[Kirosia]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rednamalas1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif was it?

Contrary to popular speculation, I am *not* Micheal Jackson.

 

[Rednamalas1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirosia /img/forum/go_quote.gif Contrary to popular speculation, I am *not* Micheal Jackson.

redshifter told me otherwise.
just checking

 

[Kirosia]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rednamalas1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif redshifter told me otherwise.

He survived?

 

[Rednamalas1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirosia /img/forum/go_quote.gif He survived?

from? what did you do to him?

 

[Uncle Erik]

Computerpro3, if your interest is safety, it's wiser to buy a vehicle that can avoid an accident in the first place. Accidents are not some act of god, but something you can often think and drive your way out of.

One primary consideration is the single car accident. I won't drive anything with a high center of gravity, regardless of gizmos. It's simple physics and I don't want to spend $4k replacing it when it eventually breaks.

Second, you need to maneuver to avoid dangerous drivers. In LA traffic, the RX-7 has gotten me out of... possibly a dozen life-threatening accidents over the past several years. Swerving, braking, that sort of thing, to keep from being creamed by an idiot. I've driven full-sized trucks and SUVs, and these were maneuvers that absolutely COULD NOT have been performed in them without losing control. Maybe the truck or SUV would have taken the impact well.

But I ask you this: are you better off getting crunched in a SUV and living through it, or would you be better off not having that accident in the first place? Accidents are NOT inevitable, though a vehicle with terrible emergency handling increases your odds of being in one.

As for towing stuff, why not store your gear where you go? I assume you have a boat or motorized offroad vehicles. The amount you spend on the trailer and gas to get there is probably more than it costs to store a boat at a lake or rent a storage unit. Same with RVs - you can buy a very nice car and stay at good hotels for what it costs to operate a RV. I like full-sized bathrooms and not running a generator. And if you have a fun car, you can actually enjoy winding roads and mountain passes.

 

[Kirosia]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rednamalas1 /img/forum/go_quote.gif from? what did you do to him?

Sometimes a man gets lonely.

 

[Rednamalas1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kirosia /img/forum/go_quote.gif Sometimes a man gets lonely.

ugh.

MEDIC!!

 

[cash68]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Computerpro3 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't tow on a daily basis, and we have five cars. I don't drive the SUV daily. But you know what? My uncle down in North Carolina DOES tow daily (he breeds horses and owns a vineyard), and my neighbor next door also tows daily (owner of a landscaping business). You suggesting hybrids to them?

Nope. I have no problem with you, since you don't drive it when it isn't needed, nor do I care about someone who tows things on a regular basis. You have to understand the vast majority of SUVs never tow anything or ever go offroad. People in suburbs buy them, and commute to work with them. I also hate hybrids, they're overly complex for the marginal MPG gain. If I wanted MPG I'd get a 1984 Honda CRX, that received 54mpg with a reliable, simple powerplant. "Adding lightness" is a problem I have with almost any newer car, they're far too heavy and large for my tastes.

Quote:

Brembo calipers suck?

They do if you're trying to stop 8,000lbs of vehicle. I also wasn't aware that most SUVs came with them... I'm pretty sure only a very small percentage of all SUVs come with them.

Quote:

You saying your car handles better than a Porsche Cayenne? What about a range rover sport? Audi Q7? VW Toureg? Those SUV's handle better than all but performance oriented cars.

Without a doubt. A stock 89 Civic will probably outhandle all of those pics. They might have some nice tires, but I doubt they can go through a slalom very well. I'm pretty sure both my SVX and my Prelude with 4ws would have no problem out handling any of them.

Quote:

But here's the thing - other people have rammed my family. At 70mph when we were stopped in traffic. If I get a little 4 banger honda, the other guy is going to have an SUV. I'd MUCH rather even the odds a bit. It's not my fault if you insist on driving a go-kart. My safety and my family's safety are my primary concern, not yours. And as your own data admits, when it's car vs suv, SUV wins.

By your logic we should all keep buying bigger and heavier cars. When does it stop?

Quote:

So in other words, you keep passing Honda Elements.

Think explorers, tahoes, durangoes, denalis, expeditions, LS450s, Wranglers, Commanders, H2s, h3s, Xterras, pathfinders, etc etc etc etc.

Quote:

I suggest you stop lumping all SUV's under one category, because a Porsche Cayenne will embarrass any porsche enthusiast that they made such a stupid ****ing vehicle

Fixed.

Quote:

My safety and my family's safety is more important to me than yours.

Then you should drive the SUV as little as possible. The deathrate is 3x higher, due to poor handling, braking, response, and acceleration. Read the article for more info on roof strength standards, crumple zones, and other problems.

 

[wareagle69]

+1000 for Computerpro3.

I guess I didn’t realize that exercising personal choice in what I drive would be something I had to defend to anybody. If you don’t see the need or have the desire for an SUV, then don’t buy one. Drive whatever you like, and give me the same option.

I drive a Suburban because I simply like the vehicle better than a car or a minivan. I do haul stuff regularly that will not fit in a car. It’s not about impressing anybody; it’s just what I choose to drive. If I wanted to impress folks, I would drive my SL500 everyday instead of using as a weekend toy.

If I choose to pay more for fuel and insurance, tires, etc. what’s it to you? Last time I looked, that was my choice. You folks that want to reengineer society are wearing pretty thin with me. Live your life the way you want, drive what you want and extend the same tolerance for the choices others make.

Calling someone an a****** because they do not agree with your point of view speaks volumes about your mindset. Get a life and leave me to live mine as I see fit.

 

[nfusion770]

+1000 for Computerpro3 and wareagle69

I love it when people transpose their needs to the needs of others, especially when they live in relatively cushy climates.

We live in MN and own 2 SUVs. We carry 6-7 passengers every day. I'm soon going to downgrade my Toyota Landcruiser to a 2009 Honda Pilot- hardly an ego thing (outside of the fact that I do not want a mini van). I go to home depot at least once a week and at least once a month I need something with more towing capacity than a mini van or a car. Regardless of what anyone would prefer to believe, both of my SUVs are far superior in poor weather, than any car or mini van I have ever owned. I am sure most SUV owners would agree, which explains why you see SUVs in the ditch when the weather is bad- those people couldn't even get their cars out of the driveway.

Regardless, no matter how much you hate SUV's and the "pompous" people who drive them, we live in a free society which means we are free from the "pompous" vicissitudes of people who feel they know what's better for you than you do.

 

[ricksome]

I've always driven small cars. I've avoided accidents because I had a small car. Another inch or two in length and I would not be so lucky. Did I mention the mpg that goes with a small car?

 

[frozenice]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wareagle69 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I guess I didn’t realize that exercising personal choice in what I drive would be something I had to defend to anybody. If you don’t see the need or have the desire for an SUV, then don’t buy one. Drive whatever you like, and give me the same option.

Along with freedom comes responsibility and there is a price to pay for using gasoline up at an enormous rate because it is something that fulfills needs that you have in your life. If the oil exporting countries can't or won't export enough fuel to keep the SUV owners such as yourself happy then what? Have you thought about those options or is it someone else's problem to solve. Politicians will only have choices like ration cards, war or imploding the economy (demand destruction) as a way out and none of them are very good choices for the average person.

 

[RYCeT]

Well, if you've read OP's recent posts, you will see he has tendency to insult people who don't agree with him. Sadly, The more he posts the less credibility he has.

 

[synaesthetic]

I always preferred the small sedans with excellent gas mileage and efficiency, but I haven't owned a car in almost a year now, and I do not miss it much at all.

My legs work just fine, they cost a lot less to fuel than a car does, and the exercise is good for me. Public transport is good enough for when I need to do something that isn't within walking distance.

And perhaps best of all, and definitely most relevant to this particular forum, walking or busing to everywhere I need to go ensures my portable rig gets plenty of use!

 

[Computerpro3]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Erik /img/forum/go_quote.gif Computerpro3, if your interest is safety, it's wiser to buy a vehicle that can avoid an accident in the first place. Accidents are not some act of god, but something you can often think and drive your way out of.

I am just curious how we could have thought our way out of this: we were sitting in traffic in Massachusetts at a dead stop. Five of us were in the suv, including a 6 year old in the third row seat. Everything was fine one minute. Two seconds later, the airbags went off, glass shattered everywhere, and our world literally compacted. We were hit by a Ford Expedition that was traveling approx. 75mph and were pushed into the car in front of us, smashing the front as well. We then spun sideways and were t-boned by another car that could not stop in time. The car was compacted by a good ten feet total. It turned into a six car accident and was on the news. We survived with whiplash and bruises. If we were in a car, there is no question we would have died. The Ford Expedition would have simply crumpled a smaller car like a tin can.

Again, how could we have avoided that? Wished it away, perhaps?

Quote:

One primary consideration is the single car accident. I won't drive anything with a high center of gravity, regardless of gizmos. It's simple physics and I don't want to spend $4k replacing it when it eventually breaks.

Single car accidents are usually the drivers fault - going too fast for conditions, for example. I would far rather have my destiny in my hands than some other idiot's. It is very hard to roll an SUV unless you are being stupid.

Second, the warranty on any luxury SUV would cover the air suspension.

Quote:

Second, you need to maneuver to avoid dangerous drivers. In LA traffic, the RX-7 has gotten me out of... possibly a dozen life-threatening accidents over the past several years. Swerving, braking, that sort of thing, to keep from being creamed by an idiot. I've driven full-sized trucks and SUVs, and these were maneuvers that absolutely COULD NOT have been performed in them without losing control. Maybe the truck or SUV would have taken the impact well.

Rather be in a fender bender and have the other guy's insurance take car of it than be squished like a sardine by a Ford Expedition going 75mph.

Quote:

But I ask you this: are you better off getting crunched in a SUV and living through it, or would you be better off not having that accident in the first place? Accidents are NOT inevitable, though a vehicle with terrible emergency handling increases your odds of being in one.

Are you better off in a fender bender, or are you better off dead?

Quote:

As for towing stuff, why not store your gear where you go? I assume you have a boat or motorized offroad vehicles. The amount you spend on the trailer and gas to get there is probably more than it costs to store a boat at a lake or rent a storage unit.

I tow snowmobiles, and it's awfully hard to find storage places 10,000 feet up in the mountains of VT! In southern VT this would be possible, but not in the mountains and not in ME. It is way too remote. Plus, if I stored them up there, I wouldn't be able to use them around the yard in CT (we have lots of land).


Quote:

Same with RVs - you can buy a very nice car and stay at good hotels for what it costs to operate a RV. I like full-sized bathrooms and not running a generator. And if you have a fun car, you can actually enjoy winding roads and mountain passes.

I don't have an RV, but the whole point of them is the traveling - having an adventure of sorts. And as for the fun car, if you try to enjoy the mountain passes in the VT winter, you will wind up dead. And as for the spring, as I said earlier, that's what we're on the R8 waitlist for.