[thecrow]

Hi

(edited for brevity

Relatively new here but have read a lot of posts. Looking for assistance in headphone recommendation.

I recently have totally upgraded my portable music devices. After doing a lot of research I have bought:

Fiio x5 (replacing my iriver h340)
Ath m50x
Cayin c5 amp
Listen to music in aiff format

I find the m50x's quite solid but am looking for more/better - As a friend of mine puts it these are good GATEWAY headphones.



** I'm looking for recommendations for CLOSED Headphones relatively portable as I want to use these on public transport.

Ideally, if possible, I am seeking well balanced flat sounding headphones. However I'm not looking for cans too flat so I need some colour which I can try to describe as a broad soundscape with aliveness.
I guess a natural but open and balanced sound. (i hope I am not contradicting myself in my description)

another way to try to say it is, true bass, inviting mids and well balance and true highs (?)

And STEELY DAN is main reference and primary filter in selecting hardware. Then throw in Peter Gabriel, Frank Zappa, Thomas Dolby also like my rock blues and R&B to sound true too. V

** Can I say I want it to simply sound like I'm present in the studio (not necessarily in a big arena)

But the key is STEELY DAN!!!!










The main shortcoming I have with the M50'x's is I find they are too v shaped at times. The issues I have is two fold:

1) The highs (eg hi hats, cymbals) can sometimes be a bit sharp.
2) Because some elements sound solid eg the bass and the higher mids i then find other areas lacking and the headphones can be out of balance

I have only used them for 15 hours so they may evolve further

i've recently read up on the srh1840's, dt 770, th600s and many others but looking for experienced guidance/views

Price wise where is the point of diminishing returns? And how good can the sound of my fiio x5 really get with closed headphones - is nirvana (not the band) attainable or at least visible at a certain level?

Your guidance and experience would be much appreciated

Looking forward to where my money is likely to go next.

Many thanks for your time
Peter t

 

[thecrow]

????

 

[jodgey4]

It's a long post... that probably turns many would-be-helpers off.
 
Upgrades from the M50x would be any v-shaped can, there's threads on those. TH-600's would be the perfect upgrade to my ears, but it sounds like you're worried about bright treble. If you want a midly bass boosted headphone with an otherwise neutral sound, perhaps the ZMF V2's could work, or B&O H6's. That's all I can think of right now, but that should get you started. When I think of more, I'll come back. Maybe shorten your op in the meantime to attract more people.

 

[thecrow]

Hi Thanks for your feedback
 
I have done my best to edit and shorten my OP
 
I'll relook at the th600's and the other 2 you've mentioned.
 
Unless something in my descriptions points to a little V shape profile, I was thinking i was looking for something a little more even balanced, unless of course a little V shape can effectively add warmth and an inviting texture to the sound. - what do you think.
 
 
as much as i am drawn to the monitor side of the sound spectrum in headphones speakers, i need more colour than absolutely flat ones
eg when i bought speakers I found yamahas HS5 were too flat and ended up with jbl lsr2325 (if that helps)
 
Bright treble itself is ok but I have found the m50x's have been a little harsh at times. However the main issue I have is the V shape is a little too   much and with the highs I need a little more truth and less grating.
 
let me also say that i do feel that as these headphones are being played in, the v shape is still there (of course) but sometimes the harshness I find has lessened (eg Peter Gabriel's red rain)

 

[jodgey4]

I'm familiar with the HS5's . I'm considering the HS8's myself. The HS5's have brilliant upper mids, but can sound boring on the wrong tracks.
 
For flatter cans that are closed, Beyerdynamic's T70p, Soundmagic HP150/100, NAD HP50, Focal Spirit Pro, Sony 7520.

 

[thecrow]

Great I'll look at those too

I was looking (as in reading on them) at the nadhp50s just last night. There was a really good review on a great youtube channel on these that surprisingly as I was watching compared them to the m50xs.
What a headband!!! I guess that's one way to ensure no one seats next to me (the nutter looking guy) on the train - who would? Maybe someone else who knows the headphones.
http://youtu.be/5p00K3MUWf4

 

[jodgey4]

The sound from them is fantastic though . I prefer the natural sound of those to probably 80% of headphones I've heard, some costing much more. They aren't objectively comparable to TOTL options, but they're really impressive, and a great value. The PSB M4U1 is a very similar sound, more neutral - maybe those look okay for you?

 

[thecrow]

Thanks heaps for all the ideas. There's headphones you've suggested me look at that in me reading up on say 30 headphones some of those I didn't come across or even consider eg the b&o. Im looking forward to inverstigating further and getting around to see if there are some available here in sydney, Australia to audition.

Re the hp50 the reviewer on that YouTube clip was saying, for what I remember that the highs fall away a bit - do you remember how they are in that regard?
I'm thinking as the m50xs are still enjoyable that if I grabbed a second or replacement headphone I would be looking at going up a level or 2 in overall audio sensation (so to speak). Not that I wouldn't audition these hp50s

And having not heard the th600s or the th900s YET am I going to find headphones of that calibre leave headphones of this m50xs ($150-$200) for dead?? Am I lkeley to be blown away ie is this like night and day between these step ups. I am SO hanging out to get the time to sus these other options out if the pricing is reflected in the sound

 

[thecrow]

Hi curious re the fact your're considering the hs8's. We're you using these as true monitors for mastering or mixing?

I know the jbl lsr 2325ps have been superseded by the 305s but have you listened to the 305 or probably more the jbl 308s? I'm guessing they may not be quite right for you as you are looking at the yamahas? But curious how the new jbls are if you have?

And no I'm not lookinfpg for new speakers/monitors as the 2325ps are handy for my uses hooked up to my Mac. My $$$$$ seem to now be flowing the portable and headphone way which suits my wife and 4 year old better

 

[jodgey4]

Just as a disclaimer, I've only heard the HP50, M4U1, TH-600's, M-50x's, B&O H6, and DT770's out of all mentioned here so far - whole list is in my user profile.
 
About the HP50 - the highs were extended, and while not overly airy, I thought cymbals and such had a very natural sound, though perhaps not neutral. It's been a while, so I wouldn't feel comfortable saying much more than that. Those mid-fi cans are where diminishing returns hit the hardest, around $300 I'd say is the mark to go for if you want a great value.
 
The TH-600's have a V-shaped sound, maybe not what you're looking for? They're a clear successor in my mind to M-50x's, full bass, exciting treble, a little bit of funkiness in the mids due to the V-shape... but with MUCH more openness and detail. They certainly are what I'd consider 'audiophile' grade cans. In that range, perhaps the new Sony Z7 would maybe be a better choice for you? I hear they're more neutral.
 
I've heard the HS5's, HS8's, M-Audio BX5's, PreSonus E5's, and KRK ROKIT 5's. Not many, but I'm just now getting into monitors, as I want to start doing audio production. So unfortunately, I'm not the best source. Also, I prefer a neutral sound, and already have a nice DAC/preamp, so powered monitors make a lot of sense for me. I'm going to purchase the HS8's soon, maybe during this next week.
 
I heard these all in rooms that were well treated and of a similar size to what I'd be using, and I've been around enough to know what sounds correct. The HS8's were the most extended to my ears (once I got the salesman to volume match after constant nagging), with great detail, imaging, and control. The HS5's were too sweet in the upper mids, rolled off in bass, and the treble seemed spikey. The E5's were a more bloated HS5, and the ROKIT 5's I heard in a separate environment, but they sounded like an overly warm/colored HS5 with less detail but smoother treble and maybe better space & low extension - though that was probably just the room/setup.
 
I will say, that I think my AKG Q701's would be a great choice for professional work, as would their closed counterpart, the K550. That's kinda why I chose them. Even my LCD-2.2F's with Fazor could work, though the LCD-X's would be more reliable (and are growing popular with producers and engineers). There are quite a few good threads on cans for professional monitoring use you could check out.

 

[thecrow]

From the bits of research and testing I did on monitors and what you are saying sounds like the yamahas are spot on for you.

I can't remember exactly what but found the rokits not for me -maybe a little forced on some levels. Essentially over coloured I think. For my budget and tastes the jbls were a solid choice. I didn't try the yamaha 8s as over my budget. I think I mentioned before the 5s were lacking in dynamics that the jbls offered that had a nice colour for me

I'm loving the sound of the reviews of the b and o thus far and it will be interesting to see how these sit with me and to see a little bit better what I am actually and more accurately seeking. Il keep reading about the other options and finding places to try them

I have also looked at professional forums and needless to say there is a lot of open headphones there

 

[Rhamnetin]

The Fostex TH900 sounds more V-shaped than the M50 to me (never heard the M50X though).  This is something to consider.  You might want to have a look at the portable Beyerdynamic headphones.

 

[thecrow]

I'm quite curious to hear some top end cans. Curious to hear the calibre of sound form these, as I never have and also to hear what a shaped top end headphone sounds like and what that brings out and how everything sits. Totally uncharted waters that at this point, having not heard them yet, I can naively say that I'm not looking to spend anything around $1200 or so. Then again I wasn't looking too spend $500 2 months ago either. Nor $800 on the fiio x5' the sd cards and the amp

As I mentioned earlier a mate of mine does call the ath m50s the "gateway" headphone

I can't wait to listen to some premium mid priced headphones (plus more) to see what is available at what price and to see what these different shaped headphones bring to the table

 

[thecrow]

I managed to listen to the h6 in an Apple Store today. I have been hanging out for these since reading the write ups on these

I used them with my fiio x5 and the cayin c5 amp.

Broadly speaking i loved the clarity they exhibit. So many new things found in so many songs that I listened too. So many wow-wee moments. Eg listening to u2's daddys gonna pay for your crashed car I couldnt help but notice the siren like sounds of the drums early in that song (for the first time). And Peter Gabriel's "I love to be loved" starts with a bass line that I had no idea was so swamp that it made my guts wobbling in it as if it was hitting them from the inside. I had no idea of what that sound was supposed to be. And I have heard that song so many times!!!

The overall lows had a presence but for me were in no way forced or out of place.

However even with all these wow-wee feel good, bring a smile to your face, rock back in your chair moments.....there were also a few d'oh!!!! moments. I found the sound too airy times in that there was too much air between instruments. Maybe the soundscape had good width, too much air and not enough depth????

Certain high mids (I believe you'd call them) seemed like was lacking a little resonace that everything else had. Something sitting just off the snare drum. Perhaps higher tom sounds might be around the mark. ( I'm no expert but it was somewhere there). Some vocals too had some disjointed element too. In fact listening to the pointer sisters and clint black singing chain of fool shad me thinking thee were one or two too many pointer sisters ( higher end of vocals)

My steely dan filter allowed the h6 to get through but it was abit touch and go there as I had to adjust to the h6 sound but could accept it.

I guess these gives me a good reference point. Any ideas which way I could turn.

I wil follow up on a few other suggestion on posts above and also will curiously sus out the shure srh1540 as they have been recommended too

In a nut shell the clarity was great but a little too much instrument separation going on

 

[thecrow]

hi jodgey4
 
i have now gone down the path of open headphones to get the level of detail, soundstage/openess, clarity and neutral sound that i am after
 
today i heard the hd600 and hd650. i preferred the hd 600 (too much bass presence on the 650s). and for about $320 here in australia i found the detail and neutralness quite good and the soundstage quite ok. very easy listening. great with vocals up front and centre but not in your face too much.
 
i then heard the k702 and found them lacking colour for me and through my amp (cayin c5)
 
however my world has been turned upside down as i then listened to the he560s. this sounded essentially exactly everything that i seek. a little more isolation would have been a bonus though.
 
do you know how the he400i/he400/he500 compare to the 560s?
if you haven't heard the 560s am i looking in the right place for what i seek with these less expensive hifiman headphones?
 
 
on the cheaper end (such as the hd600) i am also planning to listen to the dt880 and unfortunately can't find anywhere to hear the fidelio x2 that i have been reading about 
i'm also hoping to listen to the focal spirit pros you suggested too in the closed hps and the sounscape hp150 you suggested looked very interesting but almost impossible to find here
 
cheers
peter t