Why are audiophiles such an addiction?
May 28, 2010 at 3:04 PM Post #76 of 97


Quote:
 
 
So let me get this straight Lunatique: you have a half dozen great headphones already and are now chasing after one or more thousand dollar cans to get the sound that is just right for you, but you are not an audiophile (or audiofool as you like to put it)?
 
It just goes to show you what a relative term audiophile is. I am guessing that to the average Joe who for example decided to splurge and get the $29.95 headphones at Radio Shack rather than the $14.95 model and is quite satisfied that he is already getting great sound, might consider anyone spending even one hundred bucks for headphones an audiofool.
 

I suppose you have a point. To most people, even $150 is unthinkable for a pair of headphones, but back when even as a starving artist, I bought the Denon AH-D950 (flagship headphones from Denon in the previous generation), while I could barely pay rent or buy groceries. I guess music was just more important to me, especially when I was working late into the night every night as a comic book writer/artist back then, and I absolutely needed a good pair of headphones to keep me company without disturbing the neighbors or roommates.
 
When I was talking about being an audiofool, I was mainly talking about people spending money on the kind of thing that makes so little difference--like crazy cable upgrades, headphone amps that cost more than some  expensive computers/laptops/large screen TV's, and it's likely in double-blind test they probably can't even hear the differences reliably. It's when people spend several thousand dollars just to get that 5% increase in quality (and often it's subjective preference of sonic signature anyway). It's like the people who insist on ripping non-lossy on their portable players, when they can't even tell the difference between a 192 VBR LAME encoded MP3 and a .wav file in a double-blind test. I just think it's important to balance this need to feel elite with some common sense and practicality.
 
Collecting headphones that actually do sound significantly different from one another is something else altogether--I don't consider that audiofool behavior. But having variant models that sound almost identical, or having multiple sets of the same model, or other collecting habits that have very little to do with the main point of headphones--which is for the love of music--that's audiofool territory to me. When the gear become the point, then you have lost your way IMO. But then again, I know lots of photography gear-heads that collect lenses and camera bodies and they barely ever take any photos beyond testing how sharp the lenses are or how good the high ISO performance is. That is not love for photography--that is just being a gear person. Not that there's anything wrong with it though--different strokes for different folks, and if gear is what makes them happy, then who can say it's wrong?
 
For me, personally, my purpose for collecting headphones is utilitarian--I'm looking for the pair(s) that fits my needs, and they are:
 
1) Music/Audio production
2) Enjoying music
3) Enjoying movies and video games
 
(Only when late at night and I don't want to disturb anyone. Normally I would definitely pick speakers over headphones. )
 
4) For traveling
 
Once I find the pair(s) that serves those needs as well as I hope, then I'll sell off the pairs that don't serve those needs well enough. I don't see any reason why I'd want or need more than two to three pairs of headphones total for all my needs. I really only need:
 
1) Closed-back for when I'm tracking in the studio.
2) Open-back/Semi-open-back for when I want to be able to hear the doorbell/phone ring.
3) IEM for traveling.
 
That's it. Three pairs for all my needs. I may stretch that number to more pairs if I want additional closed-back for when I'm tracking for more than one musician/singer, and that's definitely for logistical reasons.
 
 

 
 
May 28, 2010 at 3:38 PM Post #77 of 97
I lost the fight against temptation for there was a 10% discount and I was too curious. The Sennheiser PX200 II is now in my possession and much too my liking. There is also new music in, which will surely consume my time. The PX200 II is really good, better than I expected...
 
May 28, 2010 at 4:03 PM Post #78 of 97
I was thinking to get some new phones when I have the money. Now I have the money, but... I don´t know if I´m gonna buy any phones. After all, I love music, not collecting phones. Though, if I´d have practically unlimited funds, I´d probably try out much more. Now I can´t imagine it being worth it, as I love my current setup quite much. = )
 
May 28, 2010 at 9:14 PM Post #79 of 97


Quote:
So let me get this straight Lunatique: you have a half dozen great headphones already and are now chasing after one or more thousand dollar cans to get the sound that is just right for you, but you are not an audiophile (or audiofool as you like to put it)?
 
It just goes to show you what a relative term audiophile is. I am guessing that to the average Joe who for example decided to splurge and get the $29.95 headphones at Radio Shack rather than the $14.95 model and is quite satisfied that he is already getting great sound, might consider anyone spending even one hundred bucks for headphones an audiofool.
 


Amen. 
rolleyes.gif
  
 
I was thinking the very same thing and you beat me to it!  It's all relative and the very same goes for the paradoxic hate for diminishing returns despite all the cans etc. 
 
May 28, 2010 at 9:25 PM Post #80 of 97
Its an addiction that started for me 30 years ago. I started with two channel audio. My first rig was a 3040 Nad intergrated amp an Nad turntable with a Grado cartridge with DCM time window speakers. That lasted me for years until I started listening to speaker. The speakers  I dad at one point was the Genesis V(15K) with a Cj premier 11a and a 6K Cat sli mk11 preamp. It was nuts a 2k vinyl setup a 2k CD player. Then I went on disability and sold all most of it and then started all over. I downsized the main rig and now I am getting out of control with the headphone rig. It is worse than being a drug addict. It is a disease that won't go away. LOL now I sell some excess equipment and maybe a blessing I am not working. When I made a very good income I would buy equipment all the time. Now I scramble to do that. LOL
 
May 28, 2010 at 9:37 PM Post #81 of 97

Quote:
Its an addiction that started for me 30 years ago. I started with two channel audio. My first rig was a 3040 Nad intergrated amp an Nad turntable with a Grado cartridge with DCM time window speakers. That lasted me for years until I started listening to speaker. The speakers  I dad at one point was the Genesis V(15K) with a Cj premier 11a and a 6K Cat sli mk11 preamp. It was nuts a 2k vinyl setup a 2k CD player. Then I went on disability and sold all most of it and then started all over. I downsized the main rig and now I am getting out of control with the headphone rig. It is worse than being a drug addict. It is a disease that won't go away. LOL now I sell some excess equipment and maybe a blessing I am not working. When I made a very good income I would buy equipment all the time. Now I scramble to do that. LOL


I know how you feel.  It's fearsome and a compulsion difficult to shake.
 
I call it plain old Samsara. 
evil_smiley.gif

 
We get a fix with one piece of gear or music and need another fix whenever the current one loses its novelty.  This is only exacerbated by the group see changing and upgrading of equipment as the way to get a real high.    This is why coming on the list destabilizes so much and we start emptying our wallets.
 
May 28, 2010 at 9:43 PM Post #82 of 97

 
Quote:
Quote:

I know how you feel.  It's fearsome and a compulsion difficult to shake.
 
I call it plain old Samsara. 
evil_smiley.gif

 
We get a fix with one piece of gear or music and need another fix whenever the current one loses its novelty.  This is only exacerbated by the group see changing and upgrading of equipment as the way to get a real high.    This is why coming on the list destabilizes so much and we start emptying our wallets.

 
Mate you could't have said it any better, the changing of audio equipment for me is such a regular activity. Its not as though we don't already have great sounding equipment already but the novelty and lust for something every so slightly better...it truely is a fix.
 
 
May 29, 2010 at 5:13 AM Post #83 of 97
I partly disagree, some of my headphones have something special that makes them irreplaceable. My old Pioneer is too special to replace for instance. It gives the music a certain edge, my ears. For now only the portable headphones are replaceable which is why I wanted to try the PX200 II. My music collection is now more important.  
 
May 29, 2010 at 8:15 AM Post #84 of 97
I do a bit of both. For photography I am absolutely practical, I am hot blooded about that. If I ever buy a Leica, it will be because I want a great rangefinder for shooting, that's it. For music gear, I'm a bit more relaxed, good sound comes first but I'll be happy to pay a bit more for a collectible or style. I think it's because for shooting I know exactly what I want to achieve a goal, but being not a professional or active musician, I think of audio gear as more like coffee beans. With audio gear I'm kicking back and indulging, with photography I am out there, focused on creating something. 
 
Quote:
 
When the gear become the point, then you have lost your way IMO. But then again, I know lots of photography gear-heads that collect lenses and camera bodies and they barely ever take any photos beyond testing how sharp the lenses are or how good the high ISO performance is. That is not love for photography--that is just being a gear person. Not that there's anything wrong with it though--different strokes for different folks, and if gear is what makes them happy, then who can say it's wrong?



 
May 29, 2010 at 11:11 AM Post #85 of 97


Quote:
 
When I was talking about being an audiofool, I was mainly talking about people spending money on the kind of thing that makes so little difference--like crazy cable upgrades, headphone amps that cost more than some  expensive computers/laptops/large screen TV's, and it's likely in double-blind test they probably can't even hear the differences reliably. It's when people spend several thousand dollars just to get that 5% increase in quality (and often it's subjective preference of sonic signature anyway). It's like the people who insist on ripping non-lossy on their portable players, when they can't even tell the difference between a 192 VBR LAME encoded MP3 and a .wav file in a double-blind test. I just think it's important to balance this need to feel elite with some common sense and practicality.

 


Yep, I knew that Lunatique was calling me an audiofool.

So apparently you and all the sensible, right-thinking people buy gear because you love music, and audiofools like me buy over-priced gear just to feel elite.
 
I'll mention that I was considering offering you an audition of my system, including a comparison of the O2mk1, O2mk2, and 4070. I also have the HE90, HE60, SR-Omega, Jade, Airbow SR-SC1 and a BHSE and Aristaeus to drive them. Too bad I'm only collecting gear to feel elite and all the gear is stored away and not for actual use.
 
May 29, 2010 at 1:27 PM Post #87 of 97
Haloxt, you are so nice to offer your help...
wink_face.gif

 
Lunatique, watch you words the line between audiophilia and audio foolishness is very thin.  
 
May 30, 2010 at 1:27 AM Post #88 of 97

 
Quote:
Yep, I knew that Lunatique was calling me an audiofool.

So apparently you and all the sensible, right-thinking people buy gear because you love music, and audiofools like me buy over-priced gear just to feel elite.
 
I'll mention that I was considering offering you an audition of my system, including a comparison of the O2mk1, O2mk2, and 4070. I also have the HE90, HE60, SR-Omega, Jade, Airbow SR-SC1 and a BHSE and Aristaeus to drive them. Too bad I'm only collecting gear to feel elite and all the gear is stored away and not for actual use.


Well, you know that us sensible right-thinking people are just jealous, right?
very_evil_smiley.gif

 
It's kind of an on-going struggle I think. When we all start as clueless cheap ear-bud wearing teenagers, we never even thought about whether the headphones were reproducing the music accurately or even aesthetically satisfying--the conversations were about the music we listened to, the new bands we discovered, and being immersed in the soundtracks of our lives. But as we get older and as our financial prowess grow, we start seeking higher quality, and the conversation starts to shift, where we start talking about gear more and more. This isn't just among audiophiles, but also audio professionals too. Take a spin around gearslutz.com and you'll see it's the same there. KVRAudio is the only place I know where that attitude is much less prevalent, as the spirit of that community is all about ingenious plugins that are often freeware.
 
Time and time again, I've seen people at various music/audio production forums lamenting the loss of joy when they delve deeper and deeper into that abyss of gear acquisition. They were hung up on that 10% of quality increase that costs thousands of dollars, that elusive "magical" sounding mic pre, or how a DAC sounds minutely different from another DAC, which requires multiple double-blind tests to even be able to assess (and not always successfully), or how this pair of reference monitor sounds slightly smoother than that pair, and so on. Coupled with the choices and complexities of modern DAW/sequencer operation, they one day realize they were making a lot more music before all of this stuff became the focus, and many ended up selling off a bunch of stuff and just kept it as simple as possible, so they can actually get back to creating music instead of obsessing about gear. But I realize the motivation of musicians are different from music-lovers--they need to be productive, while music lovers only need to enjoy, and often having different sonic signatures of various gears IS an enjoyment because the differences between them is sort of like having different spices to add to your meal.
 
I think the fine line between a sensible audiophile and an audiofool is so thin that we're all probably constantly treading back and forth between the two. If someone is not doing well financially but chooses to buy that very expensive DAC or tube amp, when the DAC and amp he has now sounds perfectly fine, then perhaps priorities are a bit skewed at that point. But if he's just got big fat year-end bonus and he has no kids to raise and no wife to give him dirty looks, then sure, splurge and go hog wild. But too often I see people barely able to afford the toys but keep buying anyway, adding more stress to their lives, and then when the $hit hits the fan, they have to sell off a bunch of stuff just to survive. That's audiofool territory to me, simply because priorities in life are misplaced at that point, not because of anything to do with the gears themselves.
 
I think we all have different thresholds for diminishing returns, as well as for the collector's mentality. I look at the guys who have entire basements filled with antique synths and expensive monster modulars, where some of the models are just slight variants of the same make, I immediately recognize that the person is not collecting those synths because he needs all of them to make the kind of music he wants to make--his priorities has shifted, and collecting IS the point. I can't fault someone for that, because I can totally understand that mentality, especially when the objects of desire are complex and fascinating pieces of gear with infinite sonic possibilities. I suppose collecting headphones, amps, DAC's, expensive cables...etc are similar, but to a much lesser degree. Swapping them around can alter the sonic signature, and comparing the differences can be a lot of fun, but I don't think everyone who goes that far can actually hear the differences--so much of it is placebo. I always see double-blind tests where people fail to tell the difference between the DAC on a $50 soundcard and standalone DAC that costs more than a thousand dollars, or a regular cable vs. a ridiculously expensive cable, or well-ripped lossy files vs. non-lossy files, and so on. I've also had people tell me off the record that the difference they hear with expensive amps is so minor that they really regret buying something so expensive, and end up replacing them with much more modest models. I think if someone is to splurge on expensive stuff, they should be sure that they DO hear the difference very clearly, so that the money's well-spent, otherwise, that's audiofool territory. Then again, it's their money and no one can tell them how to spend it. Maybe the thrill of acquiring and owning and trying to hear the differences is the joy for them, but I think that joy is more meaningful if they really do hear the difference and those differences do translate into joy in their lives. Note that I never, ever, state whether I think a particular member can or can't hear the difference--I personally do not know, and I'm not talking about anyone in particular. I usually assume that people who own gears like that CAN hear the difference and the differences are meaningful to them in the context of bringing more joy to their lives. It's only when someone blatantly demonstrates to us that he doesn't know the difference anyway and all the money spent is meaningless, do I actually notice it.
 
I guess it's all about how well you are doing financially, and how well you balance priorities in life. If you are wealthy and the cost of the gear doesn't stress your bank account in any meaningful way, then you can be as extravagant as you want and no one has the right to judge. This kind of reminds me of a story I heard on a Chinese audiophile forum. There was this guy who had no education and worked hard labor, but he's always loved music very much. He'd save up money to buy concert tickets so he could listen to a symphonic orchestra live. He also saved up so he could buy CD's, and a high-quality audio system. He pretty much worked his ass off, holding down multiple jobs, and really destroyed his health along the way. He managed to acquire the system of his desire, and he got to listen to it for a brief period before he died--he worked himself to death.
 
So the meaning we give to the things we are passionate about varies. How many people are willing to die for their love for music or audio gear? It was worth it for this guy, but I wish he had been more sensible about it--he might still be alive today, leaning back with a smile on his face as he loses himself in the music.
 
Anyway, I just want to say that we find our own meanings in our passions and hobbies, and we all have different priorities in life. My personal stance is just one guy's opinion, and it's my own personal value and priorities. I don't want to force it on anyone, and I have no right to judge anyway--I'm only stating an opinion, which is what this thread is about--asking why we are addicted to this love affair with audio gear and what it means to us. I might see myself as being sensible, but to someone else, I would appear to be completely insane already, so it's all relative anyway.
 
May 30, 2010 at 4:47 AM Post #89 of 97
I have to lose some headphones again and I am considering some other headphones. The hard part is making sure that whatever you spend, you don not spend too much money. My audio gear is either useful enough to keep or redundant and has to go.
 
In the eyes of 'normal (happy with my ear buds) people' I already crossed the line even though I was smart enough not to get broke by my purchases. At least I know how good my music sounds, anything else does not matter for me.
 
May 30, 2010 at 8:11 AM Post #90 of 97
Lunatique,
Very nice post.  I pretty much agree with all of it.
 
Right now, I'm caught in a loop of curiosity and get a lot of enjoyment out of trying different stuff.  But I'll soon be finished.  My curiosity is pretty much done with headphones for sure.  Not so sure about amps.   I have some unfinished business there.  However, there's no doubt for me at least, that all the curiosity would be meaningless and unmotivated without my love for music being at the center.
 

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