[skyline889]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanth Actually, this is a smart move. Some local wine makers are making some EXCELLENT wines and it turns out to be around $3/bottle. Economic and tastey to boo! A coworker of mine does this, I eventually want to get into the hobby too.

Heh, my dad was talking about a "two buck chuck" they had on the mainland. It's supposed to be decent for the price.

 

[Carl]

Quote:

Originally Posted by CookieFactory p.s. I prefer Hoegaarden to Corona.

Ever tried Hoegaarden Weissbier on tap?

 

[JaGWiRE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanth Actually, this is a smart move. Some local wine makers are making some EXCELLENT wines and it turns out to be around $3/bottle. Economic and tastey to boot! A coworker of mine does this, I eventually want to get into the hobby too.

Yup, my dad ordered a whole variety. I am guessing it is very cheap to manufacter most wine, and aging is a very big key factor that can't be rushed. My dad really enjoyed it, and your right, it was like $3 a bottle. Interesting stuff too, different flavorued stuff, one was raspberry for example I believe.

 

[milhouse6]

I've often wondered what prompted the recent push against cork because I've always enjoyed traditional & somewhat ceremonial corking. I always assumed the push to rubber/screw-caps was an environmental thing.

Turns out I was completely wrong! The alternatives to cork are strictly a quality control/cost thing. I was surprised to find the World Wildlife Fund pleading for a continuation of the cork-wine relationship.

From here
"The increase in the market share of alternative wine stoppers, specifically plastic stoppers and screwtops, could reduce the economic value of cork lands therefore leading to conversion to other uses, abandonment, degradation, and finally loss of one of the best and most valuable examples of a human–nature balanced system."

I never knew cork is simply made from the bark of a cork oak tree.

 

[Nick Dangerous]

Two Buck Chuck is palatable, but it seems better suited to cooking than drinking. Fred Franzia will ferment anything for a nickel. Gotta admire his Wal-Mart tactics, though.

Zanthman, do try these:

$11.50 - Bogle Old Vine Zinfandel 2003
$12.00 - Don Miguel Gascon Malbec 2003
$12.00 - Avalon Napa Valley Cabernet Sauvignon (white, not orange label) 2003
$13.00 - Francis Coppola Claret 2003
$13.00 - Chateau Du Bousquet Cotes De Bourg Bordeaux 2004

These are my default value reds. I reach for them when I don't feel like experimenting. I haven't found a reliable Merlot yet in that price range, but it's all about the search, is it not?

FYI, Markham Merlot would qualify if it was about $7 less than its $21 asking price. Good stuff, then! Merlot-hatin' Miles (of Sideways) obviously never tried it.

 

[kugino]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nick Dangerous Two Buck Chuck is palatable, but it seems better suited to cooking than drinking. Fred Franzia will ferment anything for a nickel. Gotta admire his Wal-Mart tactics, though. Zanthman, do try these: $11.50 - Bogle Old Vine Zinfandel 2003 $12.00 - Don Miguel Gascon Malbec 2003 $13.00 - Francis Coppola Claret 2003 $13.00 - Chateau Du Bousquet Cotes De Bourg Bordeaux 2004 These are my default value reds. I reach for them when I don't feel like experimenting. I haven't found a reliable Cab or Merlot yet in that price range, but it's all about the search, is it not? FYI, Markham Merlot would qualify if it was about $7 less than its $21 asking price. Good stuff, then! Merlot-hatin' Miles (of Sideways) obviously never tried it.

i can't vouch for the $12 and $13 bottles, but i do like the Bogle Zinfandel...they have some rather nice stuff. i recently tried their petit syrah port and it was quite nice for a $25 port...

 

[Uncle Erik]

Actually, Two Buck Chuck isn't half bad. There's a glut of it at Trader Joe's, a chain mostly in the western United States. I have it regularly as a table wine. And while it's not great, it's certainly good enough when you whip up some spaghetti and meatballs.

A better table wine is Louis Jadot Beaujolais Villages. I've seen it under $8 a bottle US, and it's really excellent for the price. When I want to splurge, it's on Willamette Valley (Oregon) pinots. A personal favorite are the varieties from White Rose Wines in Dayton, Oregon. Not widely known (yet) but everyone who tries it loves it. Prices are moderate, too. Also good are those from Willamette Valley Vineyards and Eola Hills. I wasn't into wine when I moved up there, but decided to try the local stuff to see if it was any good. And man, was it!

But back to the topic. Screw tops and plastic corks really, really used to bother me. I love tradition. However, spoilage is a real problem. I've seen some terrific wines ruined by cork. But I've never had a bad bottle with a plastic cork. Not with a screw top, either. Or in a box. Not all wine in a box is bad, for that matter.

I realized that what it really comes down to is whether the wine is any good. If screw tops or plastic corks do a better job, that's what is important.

 

[Nick Dangerous]

Agreed on the Louis Jadot Beaujolais. Terrific wine for $8. It's a perfect intro to the varietal (gamay, which I just learned thanks to Google).

Louis Jadot makes great wine. Every one I have tried has been a winner. I'd very much like to visit the winery. An HDTV documentary toured the grounds which were fearsomely impressive in their grandeur. Tres bien!

Oh... corkage discussion. Forgot to comment. I'm not afraid of screwcaps, but I do prefer the standard corks. Especially since my stepfather gave me one of those old-fashioned Rogar Estate wine openers. Pulling that elegant lever back makes a nice prelude to popping the cork out of a bottle. Synthetic corks leave me cold, however, even when using the fancy opener. They are just nasty and reek of environmental neglect. They also tend to be found in the necks of mediocre bottles of wine. Still, I'd prefer a rubber cork over drinking wine from a condom... just barely.

 

[KYTGuy]

For the Cork industry's take on this, see www.realcork.org

I read somewhere in the not too distant past that there was a shortage of cork, but after reading most of the above, it looks like it is more likely that with increasing population comes increased wine consumption, increased demand for cork, and that the amount of quality cork is being more difficult to find, driving price per bottle up. This looks to be a natural result of the rarity of growing places for the cork oak groves, causing a natural oligopoly to arise - making real cork progressively more rare/expensive.

Since most of us want more wine/more choices, and we are voting with our money to buy less costly but better wines, the manufacturers are responding with innovative packaging that will preserve the taste just long enough to get it to us, while making the overall process costs lower.

From my reading of the above site, it looks clear that I should now be able to assess what the manufacturer intended for the wines by the quality of the cork used, and to not keep aging a wine that was not meant to age, but rather to be enjoyed soon after purchase.

Goody! I will get to drink a few bottles sooner than planned! Hope none of them are already spoiled.

I have not found a comparitive article on the merits/problems of the various materials, but I would believe that some of the new plastic corks are as good or maybe better than Cork, and I don't think I would trust rubber to be taste neutral or as long lasting as plastic...I just wonder if the plastics used are TOTALLY non-soluble in wine over the long haul. Who knows, there may be wines that have been impossible to age over really long periods with the traditional Cork that will, in years to come become available, with Plastic stoppers!

 

[bangraman]

Re: the Real Cork campaign, I was amazed to see Mourinho's face plastered all over an advertising hoarding in London that wasn't him prostituting something by Samsung.


I wonder who'll ship a decent sparkling wine with a screw cap first? I know I don't always drink a whole bottle at once, sometimes even if I have someone over. I'm aware that it removes all sense of occasion even from 'fake champagne' but there most be far more people these days (at least in the UK) who drink these with meals with no more sense of occasion than opening a Diet Coke.


Winewise I'm actually extremely spoilt, and have to be careful because I think my liver's weakening these days. I spend a lot of time in a corner of a client's villa which he lets me use as an office. In the villa he keeps a very well stocked wine cellar as well as two chefs in attendance even when he's not there. Thing is, if I don't drink a few bottles and fill out the tasting notes if I happen to be there for a week or two he jibes with me about being a teetotaller

so I usually eat dinner with the chefs and steward and we share a bottle. The ritual of poking around the cellar deciding what I'm going to drink is quite fun.

 

[VicAjax]

here's the way it goes:

Cork = Tubes
it's old school and traditional. most of the best systems have them, although they have their budget applications as well. smooth and satisfying, though they can add distortion.

Screw Cap = Solid State
when they first came along, they were strictly for the poseurs. no quality, harsh, cheap. however, over the years, implementation has improved and you can find high quality despite the bad rep.

Rubber = Digital
makes purists cringe, but it's the future. properly implemented, it can be superior to either of the two other technologies, simultaneously offering the smoothness of the first and the durability and affordability of the second.

 

[JaGWiRE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by VicAjax here's the way it goes: Cork = Tubes it's old school and traditional. most of the best systems have them, although they have their budget applications as well. smooth and satisfying, though they can add distortion. Screw Cap = Solid State when they first came along, they were strictly for the poseurs. no quality, harsh, cheap. however, over the years, implementation has improved and you can find high quality despite the bad rep. Rubber = Digital makes purists cringe, but it's the future. properly implemented, it can be superior to either of the two other technologies, simultaneously offering the smoothness of the first and the durability and affordability of the second.

Did you just relate a non electronic non digital non moving item/material to head-fi stuff? Wow, I can't believe you went there, lol.

We need to make a thread where we just relate stuff to head-fi stuff, haha.

 

[luckybaer]

Quote:

Originally Posted by skyline889 Heh, my dad was talking about a "two buck chuck" they had on the mainland. It's supposed to be decent for the price.

We have "30 dime wine for $2.99" here. LOL.

 

[JaGWiRE]

Quote:

Originally Posted by luckybaer We have "30 dime wine for $2.99" here. LOL.

So we've discussed cheapo wines from wineries, but how does more expensive wine from wineries compare to similiar brand name wines of the same price. Speaking in terms of $8-2xx or so I guess.

 

[Jasper994]

As I understand it, non-traditional corks are being used mostly for increased control over quality. Apparently 1 in approximately 10 bottles that use traditional cork suffers from one or more forms of cork damage. These odds are barely better than the odds you get playing russian roulette.

Sadly, tradition is hard to break and it seems to me that the vast majority of people that are wine enthusiasts are pretty traditional when it comes to wine. To make matters worse, the average buyer is under the impression that synthetic cork is bad....

Screw caps seem to be gaining popularity among wines that are meant to be drunk while still fairly young.