[Piotr Ryka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by greggf /img/forum/go_quote.gif Piotr, Greetings! "Strange" and "apathetic" is pretty much how the HD800 sounded to me, although I didn't have the kind of amps you have. Can you elaborate more specifically on what you mean by apathetic and strange? How does the 800 sound to you on your amps? BTW have you ever had or heard the R10? If so, any comments?

As I wrote in private message to another forum member:

“They are strange. First of all they are very slow and without natural sounding sharpness on highs. They are also completely airless and without reverberation. Sound sources are without ambient. Atmosphere of spectacle is lifeless and somewhat artificial. If it has to stay so, that is catastrophe."

But maybe (I hope, so) it is only some heating problem, because symptoms are pretty typical. However my interlocutor told me, I should not have illusions.

I am very sorry, but I’ve never heard R-10, Qualia and Orpheus.

 

[blubliss]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piotr Ryka /img/forum/go_quote.gif I am very sorry, but I’ve never heard R-10, Qualia and Orpheus.

So your comments belong in the other HD800 thread since this one is to compare it to the R10s.

 

[Piotr Ryka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by blubliss /img/forum/go_quote.gif So your comments belong in the other HD800 thread since this one is to compare it to the R10s.

So according to you anybody who didn’t heard them both has no right to appear in this discussion?
If I remember on first page, during AKG K1000 quality deliberation you were not so wise and principal.
I am interested in if R-10 are also playing in such unfeeling way. Can’t I?

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by vcoheda /img/forum/go_quote.gif i am convinced that the HD800 is an elite, top-tier headphone. the HD800 balanced + B52 is one of the best combos i have ever heard.

x2. But the HD800 balanced with the Audio-gd Phoenix or Balanced B22 (with my source at least) do it better.
And so far these are the only SS amps that I feel are worthy partners for the HD800. But there are a plethera of tube amps that sound wonderful with the HD800 and until I heard them with the Phoenix and B22, I was in the market for a tube amp. Of course this is all in balanced configuration. If you are running your HD800 single ended, I did not care for the SE B22 and likewise I feel there are better SE amps than using the Phoenix with SE output.

I liked the B-52 and Apache balanced with the HD800, but they are not among my favorites as they lack in ultimate detail and have a tad too much warmth.

 

[blubliss]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piotr Ryka /img/forum/go_quote.gif So according to you anybody who didn’t heard them both has no right to appear in this discussion?

No, just adding a thought. If you feel the need to post your impressions here go right ahead. Far be it from me to stop a person from doing anything they feel like doing. Just thought they would be more appropriate elsewhere.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piotr Ryka /img/forum/go_quote.gif If I remember on first page, during AKG K1000 quality deliberation you were not so wise and principal.

You do not remember correctly. I have no idea what you are talking about.

 

[Piotr Ryka]

blubliss


I think, you know very well what I am talking about, but I can tell you. When discussion was about K1000 quality, you didn’t protest, despite the K1000 is not this thread subject. But when I wrote something about the HD 800, you cast me telling beside the point, although HD 800 is mention in thread title. So I told you what I told. I don’t want to be unpleasant, but I also don’t want to hear such instructions.
I also tell you why I wrote about HD 800 in this thread. I am not interested in how HD 800 is playing, because I know it. I only want to know if Sony MDR R-10 kind of presentation is similar.
And I tell you what is the most important thing in all this question. I listen now alternating HD 800, E9 and K1000. And when I use E9 and K1000 I hear all space lively by music. I can name it “alive space”. But when I listen to HD 800, I listen only particular sound sources, and almost nothing between them. The air is almost motionless. There is no musical wind. Also reverberations and echoes are in comparison in very small quantity.
Sennheiser HD 800 sound is like stuffed animal: lifelike almost, but dead. To be yet warm maybe even, but his eyes are blind.
So I ask you – who happily have listened both, HD 800 and R-10 – are they similar? What is the R-10 space, dead or alive? Can someone tell me that?

 

[greggf]

That's a very good question. I'd like it answered, too, even though the R10 is expensive unobtainium.

When my wife heard the HD800, she said, "detail." When she went back to the O2, she said, "Wet. Humid," meaning reverb, decay, hall space, etc.

I'm coming to the conclusion that the "deadness" or overcontrol of the HD800's ring driver - much like the overcontrol on the Polk ring tweeter - is the source of both the detail and the deadness or surreal-quality of the 800.

What I'd like to know is, why are so many pleased with this odd sound? Is it because of the 800's newness? It's high price (therefore, must be good)?

Does the R10 avoid this problem, as our friend from Poland asks?

(A side question might be, "Is the O2 too 'humid'/'wet'?")

 

[4N6]

I really think this must have something to do with the amplification of the HD800's. Via the TTVJ 307A, I get a LOT of air around the instruments. In fact, that was one of the first things I noticed about them. Compared to the R10, the sound of the HD800 is a little more forward and "bigger," which could be construed as lacking space.

 

[Piotr Ryka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by greggf /img/forum/go_quote.gif That's a very good question. I'd like it answered, too, even though the R10 is expensive unobtainium. When my wife heard the HD800, she said, "detail." When she went back to the O2, she said, "Wet. Humid," meaning reverb, decay, hall space, etc. I'm coming to the conclusion that the "deadness" or overcontrol of the HD800's ring driver - much like the overcontrol on the Polk ring tweeter - is the source of both the detail and the deadness or surreal-quality of the 800. What I'd like to know is, why are so many pleased with this odd sound? Is it because of the 800's newness? It's high price (therefore, must be good)? Does the R10 avoid this problem, as our friend from Poland asks? (A side question might be, "Is the O2 too 'humid'/'wet'?")

Omega II is a very good exampe of alive kind of playing. And it is absolutlely not too wet. Maybe sometimes too optimistic (except Mk2 version, which is in turn slightly too dark), but always in life direction.

 

[tohenk2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by greggf /img/forum/go_quote.gif What I'd like to know is, why are so many pleased with this odd sound? Is it because of the 800's newness? It's high price (therefore, must be good)?

High price = good. Hmm. Newness=pleasing? Those are both NoNo's for me. (Undoubtedly there are enough people on this earth who think so ... before and/or after the buy). Suggestive questions btw.

Maybe you should be asking yourself an enterly different question: If so many people here like the sound of this headphone - then why do I not like it?

Mind you - I'm not saying the majority is always right. Far from it. If that was the case MP3's would be the way to go. It is just that introspect can give you intereting insight sometimes. In the case of MP3's one of the answers could be that for a casual background noise (elevator music) it is good enough, and most of us don't like it because we are listening in another -more focused- way. I actually know people who complain if music is to involving - I can't read! (But they do need some pleasant noise to block out other noises).

So - could it be your ears & mind are trained in a different way than most others? Are you focused on something most are not?

 

[Piotr Ryka]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4N6 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I really think this must have something to do with the amplification of the HD800's. Via the TTVJ 307A, I get a LOT of air around the instruments. In fact, that was one of the first things I noticed about them. Compared to the R10, the sound of the HD800 is a little more forward and "bigger," which could be construed as lacking space.

Maybe I put my pointed HD 800 opinion.

Strengths:
- Big, transparent, eye-level of soundstage.
- Nice tonality.
- Very detailed.
- Very good sound sources localization.
- Reach coloring.
- Completely not fatiguing kind of presentation.
- Sound is powerful.
- At high-level volume bass is very good.
- They are the third headphone (beside Stax Omega II and AKG K1000) which passed positively Dummy-Head test.

Weaknesses:
- Too slow signal response.
- No sound attack. (Trumpets for example.)
- Slightly too dry sound.
- Unnaturally big sound sources.
- Not airy. (OK, there is some air movement around the instruments, but only on a very limited distance.)
- Slightly emasculate high tones.
- On average involving.
- Small quantity of echoes and reverberations.
- Black but stagnated sound background.

But if you have a lot of air around instruments, so lot, you have alive space impression, OK, you win.

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4N6 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I really think this must have something to do with the amplification of the HD800's. Via the TTVJ 307A, I get a LOT of air around the instruments. In fact, that was one of the first things I noticed about them. Compared to the R10, the sound of the HD800 is a little more forward and "bigger," which could be construed as lacking space.

I agree with you completely on amplification. It will make or break these headphones. Unfortunately, I feel the 307A is not a good performer with the HD800. (at least in SE configuration which is how I heard it)

It didn't seem to have great control over the drivers.

 

[immtbiker]

Quote:

Originally Posted by greggf /img/forum/go_quote.gif (A side question might be, "Is the O2 too 'humid'/'wet'?")

IMO, the O2's are the antithesis of wet. They are neutral, real in its presentation, but a bit too sterile. More on the lines of dry, I'd say.

No humidity what-so-ever.

 

[riceboy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by IPodPJ /img/forum/go_quote.gif I agree with you completely on amplification. It will make or break these headphones. Unfortunately, I feel the 307A is not a good performer with the HD800. (at least in SE configuration which is how I heard it) It didn't seem to have great control over the drivers.

Just wondering what your impressions are of the HD800 and Luxman P-1 if you have heard it? Also, I may have missed your response if you answered this and if you have I apologize, but I was wondering what amp(s) you feel pair well with the HD800s? Thanks in advance.

 

[IPodPJ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by riceboy /img/forum/go_quote.gif Just wondering what your impressions are of the HD800 and Luxman P-1 if you have heard it? Also, I may have missed your response if you answered this and if you have I apologize, but I was wondering what amp(s) you feel pair well with the HD800s? Thanks in advance.

I did not hear the HD800 with the P-1 unfortunately. I heard it with the P-200 and I thought it sounded horrible.

As far as what pairs well (that I heard with my own ears):

Solid State SE:
ALO Amphora (pairs decently, but on the bright side. I wouldn't pair it with a detailed source and I would only pair it with a source with a tube output, or an iPod.)
Blue Circle SBH (pairs decently.)

Solid State balanced
Audio-gd Phoenix
Balanced B22
RSA Apache (but on the warm side)
Rudistor RPX-300 (pairs decently.)

Tube SE
Zana Deux
Donald North Audio Sonett (SE version)
Woo Audio WA22
Woo Audio WA6 SE

Tube balanced
Donald North Audio Sonett (Balanced output version)
RSA B-52 (but on the warm side)