[Ike1985]

Been messing with "Boom 2" on Mac and whoa, this sounds by far the best. Without an impedance adaptor. It is the best rendition of the u12 I've heard so far. 

Yep, that missing high end. I thought you had yours torn down for an A18.

 

[pfurey89]

Yep, that missing high end. I thought you had yours torn down for an A18.

I was going a18, but bailed. It's not worth double the price to me when EQs and DAPs like the dx200 exist. They're within 2% of each other performance wise if you set up the 12s right.

 

[pfurey89]

I will say the u18 I heard was extremely special. The highs linger on forever in a great way, likely due to Tia.

 

[Ike1985]

So I was trying to change cabels on my A12s when the red side cable simply would not come out. I had tried to change cables before and recalled how sore my fingers were from last time feom the red side, they're very sore this time. As I said the other side easily came out by comparison. Upon closer inspection you can actually see that where the recessed socket was installed it was done so crooked. Imagine your making the pocket for it and you wiggle it up or down, rhis is likely what happened and you can see it in the photos. Because the cable was already broken near the point of entry, removing it was made impossible because I couldnr grip it. The cable broke and I was left with what you see below. I believe I can get it out with the right tool but this goes back to the quality control issues I mentioned in my A12 review. If you look closely you can actually see how the socket wasn't made straight by following the path of the pin.







Finally got it out with the right tools and the bend is cleaely visible.



Didn't damage anything just a very small scuff that 64 can buff out when I send them in for a checkup in a month or two.

There is clearly something wrong as I had to use 10x as much force to get the new cable in on the red side. Im kind of afraid to use any nice cables for fear of them getting stuck and broke too. Which means whoever built it experienced the same and probably worse tightness since it was brand new and sent it out anyway.

 

[christopherogut]

So I was trying to change cabels on my A12s when the red side cable simply would not come out. I had tried to change cables before and recalled how sore my fingers were from last time feom the red side, they're very sore this time. As I said the other side easily came out by comparison. Upon closer inspection you can actually see that where the recessed socket was installed it was done so crooked. Imagine your making the pocket for it and you wiggle it up or down, rhis is likely what happened and you can see it in the photos. Because the cable was already broken near the point of entry, removing it was made impossible because I couldnr grip it. The cable broke and I was left with what you see below. I believe I can get it out with the right tool but this goes back to the quality control issues I mentioned in my A12 review. If you look closely you can actually see how the socket wasn't made straight by following the path of the pin.

 
Ike,
 
Yikes, that's not good.  Our stock cables are meant to be gripped by the raised oval details for removal but from experience I know how it's possible to break a cable off in the socket now and then especially when it's already going bad... the worst thing ever is having a pin break off flush in a socket.
 
When we do recessed sockets, we model a small notch in the shell and then float the socket in place and bond it in during assembly.  It's possible that they end up a bit crooked in relation to the flat edge they're installed on, but sometimes this is even intentional if there's a tight fit or a driver in the way.  If the socket is slightly skewed in relation to that flat edge it shouldn't have any effect on the cable.  The sockets that we use have a very snug fit the first few times two-pin connectors are installed and it can be traumatic for customers that aren't comfortable with swapping cables.  We are looking to transition to a new two-pin socket design that offers easier insertion and more consistent fit.  I have some samples of the standard connector, they're awesome, and will look into the possibility of getting recessed sockets in this newer style.
 
Also, for anyone that has had problems with our stock cables breaking around the connector, we have basically eliminated that problem by updating the cable ends to glass-filled resin.  So far, we haven't had a single returned cable.  We currently only have them in black, 48" and 64", and are waiting for samples in silver/grey.
 
 - Chris

 

[che15]

Try the Apex M20 with an impedance adaptor to lift the impedance.  They are a different IEM.

Is the m20 better than the b1 ? If yes how and which impedance adapter do u use?
I have 3 different ones?
Thanks in advance for any help

 

[AtlanticProSnd]

Is the m20 better than the b1 ? If yes how and which impedance adapter do u use?
I have 3 different ones?
Thanks in advance for any help

My experience with impedance adapters was not a good one.  Everything sounds dead and compressed.  Only when I installed the M15 and used a balanced amp and cable (no impedance adapter) is when the A12's turned from a good to a great sounding CIEM.

 

[pfurey89]

My experience with impedance adapters was not a good one.  Everything sounds dead and compressed.  Only when I installed the M15 and used a balanced amp and cable (no impedance adapter) is when the A12's turned from a good to a great sounding CIEM.

A small EQ is 100000% better than impedance adaptor for me personally.

 

[Brooko]

Is the m20 better than the b1 ? If yes how and which impedance adapter do u use?
I have 3 different ones?
Thanks in advance for any help

 
Tough question - and comes down to preference.
 
Things I like about the M20:

• The vent's positioning and being able to cut out wind noise
• Very consistent and actually sounds (to me) slightly better with the U10 than the B1 (purely frequency related)
• Does sound quite open

 
Things I like about the B1:

• Slightly more open sounding (subjective) compared to the M20
• Sounds better to me with my U6 (again subjective) compared to M20 (purely frequency related)
• I get less listening fatigue (I am a permanent tinnitus sufferer) with the Adel modules compared to the Apex. All I can relate is my own experience, and for me personally I can listen longer to Adel - without getting that magnified occlusion effect after a few hours.  My tinnitus also does not flare as much after prolonged listening.  My normal listening levels are around 65-75dB, so with both module types, I am well within safe hearing limits.

 
Most of the time I forego an impedance adaptor, and simply use EQ (same as pfurey89 stated above).  My reasons for doing this are that I am quite comfortable using EQ, and I can get closer to the sound I prefer.  However - I see no issues with using an adaptor if EQ is not your thing.  I've tried a 75 ohm - and the only downside si that you're going to have to increase the volume quite a bit to get the same listening level (+18-19 dB approx), and many DAPs may have trouble with this.
 
As far as comments go on "compression" - once properly volume matched, I hear no degradation - just better frequency response, and that would be my sole reason for using it.  At some stage I'd like to try a 10 ohm and 20 ohm adaptor and see how they affect the response.  But in answer to your question, I would suggest using the one with the least impedance adjustment and see how you like it.
 
I know there have been some subjective claims about impedance causing compression - and I am currently looking into this.  I have access to an extremely well regarded composer, artist, and now professional sound-engineer, who not only has worked with some of the world's best - but also knows the science of audio inside and out.  I've asked him how impedance could affect "compression", and should have an answer back soon.
 
If you are comfortable with EQ though - I'd suggest that as a better and cheaper alternative 

 

[DWbirdseye]

Since we're on the subject of impedance adapters, many of you will find this article of interest. It was written by head-fi member shotgunshane:
 
https://cymbacavum.com/2017/03/06/ifi-iematch/
 
Also, if you poke around there are some other really good articles.

 

[glassmonkey]

 

  Yea. No matter what impedance adapter I tried(UEBJ,20,75,95,100,175,350 ohm), the A12 never pairs well with the mojo. I recommend a Sabre DAC based device. DX200, DP-X1 are they ways to go.

 
I am looking for a DAC that works well with my iphone 6 and A12. it should be very portable and not as warm as the mojo. any suggestions? I looked at the dragonfly (red oder 1.2) but the thread here doesn't look very promising.
 
maybe I should spend more time with EQing. I am not very familiar to this but my first tries elevating voices and highs sounded better to me.But I still don't know what I am doing there

Opus Audio Opus #11 is a good one. Everything Audio-Opus makes sounds great. It is also affordable at around €200. It runs with the Sabre ESS9018K2M, which is a great sounding chip, has 2.5mm balanced out, and 8.5 hours of playback on battery with a very slim pocketable form factor.

 

[Levanter]

   
Ike,
 
Yikes, that's not good.  Our stock cables are meant to be gripped by the raised oval details for removal but from experience I know how it's possible to break a cable off in the socket now and then especially when it's already going bad... the worst thing ever is having a pin break off flush in a socket.
 
When we do recessed sockets, we model a small notch in the shell and then float the socket in place and bond it in during assembly.  It's possible that they end up a bit crooked in relation to the flat edge they're installed on, but sometimes this is even intentional if there's a tight fit or a driver in the way.  If the socket is slightly skewed in relation to that flat edge it shouldn't have any effect on the cable.  The sockets that we use have a very snug fit the first few times two-pin connectors are installed and it can be traumatic for customers that aren't comfortable with swapping cables.  We are looking to transition to a new two-pin socket design that offers easier insertion and more consistent fit.  I have some samples of the standard connector, they're awesome, and will look into the possibility of getting recessed sockets in this newer style.
 
Also, for anyone that has had problems with our stock cables breaking around the connector, we have basically eliminated that problem by updating the cable ends to glass-filled resin.  So far, we haven't had a single returned cable.  We currently only have them in black, 48" and 64", and are waiting for samples in silver/grey.
 
 - Chris

 
I had problems with my stock/mic cable connectors as well where the plastic bit at the 2-pins is breaking apart.
Just emailed support@64audio.com with the picture. Hope this isn't common? =/

 

[pfurey89]

Got the B1 module and I like it a lot. It actually fills the bass-gap I find with impedance adaptors. Without the adaptor it's a little too much bass wise for me, but with it sounds very balanced overall. 

 

[pfurey89]

Okay, so I have two good synergetic options for the u12s currently, both different depending on my mood.
 
DX200 + EQ + ALO Ref8 cable + MAMs
 
Air filled, layered highs. Forward mids. The bass hits, but doesn't slam with too much authority here. The EQ helps lots here in opening things up. Ideal for vocals, acoustic, orchestra, less 'dynamic' music. A very laid back and detailed sound. Zero fatigue.
 
 
DX200 + 20ohm impedance + Ref8 + G1
 
The added bass emphasis of the G1 mixed with the bass taming ability of the impedance adaptor still has very great bass 'slam' and authority without the mid-bass bloat you get without cutting that Hz range down with either EQ, or in this case, the impedance adaptor. I think I prefer the 20ohm here in favor of straight EQ. Very musical and dynamic, highs are really good, bass slams hard - but the mids aren't nearly as good as with the above MAM combo. This is my current go to set up for pop, rap, or electronic music. 
 
I have a pure silver balanced cable on the way. Will report back on how that affects the mix.

 

[ericr]

  Since we're on the subject of impedance adapters, many of you will find this article of interest. It was written by head-fi member shotgunshane:
 
https://cymbacavum.com/2017/03/06/ifi-iematch/
 
Also, if you poke around there are some other really good articles.

 
Thanks for the link @DWbirdseye!
 
This this may at least be partly what is behind some people loving impedance adapters with the A12/U12 and others (like me) finding they noticeably degrade the sound quality of the A12/U12.
 
 
From the article by @shotgunshane

 Or it may simply allow greater volume usage in a set up that is using digital volume control from the DAC, which will certainly improve dynamic range.

 
IIUC, on a phone/DAP/amp that uses digital volume control the sound level is reduced by reducing the bit depth of the digital stream.  With high sensitivity IEMs the volume level can be quite high even at low to moderate volume control settings such that most listening is done via the reduced bit depth.  Adding a impedance adapter reduces gain - so you must turn the volume control higher to reach the same volume level - which means you are much more likely to be listening to your music at its full bit depth (16 or 24).
 
While I'm pretty sure the headphone out of cell phones use digital volume control, what about the currently popular portable gear (DAPs & amps)?  Is the assumption that higher end units have analog volume controls correct?