PFKMan23
Headphoneus Supremus
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It also includes Blackgate power caps and a Solen 1 Cap.
Which are the current Singlepower models?
- Thread starter Glod
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sacd lover
Headphoneus Supremus
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Quote:
The SE is not just rebiased for the 6bl7gt type tubes. The amp is run at a higher voltage, typically 375 volts, for the 6bl7gta/6bx7gt output tubes. The gain tube is rebiased to provide more current drive for the 6bl7 tube types but always remains at 300 volts. There is a high/low voltage switch on the SE to switch between the standard 300 volts and the higher voltage. The amp has a Supra transformer but, in addition, the entire power supply is upgraded to almost Supra Level. The MPX3 cant accomodate the much larger resevoir caps in the Supra but otherwise the amp is basically given a Supra power supply. Finally, the amp receives blackgate cathode caps upgrade.
So in summary .... you have a stepped attenuator upgrade, blackgate cathode cap upgrade, Supra transformer and power supply upgrade, a reengineered biasing of both the gain tube and output tubes, a seperate high voltage pathway with a high/low voltage switch for the output tubes .... high for the 6bl7gt type tubes .... low for the 6sn7gt/5687 output tubes, SLAM adapters for the 5687 and lots and lots of labor. Remember you have to remove the old parts, often in cramped quarters and then rebuild the circuit. Upgrading an amp is almost as much work as building a new one.
| Originally Posted by omedon /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have searched and searched and I must be blind because I know that I have seen it before. What exactly is a SLAM SE. What are the upgrades over a standard MX3 that it includes? From what I gather a FULL SE configuration includes: Slam Adapters Supra Transformer Re-biased for 6bl7 output types Stepped Attenuator Is this right? What else is in a SLAM SE over a stock MPX3? |
The SE is not just rebiased for the 6bl7gt type tubes. The amp is run at a higher voltage, typically 375 volts, for the 6bl7gta/6bx7gt output tubes. The gain tube is rebiased to provide more current drive for the 6bl7 tube types but always remains at 300 volts. There is a high/low voltage switch on the SE to switch between the standard 300 volts and the higher voltage. The amp has a Supra transformer but, in addition, the entire power supply is upgraded to almost Supra Level. The MPX3 cant accomodate the much larger resevoir caps in the Supra but otherwise the amp is basically given a Supra power supply. Finally, the amp receives blackgate cathode caps upgrade.
So in summary .... you have a stepped attenuator upgrade, blackgate cathode cap upgrade, Supra transformer and power supply upgrade, a reengineered biasing of both the gain tube and output tubes, a seperate high voltage pathway with a high/low voltage switch for the output tubes .... high for the 6bl7gt type tubes .... low for the 6sn7gt/5687 output tubes, SLAM adapters for the 5687 and lots and lots of labor. Remember you have to remove the old parts, often in cramped quarters and then rebuild the circuit. Upgrading an amp is almost as much work as building a new one.
Glod
1000+ Head-Fier
I just added the balanced PPX3, or more correctly the PPX3-6SN7 Balanced, since the spotted one(s) has (have) had 6SN7 drivers. More information about these is welcome.
sacd lover
Headphoneus Supremus
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Quote:
SLAM PPX3-6SN7 Balanced might be a tad more accurate. The amp definitely uses 5687 output tubes.
| Originally Posted by Glod /img/forum/go_quote.gif I just added the balanced PPX3, or more correctly the PPX3-6SN7 Balanced, since the spotted one(s) has (have) had 6SN7 drivers. More information about these is welcome. |
SLAM PPX3-6SN7 Balanced might be a tad more accurate. The amp definitely uses 5687 output tubes.
Glod
1000+ Head-Fier
Quote:
Thanks. It has been corrected.
It might not be of great importance, but for the consistency in the naming of the different types and models, I put the SLAM designation after the model name. I hope the (SLAM) PPX3 SLAM owners are OK with that.
| Originally Posted by sacd lover /img/forum/go_quote.gif SLAM PPX3-6SN7 Balanced might be a tad more accurate. The amp definitely uses 5687 output tubes. |
Thanks. It has been corrected.
It might not be of great importance, but for the consistency in the naming of the different types and models, I put the SLAM designation after the model name. I hope the (SLAM) PPX3 SLAM owners are OK with that.
sacd lover
Headphoneus Supremus
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Quote:
Fine with me.
I wasnt sure where to put it.
| Originally Posted by Glod /img/forum/go_quote.gif Thanks. It has been corrected. It might not be of great importance, but for the consistency in the naming of the different types and models, I put the SLAM designation after the model name. I hope the (SLAM) PPX3 SLAM owners are OK with that.
|
Fine with me.
sberger
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i don't know where you put it, but mikhail got me my 5687 adaptors, and i'm groovin' on some great sounds with 2 5687 tung sol d getters and a sylvania 6gu7 driver, and man my ol' ppx3 stock machine sounds mighty mighty fine. thanks big time goes to sacd lover, and mikhail, for makin' this ol' truck purr like a new kitty.
markmaxx
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There are some new things comming to us from singlepower in the new year
.
It sounds like Mikhail has stepped the Singlepower line up to another level.
It sounds like Mikhail has stepped the Singlepower line up to another level.
PFKMan23
Headphoneus Supremus
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Quote:
Your list is incomplete. Even though the above is taken from the Extreme thread I thought this would be relevant. The following are official models but not properly indicated: PPX3 SLAM (this one idicates 6cg7 driver), the PPX3 (6sn7 for the driver/gain position) SLAM, MPX3 SLAM, MPX3 XLR, Supra XLR, SDS, SDS T, Maestro XLR,
If you didn't notice already, a SDS XLR Accent is a SDS XLR in the smaller Maestro sized chasis, and a SDS XLR is in the larger chassis. The "T" At the end of either indicates tube rectification. No T signifies SS rectification.
Supra SDS and Supra SDS XLR bear the moniker Supra in a redundant fashion. It is simple SDS, SDS XLR, etc... SDS is an abbreviation (or was) for Super Duper, Supra. They are all official models.
It is worthy of note that I do believe that Singlepower has sold some Maestro Aurums. Whether they are single ended or balanced is unknown
Your description of the MPX3 SLAM SE is also slightly inaccurate/ambiguous. The standard MPX3 SLAM SE includes both a method of adjustment for the plate voltage and the current biasing of the tubes. The voltage is controlled by a knob/switch aka the voltage switch, which is standard. The bias is adjusted automatically in the circuit depending on the tube in place. The bias switch is optional in the MPX3 SLAM SE.
| Originally Posted by Glod /img/forum/go_quote.gif The official SP models are in bold typeface. |
Your list is incomplete. Even though the above is taken from the Extreme thread I thought this would be relevant. The following are official models but not properly indicated: PPX3 SLAM (this one idicates 6cg7 driver), the PPX3 (6sn7 for the driver/gain position) SLAM, MPX3 SLAM, MPX3 XLR, Supra XLR, SDS, SDS T, Maestro XLR,
If you didn't notice already, a SDS XLR Accent is a SDS XLR in the smaller Maestro sized chasis, and a SDS XLR is in the larger chassis. The "T" At the end of either indicates tube rectification. No T signifies SS rectification.
Supra SDS and Supra SDS XLR bear the moniker Supra in a redundant fashion. It is simple SDS, SDS XLR, etc... SDS is an abbreviation (or was) for Super Duper, Supra. They are all official models.
It is worthy of note that I do believe that Singlepower has sold some Maestro Aurums. Whether they are single ended or balanced is unknown
Your description of the MPX3 SLAM SE is also slightly inaccurate/ambiguous. The standard MPX3 SLAM SE includes both a method of adjustment for the plate voltage and the current biasing of the tubes. The voltage is controlled by a knob/switch aka the voltage switch, which is standard. The bias is adjusted automatically in the circuit depending on the tube in place. The bias switch is optional in the MPX3 SLAM SE.
markmaxx
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Quote:
My MPX3 has the supra transformer and 400V out put for the 6BL7GTs I am not sure whats inside? Is it a SE? I belive it was the first MPX3 with 400V. out put stage.
| Originally Posted by PFKMan23 Your description of the MPX3 SLAM SE is also slightly inaccurate/ambiguous. The standard MPX3 SLAM SE includes both a method of adjustment for the plate voltage and the current biasing of the tubes. The voltage is controlled by a knob/switch aka the voltage switch, which is standard. The bias is adjusted automatically in the circuit depending on the tube in place. The bias switch is optional in the MPX3 SLAM SE. |
My MPX3 has the supra transformer and 400V out put for the 6BL7GTs I am not sure whats inside? Is it a SE? I belive it was the first MPX3 with 400V. out put stage.
PFKMan23
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Quote:
I don't know.
| Originally Posted by markmaxx /img/forum/go_quote.gif My MPX3 has the supra transformer and 400V out put for the 6BL7GTs I am not sure whats inside? Is it a SE? I belive it was the first MPX3 with 400V. out put stage. |
I don't know.
Glod
1000+ Head-Fier
Quote:
Yes PFKman23, the list can be a bit confusing I guess. The list is unofficial in the sense it is not made by Singlepower them selves. The models on their site we called base models, and I think we need to call the SP Extreme that too since Mikhail officially presented it him self and it does have a different circuitry. All other models do certainly exist but are not mentioned by Singlepower as being standard models in their product line up. It still happens frequently that people wonder why a particular model is not mentioned on the SP site. This list is meant to give a rough indication of what Singlepower can offer and how different models relate to each other. The list is completely independent of Singelpower Audio Inc.
The story behind what is named a “Supra SDS” in the list is that the SDS was viewed by some as a thorough upgrade of the Supra and not a discrete model. Also understandable because the chassis were labeled Supra, not SDS. Some used “Supra SDS” from time to time. Perhaps they found that “SDS” could not stand by it self, despite that it already had Supra in its name. I think SDS became too much of an acronym too, why people felt “Supra” had to be added to clarify its origin. I also have a vague memory of having seen one reading “Supra SDS”, but I could of course be wrong. Anyway, I think the SDS certainly deserves the model epithet: Not only does it have many non-standard options but also, apparently, a slightly different circuitry with shorter paths in comparison to the Supra. I am perfectly OK with referring this heavily modified Supra as only SDS.
The explanation of the SE feature I baked together from info from posts by you and Earl. How about a description like this: SE is a feature which can be added to many of the SP amps and entails a Supra transformer with partial Supra filtration, adjustable tube biasing (current and voltage independently) for all sockets, stepped attenuator and Solen stage 1 power supply capacitor. Or actually, one could even leave it by only mentioning the adjustable bias, since that really is the core of the SE feature. What do you think; the other options are only suitable options, right? The SE feature could be added to a SDS or a SDS-XLR I guess and then it would feel awkward to have the stepped attenuator, Solen 1 and Supra transformer as a definition of SE.
You are right, we will have to change the SDS-XLR definitions in the list. They come in either standard Maestro chassis or a larger version of these depending on the number and size of the options, right? But are really all SDS-XLR’s in standard Maestro chassis called “Accent”? Perhaps it was only the tube-rectified version which had that addition?
I also didn’t mention the types of chassis for the SDS-T. I had a look again and it actually has completely different chassis than the base models, as far as I can see. The chassis are just not standard MPX3 ones with the controls and connectors on the short sides; they are of different seizes and the aluminum sheets, which make up the body, are folded differently: from one short side to the other. http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=87888
| Originally Posted by PFKMan23 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Your list is incomplete. Even though the above is taken from the Extreme thread I thought this would be relevant. The following are official models but not properly indicated: PPX3 SLAM (this one idicates 6cg7 driver), the PPX3 (6sn7 for the driver/gain position) SLAM, MPX3 SLAM, MPX3 XLR, Supra XLR, SDS, SDS T, Maestro XLR, If you didn't notice already, a SDS XLR Accent is a SDS XLR in the smaller Maestro sized chasis, and a SDS XLR is in the larger chassis. The "T" At the end of either indicates tube rectification. No T signifies SS rectification. Supra SDS and Supra SDS XLR bear the moniker Supra in a redundant fashion. It is simple SDS, SDS XLR, etc... SDS is an abbreviation (or was) for Super Duper, Supra. They are all official models. It is worthy of note that I do believe that Singlepower has sold some Maestro Aurums. Whether they are single ended or balanced is unknown Your description of the MPX3 SLAM SE is also slightly inaccurate/ambiguous. The standard MPX3 SLAM SE includes both a method of adjustment for the plate voltage and the current biasing of the tubes. The voltage is controlled by a knob/switch aka the voltage switch, which is standard. The bias is adjusted automatically in the circuit depending on the tube in place. The bias switch is optional in the MPX3 SLAM SE. |
Yes PFKman23, the list can be a bit confusing I guess. The list is unofficial in the sense it is not made by Singlepower them selves. The models on their site we called base models, and I think we need to call the SP Extreme that too since Mikhail officially presented it him self and it does have a different circuitry. All other models do certainly exist but are not mentioned by Singlepower as being standard models in their product line up. It still happens frequently that people wonder why a particular model is not mentioned on the SP site. This list is meant to give a rough indication of what Singlepower can offer and how different models relate to each other. The list is completely independent of Singelpower Audio Inc.
The story behind what is named a “Supra SDS” in the list is that the SDS was viewed by some as a thorough upgrade of the Supra and not a discrete model. Also understandable because the chassis were labeled Supra, not SDS. Some used “Supra SDS” from time to time. Perhaps they found that “SDS” could not stand by it self, despite that it already had Supra in its name. I think SDS became too much of an acronym too, why people felt “Supra” had to be added to clarify its origin. I also have a vague memory of having seen one reading “Supra SDS”, but I could of course be wrong. Anyway, I think the SDS certainly deserves the model epithet: Not only does it have many non-standard options but also, apparently, a slightly different circuitry with shorter paths in comparison to the Supra. I am perfectly OK with referring this heavily modified Supra as only SDS.
The explanation of the SE feature I baked together from info from posts by you and Earl. How about a description like this: SE is a feature which can be added to many of the SP amps and entails a Supra transformer with partial Supra filtration, adjustable tube biasing (current and voltage independently) for all sockets, stepped attenuator and Solen stage 1 power supply capacitor. Or actually, one could even leave it by only mentioning the adjustable bias, since that really is the core of the SE feature. What do you think; the other options are only suitable options, right? The SE feature could be added to a SDS or a SDS-XLR I guess and then it would feel awkward to have the stepped attenuator, Solen 1 and Supra transformer as a definition of SE.
You are right, we will have to change the SDS-XLR definitions in the list. They come in either standard Maestro chassis or a larger version of these depending on the number and size of the options, right? But are really all SDS-XLR’s in standard Maestro chassis called “Accent”? Perhaps it was only the tube-rectified version which had that addition?
I also didn’t mention the types of chassis for the SDS-T. I had a look again and it actually has completely different chassis than the base models, as far as I can see. The chassis are just not standard MPX3 ones with the controls and connectors on the short sides; they are of different seizes and the aluminum sheets, which make up the body, are folded differently: from one short side to the other. http://www.head-fi.org/forums/showthread.php?t=87888
jrisles
100+ Head-Fier
Hi Guys
After reading (little) about the Single Power amps i have put a down payment on a MPX3 SLAM SE Amplifier. (Maybe somewhat prematurely, not because i am not happy with what i have read thus far but because of all the options available).
The list sent out to me dated 12/29/06 reads the following for the following amps (note that not all the amps were listed on this price list that was sent to me);
MPX3 Headphone Amplifer - $995.00
MPX3 SLAM Headphone Amplifer - $1199.00
MPX3 SLAM SE Headphone Amplifer - $2149.00 (this amp includes the following added components, the prices indicate what each component contributes to the final price of the MPX3 SLAM SE
Other items on this price list include;
Ultimate Power Supply - $285.00 (anyone know what this is??)
Preamp Out - $119.00
Now my question is this. Am i better getting a modded up MPX3 or going for a higher end model? Such as the Supra or Maestro ZR?
Also what is with the balanced XLR outputs for headphones?? Does this type of output provide a "better" sound? Is there an audible difference between an XLR o/p than that of a normal headphone jack o/p?
And finally given that i am likely to purchase more than one set of headphones do you think that it would be possible to have both types of outputs (XLR & normal headphone jack) built on the same amplifer?
After reading this post (which i didn't get to read prior to me placing my order) i fear that i may have rushed in too soon without doing my research. And if you read the 2nd last paragraph on the Blue Moon review the author tends to suggest that the MPX3 base unit is the "best value for money" & that the the value of the extra upgrades to the base unit does not really warrant the cost because he believes that the base MPX3 unit is that good!!
Happy New Year to you all.
regards
Jeff
After reading (little) about the Single Power amps i have put a down payment on a MPX3 SLAM SE Amplifier. (Maybe somewhat prematurely, not because i am not happy with what i have read thus far but because of all the options available).
The list sent out to me dated 12/29/06 reads the following for the following amps (note that not all the amps were listed on this price list that was sent to me);
MPX3 Headphone Amplifer - $995.00
MPX3 SLAM Headphone Amplifer - $1199.00
MPX3 SLAM SE Headphone Amplifer - $2149.00 (this amp includes the following added components, the prices indicate what each component contributes to the final price of the MPX3 SLAM SE
- Two Channel Gold Attenuator - $229.00
- Solen Plate Voltage Input Capacitors - $65.00
- Black Gate Power Capacitors Stage 1 - $189.00
- High Voltage Switch - $199.00
Other items on this price list include;
Ultimate Power Supply - $285.00 (anyone know what this is??)
Preamp Out - $119.00
Now my question is this. Am i better getting a modded up MPX3 or going for a higher end model? Such as the Supra or Maestro ZR?
Also what is with the balanced XLR outputs for headphones?? Does this type of output provide a "better" sound? Is there an audible difference between an XLR o/p than that of a normal headphone jack o/p?
And finally given that i am likely to purchase more than one set of headphones do you think that it would be possible to have both types of outputs (XLR & normal headphone jack) built on the same amplifer?
After reading this post (which i didn't get to read prior to me placing my order) i fear that i may have rushed in too soon without doing my research. And if you read the 2nd last paragraph on the Blue Moon review the author tends to suggest that the MPX3 base unit is the "best value for money" & that the the value of the extra upgrades to the base unit does not really warrant the cost because he believes that the base MPX3 unit is that good!!
Happy New Year to you all.
regards
Jeff
markmaxx
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Quote:
The slam is just addapters $99.00 each so the math works out for you.
Quote:
This is a big improvement the 6BL7GT tubes are the standard by which others are measured by in the MPX3/Supra family.
Quote:
Supra with its better power supply if the money is not a huge issue.
Quote:
XLR offers a better much cleaner and more powerfull soundstage that is much bigger. My new Singlepower amp is a Supra XLR I asked many questions here and it seems to be the best buy sound V. price in the Singlepower line up.
Quote:
Yes! Sir.
Quote:
Don't belive everything you read
It is good but there is better!
Quote:
Happy new year to you too Jeff.
| Originally Posted by jrisles /img/forum/go_quote.gif Hi Guys After reading (little) about the Single Power amps i have put a down payment on a MPX3 SLAM SE Amplifier. (Maybe somewhat prematurely, not because i am not happy with what i have read thus far but because of all the options available). The list sent out to me dated 12/29/06 reads the following for the following amps (note that not all the amps were listed on this price list that was sent to me); MPX3 Headphone Amplifer - $995.00 MPX3 SLAM Headphone Amplifer - $1199.00 |
The slam is just addapters $99.00 each so the math works out for you.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by jrisles /img/forum/go_quote.gif MPX3 SLAM SE Headphone Amplifer - $2149.00 (this amp includes the following added components, the prices indicate what each component contributes to the final price of the MPX3 SLAM SE
|
This is a big improvement the 6BL7GT tubes are the standard by which others are measured by in the MPX3/Supra family.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by jrisles /img/forum/go_quote.gif Other items on this price list include; Ultimate Power Supply - $285.00 (anyone know what this is??) Preamp Out - $119.00 Now my question is this. Am i better getting a modded up MPX3 or going for a higher end model? Such as the Supra or Maestro ZR? |
Supra with its better power supply if the money is not a huge issue.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by jrisles /img/forum/go_quote.gif Also what is with the balanced XLR outputs for headphones?? Does this type of output provide a "better" sound? Is there an audible difference between an XLR o/p than that of a normal headphone jack o/p? |
XLR offers a better much cleaner and more powerfull soundstage that is much bigger. My new Singlepower amp is a Supra XLR I asked many questions here and it seems to be the best buy sound V. price in the Singlepower line up.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by jrisles /img/forum/go_quote.gif And finally given that i am likely to purchase more than one set of headphones do you think that it would be possible to have both types of outputs (XLR & normal headphone jack) built on the same amplifer? |
Yes! Sir.
Quote:
| Originally Posted by jrisles /img/forum/go_quote.gif After reading this post (which i didn't get to read prior to me placing my order) i fear that i may have rushed in too soon without doing my research. And if you read the 2nd last paragraph on the Blue Moon review the author tends to suggest that the MPX3 base unit is the "best value for money" & that the the value of the extra upgrades to the base unit does not really warrant the cost because he believes that the base MPX3 unit is that good!! |
Don't belive everything you read
Quote:
| Originally Posted by jrisles /img/forum/go_quote.gif Happy New Year to you all. regards Jeff |
Happy new year to you too Jeff.
PFKMan23
Headphoneus Supremus
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Glod,
There are a couple things you need to realize. Firstly being that the SP website really hasn't had any major updates dating back to when the amps were using 6sn7s in the MPX3, Supra, etc.. A much better description can be sound on the Moon Audio Website Singlepower product page. The PPX3 SLAM, MPX3 SLAM SE while retaining the baseline moniker PPX3 and MPX3 are baseline models as the circuit has had to be modified to accomodate these more powerful tubes.
This is especially true in the case of the MPX3 SLAM SE because in addition to the upgrades that are included in the package, the major modifications occur in the power supply and in the circuit in general to optimize and account for the more powerful tubes. So while those things do occur (adding the voltage switch, increasing the bias, putting in the Supra transformer etc..) it is a much more involved process that can evolve the product into a MPX3 SLAM SE which can differ greatly from the "regular MPX3".
That being said, what complicates matters further is the options that accompany the SLAM SE. You can have a MPX3 SLAM SE that differs in options. For example if you didn't want a stepped attenuator, you can just have a regular volume pot. However even though the SA is included in the standard package, it is still a SLAM SE with a regular volume pot. That being said, it does differ from the standard package.
You are correct that adding a SE designation to include a Supra transformer and certain options to the other amps can lead to an awkward situation. For example the standard reservoirs caps on the Supra are much larger than that on the MPX3 SLAM SE. In addition the Stepped attenuator is standard with the Supra.
If I was creating a definition for the just the SE moniker, it would be something to the effect of "A SE is an amp that has circuit changes in order to optimize the usage of more powerful tubes like the 6BL7GTA. "
FYI, there are SDS XLR Accents with solid state rectification. The presence or absence "T" at the end signifies sold state or tube recification.
There are a couple things you need to realize. Firstly being that the SP website really hasn't had any major updates dating back to when the amps were using 6sn7s in the MPX3, Supra, etc.. A much better description can be sound on the Moon Audio Website Singlepower product page. The PPX3 SLAM, MPX3 SLAM SE while retaining the baseline moniker PPX3 and MPX3 are baseline models as the circuit has had to be modified to accomodate these more powerful tubes.
This is especially true in the case of the MPX3 SLAM SE because in addition to the upgrades that are included in the package, the major modifications occur in the power supply and in the circuit in general to optimize and account for the more powerful tubes. So while those things do occur (adding the voltage switch, increasing the bias, putting in the Supra transformer etc..) it is a much more involved process that can evolve the product into a MPX3 SLAM SE which can differ greatly from the "regular MPX3".
That being said, what complicates matters further is the options that accompany the SLAM SE. You can have a MPX3 SLAM SE that differs in options. For example if you didn't want a stepped attenuator, you can just have a regular volume pot. However even though the SA is included in the standard package, it is still a SLAM SE with a regular volume pot. That being said, it does differ from the standard package.
You are correct that adding a SE designation to include a Supra transformer and certain options to the other amps can lead to an awkward situation. For example the standard reservoirs caps on the Supra are much larger than that on the MPX3 SLAM SE. In addition the Stepped attenuator is standard with the Supra.
If I was creating a definition for the just the SE moniker, it would be something to the effect of "A SE is an amp that has circuit changes in order to optimize the usage of more powerful tubes like the 6BL7GTA. "
FYI, there are SDS XLR Accents with solid state rectification. The presence or absence "T" at the end signifies sold state or tube recification.
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