[puzl]

i do love this card, but i just built a major new pc, with top of the range components in every sector (i7, hd5870, asus p6t, 6gb 2000mhz ram etc....) and unfortunately, i cannot use my stx with my woo audio wa2 without getting major computer noise leaking into it.

literally every time i move my mouse or the cpu process becomes intensive, i hear everything

i'm using hd800s and strangely enough, when i plug them directly into the headphone out jack, it is perfect. so i guess it's the wa2 which is very sensitive to noise. strange how it never happened before on my last computer...

anyway i've ordered a nuforce udac and run the headphones from a usb external dac for a while (whilst also connected to my wa2 of course). hopefully that will fix the problem, but its a shame to only use my xonar for speakers now

 

[New2TheScene]

Germanium,

Thanks for the response. I agree that many recordings are far from neutral, and that alll recordings are the start of the audio reproduction chains, and therefore are a factor in the final result.

The reason I asked my question is that there any been posts from people who say that the ST is fatiguing when compared to the STX. People seem to be attributing it to the more precise clock. Is there anyone who has the ST and can comment on how exactly the sound is fatiguing. And if there is anyone who can compare it to the Claro Halo, that would be great.

 

[krisno]

The clock / de-jitter is supposed to remove harshness - its all just hype and lies my friend... and I think people here are right - it is the music which inhibits the flaw, not the soundcard.

GERMANIUM: What do you mean by 'glare' and elite pro? What is glare?


There is not much to mod on the ST / STX except for swapping opamps, you will not hear any difference whatsoever other than placebo really.

I would try the burson opamps, if not - maybe keep the stock. The stock ST/STX opamp combo is recommended from Texas Instruments.. the company which makes both the opamps, the DAC chip AND the headphone amplifier on the card.

enjoy! Probably your best buy in hifi ever....

 

[germanium]

Quote:

Originally Posted by krisno /img/forum/go_quote.gif The clock / de-jitter is supposed to remove harshness - its all just hype and lies my friend... and I think people here are right - it is the music which inhibits the flaw, not the soundcard. GERMANIUM: What do you mean by 'glare' and elite pro? What is glare? There is not much to mod on the ST / STX except for swapping opamps, you will not hear any difference whatsoever other than placebo really. I would try the burson opamps, if not - maybe keep the stock. The stock ST/STX opamp combo is recommended from Texas Instruments.. the company which makes both the opamps, the DAC chip AND the headphone amplifier on the card. enjoy! Probably your best buy in hifi ever....

Other than the direct coupling of the output everything about the output of my card is indeed stock. The Elite pro has glare especially when you D.C. couple the DAC to the buffer. This allows you to hear more of the music but also brings out the faults in the filter networks which are low grade on the Elite Pro.

Glare is a upper midrange lower treble phenominon that gives the music a bright & somewhat glassy texture. Improving the output filter would probably fix this glare but on the Elite pro it is all done with surface mount componants & are very tiny & the traces are very delicate so I decided not to mess with them. The Xonar cards that I tried are free of this glare even when D.C. coupled & sound even more detailed than the Elite Pro not to mention less conjested.

Capacitor coupling with electrolytics hided a host of sonic problems but also hides some of the music as well. Metalised film coupling caps are much better but won't fit in the space required by the soundcard. Good metalised film caps sound as good as D.C. coupling. Due to space conciderations D.C. coupling is the only other real option to get rid of the losses due to the electrolytic coupling caps.

 

[jalyst]

Quote:

Originally Posted by germanium /img/forum/go_quote.gif Other than the direct coupling of the output everything about the output of my card is indeed stock. .

Could you please elaborate upon this?
Can you briefly but clearly (no unnecessary jingo) outline how one does this?

Is it the only mod you're aware of that can have a significant impact?
(aside form opamps)

Thank-you.

 

[germanium]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jalyst /img/forum/go_quote.gif Could you please elaborate upon this? Can you briefly but clearly (no unnecessary jingo) outline how one does this? Is it the only mod you're aware of that can have a significant impact? (aside form opamps) Thank-you.

Caps ce8 & ce14 are the 2 electrolytic coupling caps for the line out. You can either desolder them & remove them & put wire in thier place or you can just solder A wire across the terminals on the back side of the card. Also if you connect the fronpanel connector up you can select the FP 2 speakers from the output selector & have D.C. coupled line out without doing anything to output caps as this output bypasses the caps & might be a good way to test to see if thats what you really want. Bear in mind though going this route may pic up some noise from the inside of the computer (FP 2speaker).

This is one of the most important changes that one can make & truely maintain the cards neutrality while getting a more detailed sound. Opamp changes listed here for the most part alters the sound signature fron neutral to brighter but some are darker. Some of the last ones posted in the STX thread seem promising as far as neutrality though.

Other mods wouldbe power supply & filter mods I'm pretty happy with the filters though & believe that messing with these without a intimate knowledge of how filters work & how they interact with the opamps is asking for more problems than it is worth.

That pretty much leaves power supply mods which in some cases can have a huge effect. Mainly more extended bass & possibly smoother highs are the improvements I would likely see here.

I do truely find the card neutral though the way it is.

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/xo...0/index87.html

 

[krisno]

Switch the opamps - that is only thing worth doing what regards computer audio. Everything else will be just neglible.

I have said it before - no matter what I bought for my laptop, no matter what dac, I never got the musicality that i got from a Sony £50 dvd player connected to x-can v3. Dunno what causes this - kernel streaming error, but even with Asio it did not sound half as good and alive. Even tried with NOS dac and jupiter beewax caps, didnt cut it...

So save your money.. hehe. if you want change the buffer opamps, thats it..

 

[ROBSCIX]

Quote:

Originally Posted by krisno /img/forum/go_quote.gif Switch the opamps - that is only thing worth doing what regards computer audio. Everything else will be just neglible.

I think most that have actually modded soundcards would disagree.
Opamp mods are usually done first as they are the easiest. Removing the coupling caps can have a very positive affect on the sound quality also.
There are many mods you can do to any source to improve the sound.
That is the point of modifications.

 

[krisno]

Well - maybe small differences, just small and neglible if you ask me. but that is my thoughts. The differences anyways are masked alot by using a tube amp...

k

 

[krisno]

But guys - I have the AKG K 701 myself. I tried the most expensive Ultrasones 2500 ed. They were nice, AKGs are a bit sterile.... actually some of the best and most alive I heard with the AKG K 701 was using a Lehmann OPA 2134 clone (2134 on the pre stage, and very powerfull discrete on the power stage). I hope the xonar will sound a bit like that experience - but what is the best match for the xonar ST? regarding headphones?

 

[germanium]

Those experiencing noise both hum-buzz & computer noise may want to check for gound loops as ground loops could be the problem. I had this to a very small degree & noticed a slight increase in hum & computer noise but only if my preamp was up near full output (3/4 volume or more).I spent a couple hours ridding my system of it & found it was a ground loop formed between my powered speakers, preamp, computer through the power cables of the computer & speaker & passing through the interconnects between those componants.

I lifted the ground of the speakers & that broke the ground loop & now I have complete total silence with no signal even with the volume turned all the way up on the preamp (more than 20db gain). This no matter what my computer is doing. All componants now grounded through the computer power cord. Music still plays excellant if not even better than before. Bear in mind I was running my checks at extremely high gain. Probably as high if not higher than most power amps have so the noise was pretty low to start with but I wanted I complete silence even at full gain.

 

[jalyst]

Quote:

Originally Posted by germanium /img/forum/go_quote.gif Caps ce8 & ce14 are the 2 electrolytic coupling caps for the line out. You can either desolder them & remove them & put wire in thier place or you can just solder A wire across the terminals on the back side of the card. Also if you connect the fronpanel connector up you can select the FP 2 speakers from the output selector & have D.C. coupled line out without doing anything to output caps as this output bypasses the caps & might be a good way to test to see if thats what you really want. Bear in mind though going this route may pic up some noise from the inside of the computer (FP 2speaker). This is one of the most important changes that one can make & truely maintain the cards neutrality while getting a more detailed sound. Opamp changes listed here for the most part alters the sound signature fron neutral to brighter but some are darker. Some of the last ones posted in the STX thread seem promising as far as neutrality though. Other mods wouldbe power supply & filter mods I'm pretty happy with the filters though & believe that messing with these without a intimate knowledge of how filters work & how they interact with the opamps is asking for more problems than it is worth. That pretty much leaves power supply mods which in some cases can have a huge effect. Mainly more extended bass & possibly smoother highs are the improvements I would likely see here. I do truely find the card neutral though the way it is. http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f46/xo...0/index87.html

Thank-you,

I've filled this for when I get round to focussing on such mods.
I will probably start with opamps 1st though...

All the best.

 

[ROBSCIX]

Removing the coupling caps is a bit advanced for some users. If you want to change the sound start with the opamps as you said and if your interested work your way up to the decoupling mod or others.

 

[krisno]

ROBscix have you tried the OPA2137P yet on the xonar? I have tried the 2134 a couple of times. They have good bass and dark and very nice and comfortable match with the bright AKG K 701s. BUT they severy shrinked the soundstage, vocals sounded tiny etc.... How are they opa2137s - do they fix the disadvantage the opa2134 had?

K

 

[ROBSCIX]

I was trying them on another circuit and they sounded decent. I didn't really have a chance to test them thoroughly though so I will save my opinion unitil I can get a good listen.
I also built a few dual 137 units..as I wrote in the opamp thread, many opamp families single channel units will provide better clarity and channel seperation then a similar dual channel unit. This is usually because the circuit are pretty much isolated for on another, there are some other factors also.