[Jodet]

Is a $50,000 BMW better than a $25,000 Honda?   Probably.   I know some people who don't think so, though (one's a BMW owner, too).
 
But there is such a thing as 'pride of ownership'.   If it makes you happy to have high-quality cables, go ahead.   Be happy.   Life is short.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 

[ninjikiran]

There is an actual physical beauty in the $50K car though, ignoring any features it may have that the cheaper car does not have.
 
Based on thread discussion, you have two people buying the same car with different names. Difference, one person pays $50k, while the other $25k for almost nothing but the name.  Which in turn is different from buying a terrible $3000 car which probably will break down, or offer you horrible performance.
 
I agree with pride in ownership, though sometimes you have to question whether the price is worth the pride when there is much better things to spend on

" class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//wink.gif" title="

" width="" />.  Perhaps I am a social reject but I take more stock in performance than I do beauty.  Overpaying for the same performance is senseless in this situation.  The car situation is more open to interpretation since you have to factor in subjective appearance.
 
I don't have anything to really add to the argument I just thought I would fix your analogy a bit.
Quote:

Is a $50,000 BMW better than a $25,000 Honda?   Probably.   I know some people who don't think so, though (one's a BMW owner, too).
 
But there is such a thing as 'pride of ownership'.   If it makes you happy to have high-quality cables, go ahead.   Be happy.   Life is short.
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

 

[googleborg]

if i had golden ears i would sell them at cashforgold.com.
 
 

 

[Prog Rock Man]

 
Quote:

There is an actual physical beauty in the $50K car though, ignoring any features it may have that the cheaper car does not have.
 
Based on thread discussion, you have two people buying the same car with different names. Difference, one person pays $50k, while the other $25k for almost nothing but the name.  Which in turn is different from buying a terrible $3000 car which probably will break down, or offer you horrible performance.
 
I agree with pride in ownership, though sometimes you have to question whether the price is worth the pride when there is much better things to spend on

" width=" _cke_saved_src=" />" class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//wink.gif" title="

" class="bbcode_smiley" height="" src="http://files.head-fi.org/images/smilies//wink.gif" title="

" width="" />" width="" />.  Perhaps I am a social reject but I take more stock in performance than I do beauty.  Overpaying for the same performance is senseless in this situation.  The car situation is more open to interpretation since you have to factor in subjective appearance.
 
I don't have anything to really add to the argument I just thought I would fix your analogy a bit.

 

True, but if you have not been conned in any way and you know you are paying more for something that has an alternative that can do the same job for less, then fine.
 
No matter what the pro-cable side claim as the anti-cable motives, the real motive is pointing out that pro-cable claims are spurious and verge on the con merchant.

 

[ninjikiran]

Which is why I said its mostly pride, since imo you can't make a cable thats beauty.  The reason why you can't really  compare over paying for a car even if it performs similarly.
 
Though in terms of getting from point A to point B you run into the same argument as cables, and the less expensive car will get you from point A to point B at half the costs assuming they both share the same MPG.

 

[Young Spade]

Quote:

Which is why I said its mostly pride, since imo you can't make a cable thats beauty.  The reason why you can't really  compare over paying for a car even if it performs similarly.
 
Though in terms of getting from point A to point B you run into the same argument as cables, and the less expensive car will get you from point A to point B at half the costs assuming they both share the same MPG.

Yea it does get you there in half the price. However the luxury and comfort of that 30k car might be far greater than the 15k one. (Not trying to make a point, just throwing that out here). I think a lot of people wouldn't mind spending a little more for a better cable build wise; granted I'd buy the SE535 cable for any future IEMs if it was compatible. 

 

[beeman458]

if i had golden ears i would sell them at cashforgold.com.
 
Is that anything like; if you had a winning lottery ticket?
 
???

 

[aimlink]

Quote:

No matter what the pro-cable side claim as the anti-cable motives, the real motive is pointing out that pro-cable claims are spurious and verge on the con merchant.

Ok.  This seems to be the case, but if it's about a head-fier busying oneself to point out to others that they're being conned into buying something, then isn't that an amusing oxymoron in itself? 

 

[BIG POPPA]

Boy, the anti side is getting more speculative by the minute

. Where are these people who believe the way you do at all the meets I go too? Just because you may not be able to hear a difference with headphone cables doesn't not define your statement. Now my friend, where is your indisputable proof about these con merchants? It may just be the user, who is not completely intimate with their gear? There is a thought?
 
Quote:

No matter what the pro-cable side claim as the anti-cable motives, the real motive is pointing out that pro-cable claims are spurious and verge on the con merchant.

 

[beeman458]

BIG POPPA wrote:
 
It may just be the user, who is not completely intimate with their gear?
 
"I will not touch this line.  I will not touch this line.  I will not touch this line."
 

 

[Prog Rock Man]

 
Quote:

Boy, the anti side is getting more speculative by the minute

. Where are these people who believe the way you do at all the meets I go too? Just because you may not be able to hear a difference with headphone cables doesn't not define your statement. Now my friend, where is your indisputable proof about these con merchants? It may just be the user, who is not completely intimate with their gear? There is a thought?
 


 

The basis of the pro side is that the cable itself makes an audible difference and cable makers come out with all-sorts of reason as to how that is. Which includes reasons that contradict each other. That is fact. As a result of that the UK cable maker Russ Andrews has had to deal with a complaint made about its cable claims which caused an investigation by the Advertising Standards Agency. That resulted in RA having to back up their claim, which they did. They showed that there is RFI rejection with braided cable. They did not show a link between that and audibility. That to me benefits all as we now get a verifiable claim, not speculation. It also helps to stop claims that verge on the con merchant. What is wrong with cable claims bringing a bit of science and testing to back up what they say? Where is the harm?
 
The other main pro-cable claim is that "I can hear a difference, you cannot, so there must be an issue with you, your hearing or your kit". Fine and your evidence for that is?
 

 

[nick_charles]

Quote:

Boy, the anti side is getting more speculative by the minute

.
 
Please do not paint all cable skeptics with the same brush - some are just skeptical, personally if folks want to spend big bucks on cables or even the time to build their own that is their choice, stating however that such cables make big or even notable differences in sound quality is a matter of opinion and in other places is mostly left alone, making the same claims in this subforum is where it is legitimate to ask for better evidence than I hear a difference so it must be real.
 
I have read the ad copy of many many cable sites - some clearly (and even you must admit this) are out and out and irredeemable nonsense, others are half baked but sincere, others may be guided by solid scientific and engineering principles and others yet may be "let's see how much we can fleece people for" , actually in the end the motives and methods are largely irrelevant. What matters is whether or not there really is an audible difference, this is the case yet to be solidly proven.
 
 
Where are these people who believe the way you do at all the meets I go too?
 
I am going to indulge in a bit of speculaton, these are sighted tests ? Then we may see the influence of groupthink, cognitive dissonance and so on. Perhaps the audiences at meets are predisposed to believe that cables make a difference and thus experience that effect, I am just speculating here of course. One thing we do know for a fact is that pre-knowledge of what you are listening to basically compromises the chances of reliable subjective comparisons.
 
Just because you may not be able to hear a difference with headphone cables doesn't not define your statement. Now my friend, where is your indisputable proof about these con merchants?
 
It may just be the user, who is not completely intimate with their gear? There is a thought?
 

 


 

 

[Skoobs]

cables do make a difference. they definitely will slightly to greatly change the sound sig depending on how s----y the stock cable is. 
 
i think what is left to debate is whether a thousand dollar cable gets you a thousand dollars worth of sweet sound improvement, in which case people will believe whatever they want to believe, regardless of what some may say. 
 
and yes, nick_charles, i believe groupthink plays thie biggest role there.

 

[Prog Rock Man]

I think that the debate is as to whether the actually is a difference with cables, any cable.
 
How much you pay is a freedom of choice/economic issue that side tracks the basic point of whether cables, in themselves can or cannot affect sound.

 

[aimlink]

Quote:

I think that the debate is as to whether the actually is a difference with cables, any cable.
 
How much you pay is a freedom of choice/economic issue that side tracks the basic point of whether cables, in themselves can or cannot affect sound.

 
Yep.  The ability to focus on this central issue seems to be an elusive one.  But then again, if cables were sold at low prices and they were being recommended by others, then it wouldn't result in such emotional threads.  So, it would seem that this apparent side track is actually what these threads are about.