[Author]

Should have added a price point for open wireless headphones, like 500-600 dollar/euro. It’s the mass market which is being taken over by a few players, Apple being the most prominent. The 1000,- + market is certainly another matter.

One of the things I have come to believe is that Apple, unlike quite a few others, has truly acknowledged that 50% percent of the world population and market is female. And maybe within homes the decision power of women is even higher. What gets into a home, and what not. And Apple acts and designs accordingly.

Just my very personal experience, but I have yet to meet a woman who doesn’t like the Airpods Max AND it’s case. I now appreciate the case design as well, works very nice within in a home.

Would be interesting to know how the distribution of male/female looks like on this forum, and other forums.

I‘ve personally never had a problem with the looks of the case. Does it look a little weird? Sure. Do I remember the shock over the OG AP toothbrush and misogynistic analogies between the iPad name and hygiene products for women? Absolutely. These types of concerns originate, typically, from male insecurities. This holds true with the bra comparisons and the APM case. I daresay Apple *knew* this would happen and simply doesn’t care. It remains surprising to me that even in 2020, this type of reaction still so commonly occurs.

Effectiveness of the case is a legitimate concern, particularly in regard to the exposed mesh headband and potential for scuffs and scratches, but I’m not a rough and tumble type. Most buyers of this headphone probably won’t be either, and those that are more careless (or unlucky) can buy another one (or they probably couldn’t have afforded one in the first place). This is overblown, for now. In six months or so, we will know more about damage trends, at least anecdotally. I read somewhere that the headband might be replaceable.

As far as gender breakdown, I suspect this forum has an overwhelmingly male readership.

 

[tkddans]

I‘ve personally never had a problem with the looks of the case. Does it look a little weird? Sure. Do I remember the shock over the OG AP toothbrush and misogynistic analogies between the iPad name and certain hygiene products? Absolutely. These types of concerns originate, typically, from male insecurities. This holds true with the bra comparisons and the APM case. I daresay Apple *knew* this would happen and simply doesn’t care. It remains surprising to me that even in 2020, this type of reaction still so commonly occurs.

Effectiveness of the case is a legitimate concern, particularly in regard to the exposed mesh headband and potential for scuffs and scratches, but I’m not a rough and tumble type. Most buyers of this headphone probably won’t be either, and those that are more careless (or unlucky) can buy another one (or they probably couldn’t have afforded one in the first place). This is overblown, for now. In six months or so, we will know more about damage trends, at least anecdotally. I read somewhere that the headband might be replaceable.

As far as gender breakdown, I suspect this forum has an overwhelmingly male readership.

I agree with you and Honest Tech when he said it’s like people are “12 years old” making fun of it looking like a bra or purse to them. Like, is that how we want to critique the thing?

I like having headphones I can just throw in a bag now without a hard case honestly. I just finished traveling and had it in my backpack. Nothing happened to it...yet.

The sleeve is minimal and I don’t want to zip and unzip the headphones from a box anymore.

 

[dreth]

are these worth it in your opinion?

 

[Author]

I agree with you and Honest Tech when he said it’s like people are “12 years old” making fun of it looking like a bra or purse to them. Like, is that how we want to critique the thing?

I like having headphones I can just throw in a bag now without a hard case honestly. I just finished traveling and had it in my backpack. Nothing happened to it...yet.

The sleeve is minimal and I don’t want to zip and unzip the headphones from a box anymore.

That‘s good to know! I appreciate the sleeker, less bulky design as well.

 

[tinyman392]

Hi, I currently uses sony 1000xm3
And i have quite a big head and big ear
I wear the sony at its longest extension and the ear cups is just barely enough to cover my whole ear
It dit fit but my ears are touching the driver.
anyway im interested in the airpod max
But since there’s no apple store that have it on display in my country, i cant try it on.
Can anybody help ? Or give some inputs ? Thank you very much.

Crinicle had issues with fit as the forks didn't extend far enough for him, so that's something to keep in mind. I have a smaller head, so I tend to have the opposite problem sometimes. I can measure the internal dimensions of the pad for you though: D = 1.25", W = 1.50", H = 2.25". This is measured on an ear pad that is not compressed.

are these worth it in your opinion?

Not sure who you're asking. Depending on who you ask, these headphones audio is worth 100 bucks, others state that it's 250-350 dollars. I personally feel like the audio quality is alone is probably in the 200-300 dollar range for a pair of headphones dedicated to audio (mainly). That said, you do get above average build quality, great comfort, and a whole hoard of features (ANC, transparency, Adaptive EQ, Spacial Audio). If those and the features you'd use are worth the 250-350 dollars, then I'd say they're worth it. Personally I see these being better valued at 450 vs the 550 that Apple offers them at. They're priced a little higher than I feel they should be, but not enough for me to want to return them.

 

[bobeau]

No matter how you turn, fundamental flaw is speaker technology requires power to drive ( electrodynamic ). Unless new inventions in speaker materials, new speaker technology specific for wireless environment.... your "some day" will come truth.
As far as I see, the wireless speakers will never as good as wired speakers if wireless headphones ( light, comfortable, SQ, long battery) still use that 150 years concept.

Seems like there's two different things at play here -

1) all-in-one systems (ie. DAC/amp/speakers w/ dsp) - these are already taking hold in the speaker world w/ Dutch and Dutch 8c, Kii 3, Genelec Ones. So the high-end is pretty well established there, and this is only over the past few years, over the next few years we can expect an order of magnitude more entrants.

2) Wireless + streaming - some of the above have some facility for it, and when not there are a whole class of products out there that work well here. Note that for wireless speakers we're generally talking wifi, not bluetooth, so it's really a type of transmission and codec thing more than the nature of having no wires.

So the argument that it can't come here or might not come here in the speaker world is moot - it's already here.

While speaker systems have much more volume to work with to house onboard electronics, amps and stuff, audibly transparent DACs that are impossibly small have been here with us for awhile, and headphones only need maybe 100 milliamps per driver opposed to say a speaker trying to fill a largish room at 500-1000 watts per housing.

 

[MichaelYYZ]

I‘ve got the white APMs and, in my opinion, the case is super nice and I like it a lot. For the record, I am male. Finally, I can go out wearing a fancy handbag.

The case is different than what we’re used to, it makes a statement and I find it very cute. It also offers sufficient protection for home use, whilst being convenient (i.e. easy to take out the headphones and put them back in, as well as preserving battery life). The APMs are not headphones intended for travelling, I reckon, for that Apple gave us the APs and the APPs. Also, since when does Apple have to include protection cases for the equipment we buy from them? The iPhone, iPad, Apple Watch, etc. do not come with protection cases and no one complains about it. Whoever wants added protection, can buy a case separately. I don’t - because I’m super careful with my devices and I like to look at them and see them as they were intended to appear.

Regarding the lack of a 3.5 mm jack. Who cares?! I would guess that the vast majority of the people who buy this wireless headphones would never need/want to use one. Besides, Apple gives us the option for buying a Lightning-to-3.5 mm cable. It‘s a tad expensive but that’s because it’s not only a cable, it’s also an ADC-DAC. As an aside, I’m venturing to speculate that it’s a good quality converter, similar to the Apple USB-C-to-3.5 mm DAC (Ref. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...pple-vs-google-usb-c-headphone-adapters.5541/). Also, I’d rather have the option to buy the cable-converter separately - which I did - rather than Apple increasing the price of the APMs by $50 for including the cable which most people wouldn’t need/want.

Too much whining about these issues from the YouTube reviewers! In my opinion, Apple nailed it.

Just my very personal experience, but I have yet to meet a woman who doesn’t like the Airpods Max AND it’s case. I now appreciate the case design as well, works very nice within in a home.

 

[tinyman392]

I‘ve got the white APMs and, in my opinion, the case is super nice and I like it a lot. For the record, I am male. Finally, I can go out wearing a fancy handbag.

The case is different than what we’re used to, it makes a statement and I find it very cute. It also offers sufficient protection for home use, whilst being convenient (i.e. easy to take out the headphones and put them back in, as well as preserving battery life). The APMs are not headphones intended for travelling, I reckon, for that Apple gave us the APs and the APPs. Also, since when does Apple have to include protection cases for the equipment we buy from them? The iPhone, iPad, Apple Watch, etc. do not come with protection cases and no one complains about it. Whoever wants added protection, ca buy a case separately. I don’t - because I’m super careful with my devices and I like to look at them and see them as they were intended to appear.

Regarding the lack of an 3.5 mm jack. Who cares?! I would guess that the vast majority of the people who buy this wireless headphones would never need/want to use one. Besides, Apple gives us the option for buying a Lightning-to-3.5 mm cable. It‘s a tad expensive but that’s because it’s not only a cable, it’s also an ADC-DAC. As an aside, I’m venturing to speculate that it’s a good quality converter, similar to the Apple USB-C-to-3.5 mm DAC (Ref. https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...pple-vs-google-usb-c-headphone-adapters.5541/). Also, I’d rather have the option to buy the cable-converter separately - which I did - rather than Apple increasing the price of the APMs by $50 for including the cable which most people wouldn’t need/want.

Too much whining about these issues from the YouTube reviewers. In my opinion, Apple nailed it.

I feel like the APM is fine for traveling, but Apple expects you to toss them in a backpack with your other electronics (laptops, iPads, etc.) rather than something like a purse with loose keys and stuff. Or just wear them around your neck like a lot of people end up doing. I've taken them out of the house and they're more than comfortable enough for that use and the overall dimensions of the headphones is more than ample for this.

The case is extremely minimalistic and I don't mind it. Part of the aluminum shell is left exposed, but I'm more worried about the headband. In reality, I wouldn't mind getting a headband protector/cover for it when it's being transported. I personally don't mind the design of the case, it keeps the headphones very small in size and probably easier to travel with to be honest since the overall volume they take up is very small.

 

[Heyyoudvd]

I hate to say it but tweets like this make me really question whether I can rely on DMS’s opinions going forward.

First of all, the way he despises the M50X seems completely unwarranted to me. I understand the audiophile world has been pretty critical of it, particularly after it was overhyped by people like MKBHD, but it’s not a bad headphone. It’s not spectacular, but it’s not horrible, either. The amount of derision it receives is unwarranted, in my opinion.

But then on top of that, he compares the APM to the M50X in a negative way, as if he doesn’t view the APM as being any better. And given how much he hates the M50X, that showcases his views of the APM.

I understand everyone has their own opinions and it’s okay to disagree, but I think his view of the APM is so off base here, that it makes me question whether I can rely on his other headphone opinions and reviews, as his opinions deviate so vastly from my own.

 

[dreth]

Not sure who you're asking. Depending on who you ask, these headphones audio is worth 100 bucks, others state that it's 250-350 dollars. I personally feel like the audio quality is alone is probably in the 200-300 dollar range for a pair of headphones dedicated to audio (mainly). That said, you do get above average build quality, great comfort, and a whole hoard of features (ANC, transparency, Adaptive EQ, Spacial Audio). If those and the features you'd use are worth the 250-350 dollars, then I'd say they're worth it. Personally I see these being better valued at 450 vs the 550 that Apple offers them at. They're priced a little higher than I feel they should be, but not enough for me to want to return them.

Is the sound significantly better than airpods pro, in your opinion?

I feel like obviously if these were already on the secondary market at non-scalper prices, and they happened to depreciate the same way other headphones do, maybe i'd eventually consider it. But at full price, they're probably not going to be worth it for me.

 

[AlwaysForward]

It’s applying multiband compression, so yes, it’s profoundly altering the sound by reducing the dynamic range of certain frequencies, not just boosting them, as EQ would.
If you’re only enjoying your APM with Headphone Accomodations turned on, you should rethink keeping them, cos thats absolutely not the solution to ‘fixing’ the frequency response.

Is this loosely based conjecture or do you actually have inside information on the signal processing?

 

[MichaelYYZ]

A bit off topic but, since many here compared the APMs with the HD800S and HD650, Amir from ASR has measured the latter two:

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/sennheiser-hd800s-review-headphone.18424/
https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/sennheiser-hd650-review-headphone.18774/

Hopefully, it won’t be long before he measures the APMs, too.

 

[MichaelYYZ]

This is what I’d like to know, too. Some relevant information from Apple would be very useful.

Is this loosely based conjecture or do you actually have inside information on the signal processing?

 

[ricksastro]

Hi, I currently uses sony 1000xm3
And i have quite a big head and big ear
I wear the sony at its longest extension and the ear cups is just barely enough to cover my whole ear
It dit fit but my ears are touching the driver.
anyway im interested in the airpod max
But since there’s no apple store that have it on display in my country, i cant try it on.
Can anybody help ? Or give some inputs ? Thank you very much.

I have a huge head as well. I use most headphones at their longest extent. The APMs I find are just a touch shorter than I'd prefer at their full extent, but not enough to be a dealbreaker. My lobes are just sticking out the outside bottom of the cups and the tops of my ears are even with the inside top of the cup

 

[tkddans]

I hate to say it but tweets like this make me really question whether I can rely on DMS’s opinions going forward.

[...]

But then on top of that, he compares the APM to the M50X in a negative way, as if he doesn’t view the APM as being any better. And given how much he hates the M50X, that showcases his views of the APM.

I understand everyone has their own opinions and it’s okay to disagree, but I think his view of the APM is so off base here, that it makes me question whether I can rely on his other headphone opinions and reviews, as his opinions deviate so vastly from my own.

Yea. He had a different experience or impression of the APM than others who liked it. I tried his K361 alternate recommendation and didn’t think it was fair to say the APM are just worse, as much as he described. That being said, we all do have different experiences, knowledge, preferences and so on from one another. Maybe reviewers need to modify their verdict a bit to include wider perspectives of preferences. I guess if anything, it makes me question how related our tastes are more than anything. Or maybe he really needs to try what I did, and I try what he did to compare.

Is the sound significantly better than airpods pro, in your opinion?

As you can probably tell so far, this is somewhat of a contentious topic at this time in the audio community.

In my own comparison of the APM with other closed back wireless headphones, I personally preferred the APM greatly, for my ears and taste.

I also prefer them greatly over the APP (AirPods Pro). More enjoyable to me, better soundstage/clarity, authenticity.

EDIT:: The APP have a very different tuning compared to the APM. The APM have a large sub bass response. You’ll hear it and it’ll change the experience. A large part of it would be the simple fact too that it’s over your ears rather than in high ears. The sound envelopes you more.