurr]

  that is irrelevant,
 
my point is, why charge $650 + shipping for the upgrade, if they plan to make more than enough $$$ to cover for it, by reselling the v1?
 
also one can not insure the package cos they ll charge you their import tax if the parcel is declared above $50, so if it gets damaged in transit, you are screwed,
 
like if one would not be entitled to a recall after spending $3k

 
As I explained, they charge you the $650 to cover some cost of the amount lost in selling the V1 again. In total they make less money by offering the upgrade even at $650 compared to them not offering an upgrade at all. They aren't just taking a $650 and selling it at $2K making a profit of $1350. They are losing a V2 in the process of it and making $350 less overall.
 

  yeah.but you have to remember basically if you're the original owner of v1. that v2 cost 3650+shipping+tax whatever.when actually you could buy the v2 for 3000usd+shippin+tax whatever.and like roskodan said forget the used market.they basically control it.if you want to sell it you have to sell it lower than 2000usd. so either you stuck with hifiman or get the hell out of there after they finish fuc i mean "service" you
 
and yes the total lost for hifiman is $350.which means 350 less profit.but if i'm not mistaken fang said something about v2 manufacturing cost being cheaper than the v1 in the already closed edition 6 thread. and it might be true. edition xv2  price is cheaper than edition xv1. it would be nice if they just recall it.but hey apparently some people just really happy paying $650 more.maybe that's just how hifiman said you're welcome to their customer thanking them for their excellent customer service.
 

 
 
and again hifiman is not alone.some new headphone manufacturers done almost similar thing. but at least they keep their mouth shut. while hifiman keep jabbing you about how great their product is and why the price is so justified and acting like there's no problem about them.maybe the less they say things the better
 
 
price your products whatever you want.its your products.if people bitching about it.fine... let them go to other places or let them make their own products or maybe you start listening to them if its reasoning and make sense. that's kinda good feedback but please whatever approach you choose, just make sure you finish your product first and hopefully kinda justified everything
 
no product should be released before it’s time.again not everyone like paying the company to be beta tester.they're not working for your company. they on the other side of register

 
Yes I'd be pissed if I paid $3K for V1 and then had a V2 came out next day and had to pay another $650++ to upgrade. Happens in a lot of industries, shouldn't happen in audio as much. However, I was only addressing the fact that it is made to look that hifiman is making an additional $1350 profit from the upgrade, whereas they lose $350 in total. Going strictly by selling prices as we dont know anything about underlying costs etc. I understand from the consumer point of view it sucks. I don't like HFM practices as well, but we can't fool with the math.
 
I'm not going to get into discussion for profits of these companies because that is a separate debate.

 

[thefitz]

How do we all feel about the HE1000 V2 upgrade program anyway?

 

[mulder01]

Refresh my memory of why everyone jumped on the one guy who heard the headphone and liked it better than the HE6? I mean, given the price difference you could assume there are significant sonic differences, right?

I remember back in the day there was a regular head fier with thousands of relevant posts who had a problem with the Abyss's price. Spent a lot of energy telling everyone what he thought of them (without hearing them) and how the company was screwing it's customers and how they were not worth the money even though he hadn't heard them and never intended to hear them - insisting that he didn't need to hear them to know that they were a rip off and that the company holds all it's customers in contempt etc etc. Anyway, he's been banned now. That's the end of the story.

 

[Jozurr]

Refresh my memory of why everyone jumped on the one guy who heard the headphone and liked it better than the HE6? I mean, given the price difference you could assume there are significant sonic differences, right?

I remember back in the day there was a regular head fier with thousands of relevant posts who had a problem with the Abyss's price. Spent a lot of energy telling everyone what he thought of them (without hearing them) and how the company was screwing it's customers and how they were not worth the money even though he hadn't heard them and never intended to hear them - insisting that he didn't need to hear them to know that they were a rip off and that the company holds all it's customers in contempt etc etc. Anyway, he's been banned now. That's the end of the story.

 
Just because both those headphones are inefficient, I'm not sure why they are being said that they are essentially the same as HE6. That's like saying all 300 ohm headphones are the same. 
 
Yes it's fashionable to crap on HFM, but they do create headphones that others can't or dont. I for one have not found a replacement that sounds better to me than the HE-6. Were those the golden days of HFM? Maybe. Can they do it again? Possibly. Price seems to be the only big problem here, for various reasons discussed over and over and over again.

 

[roskodan]

Refresh my memory of why everyone jumped on the one guy who heard the headphone and liked it better than the HE6? I mean, given the price difference you could assume there are significant sonic differences, right?

 
first, because he spoke in absolute terms about something that is strictly a matter of personal taste and perception, second because he never compared the 2 headphones in question (hifiman booth had the new amp too !!!), also he is listing all his current, past and sold gear under his profile, but the he-6 mysteriously didn't make the list (sus-vara-picious)
 

Refresh my memory of why everyone jumped on the one guy who heard the headphone and liked it better than the HE6? I mean, given the price difference you could assume there are significant sonic differences, right?

I remember back in the day there was a regular head fier with thousands of relevant posts who had a problem with the Abyss's price. Spent a lot of energy telling everyone what he thought of them (without hearing them) and how the company was screwing it's customers and how they were not worth the money even though he hadn't heard them and never intended to hear them - insisting that he didn't need to hear them to know that they were a rip off and that the company holds all it's customers in contempt etc etc. Anyway, he's been banned now. That's the end of the story.

 
wasn't banned for what he was 'speaking', but because of the way he was 'speaking'
 

  As I explained, they charge you the $650 to cover some cost of the amount lost in selling the V1 again. In total they make less money by offering the upgrade even at $650 compared to them not offering an upgrade at all. They aren't just taking a $650 and selling it at $2K making a profit of $1350. They are losing a V2 in the process of it and making $350 less overall.

 
well your explanation is bad cos you are missing the part where they avoid import taxes, retailers' cuts etc.
 

  Just because both those headphones are inefficient, I'm not sure why they are being said that they are essentially the same as HE6. That's like saying all 300 ohm headphones are the same. 
 
Yes it's fashionable to crap on HFM, but they do create headphones that others can't or dont. I for one have not found a replacement that sounds better to me than the HE-6. Were those the golden days of HFM? Maybe. Can they do it again? Possibly. Price seems to be the only big problem here, for various reasons discussed over and over and over again.

 
no one said that, selective reading again?
 
hifiman wrote the edition 6 / susvara is basically a different shape hek (v3) with 'stealth magnets' and he6 style golden conductors on the diaphragm, check the locked edition 6 thread, tho many posts were deleted, you can still find the open letter fang wrote if you google

 

[Jozurr]

first, because he spoke in absolute terms about something that is strictly a matter of personal taste and perception, second because he never compared the 2 headphones in question (hifiman booth had the new amp too !!!), also he is listing all his current, past and sold gear under his profile, but the he-6 mysteriously didn't make the list (sus-vara-picious)


wasn't banned for what he was 'speaking', but because of the way he was 'speaking'


well your explanation is bad cos you are missing the part where they avoid import taxes, retailers' cuts etc.


no one said that, selective reading again?

hifiman wrote the edition 6 / susvara is basically a different shape hek (v3) with 'stealth magnets' and he6 style golden conductors on the diaphragm, check the locked edition 6 thread, tho many posts were deleted, you can still find the open letter fang wrote if you google

They have their own store where they avoid retailer cuts etc too so that doesnt apply and taxes dont need to apply on reimport of an exported item.

People did say the ED6 are HE6 in a fancier case if you read the thread carefully. I wasnt quoting you.

Costs reductions dont mean they should translate to end user. Pretty sure most big companies achieve economies of scale and improve their costs for their products which dont have to result always in cost reductions for customers. It's one thing to give HFM a tough time for everything, its another to defy all economics and apply absolutes to them.

I was talking about costs on the HEK and upgrade program not the ED6. It was made to appear that HFM was somehow making an additional profit of $1350 whereas they make $350 less vs not offering the upgrade. All taxes and duties on their part stay similar same if they do or dont offer the upgrade.

Im not defending the ED6 pricing or HFM in other matters. Yes lets all forget math, economics, finance and logic to give a difficult time to HFM because its the new in thing. Thats all what we stand for on this forum.

 

[roskodan]

i wish there was a way to give manufacturers a hard time selling steel at the price of gold, but that would mean the industry's collapse, since there must be something 'better' even when there is not

 

[Toolman]

Didn't read the last few pages but FWIW ED6 is one great sounding headphone...quite possibly the best planar headphone around. In a heartbeat I would pre-order it today if they are priced under $5K, its that good. Just like I was amazed with the sound quality of RE-2000 but not the $2000 Fang thought its worth. I felt HFM could sell a lot more units if their products are priced a bit more competitively.

Don't get me wrong their new products does sound amazingly good...even the Shangri-La had me drooling but for their built quality & pricing

Guessed I'll just hold on to my HEK V2 for awhile and try to resist the temptation of ED6/SVR...

 

[Lurker0918]

I don't recall HFM saying their business model is to release top shelf products at affordable prices. People are complaining about HFM's prices and their being greedy.  Yet, they released IEM's for under $30 (Massdrop), dynamics for under $100 (Massdrop too, they sold a shade under 10,000 units at the conclusion of their last drop yesterday.  Not sure if that was cumulative or specific to that drop), planars for around $300 (less on Amazon) and electrostats to boot (not sure what that costs).  They offer products at many price points.  Put me in the camp that will not be shelling out money for the SL, SVR/ED6 or even a HEK, but there are people out there that will.  HFM has probably done their market research and they are confident those expensive products like SVR/ED6 will sell (just not to people on this board).

 

[Voxata]

Drop a 0 and I'll buy a pair.

 

[jelt2359]

Didn't read the last few pages but FWIW ED6 is one great sounding headphone...quite possibly the best planar headphone around. In a heartbeat I would pre-order it today if they are priced under $5K, its that good. Just like I was amazed with the sound quality of RE-2000 but not the $2000 Fang thought its worth. I felt HFM could sell a lot more units if their products are priced a bit more competitively.

Don't get me wrong their new products does sound amazingly good...even the Shangri-La had me drooling but for their built quality & pricing

Guessed I'll just hold on to my HEK V2 for awhile and try to resist the temptation of ED6/SVR...

At canjam when I directly compared the hekv2 and ed6 the difference was quite obvious. The ed6 is like a much better hekv2, rather than an improved he6 imho. The modded he6 is visceral, punchy, slightly warm, whereas the ed6 has the more precise sound of the HEKv2- but hits harder.

But no idea how the SVR sounds!

 

[ruhenheiM]

  i wish there was a way to give manufacturers a hard time selling steel at the price of gold, but that would mean the industry's collapse, since there must be something 'better' even when there is not

there is a way, just don't buy it.but some people would buy it because of the price tag and it's the new best thing