[perplex]

Start with a D70 and 18-70 off ebay. Spend the savings on a SB-800. When I got mine I couldn't believe how incredible the little beast is. You just point and shoot, it's that simple

 

[ServinginEcuador]

One thing to consider is just how much glass do you want to carry around? I went with the 18-200 VR and will top off the entire arsenal with a 12-24 f4. Nothing else needed at all for the shooting I do. I get superb shots from the 18-200 since the VR helps for handheld shots, and when I need something wider I'll switch over to the 12-24.

If money's an issue try a Sigma 10-20mm zoom.

FYI - consider that the D40 and D40x don't have focusing motors built into the body - so you have to make sure every lens you buy has the motor built into it instead.

Go to a store and pick-up all the cameras you're considering buying. Find something that fits your hand, is comfortable for shooting, and gives you a good grip. I found the D40 too small for my hands. Plus, with the D80 you can add a grip for a little more size to make holding the camera that much easier.

 

[tennisplyr3]

here are a couple links for comparisons...

DCRP Review: Nikon D40

DCRP Review: Nikon D80

cheers...

 

[bigshot]

The 18-200 VR lens is even more important to me than my camera body. I would rather have a D40 with that lens than a better body with any other lens.

See ya
Steve

 

[swaneon]

if this was me

either take your chance with a refurb d80 body or buy the 40x from some place like costco or wait for the ads.

 

[Iron_Dreamer]

Based on the comparison of the D200 I just got (similar viewfinder to D80), and the D70S I've had for a while (similar viewfinder to D40), the difference is quite significant, and nothing to scoff at, although I wouldn't make my decisions solely based on it. The lack of compatibility with non-AFS/HSM lenses is a big strike against the D40's in my book, as there are so many great lenses out there, why limit yourself to a handful?

 

[jterp7]

there was and still is huge debate about the importance of the AF screw system missing in the D40. The real question is if he's looking to just stick a 18-200VR on it..if thats the case then he doesn't need the ability to use AF lenses which are mostly primes. It does leave out the 35mm f2, the el cheapo 50mm 1.8 and the 50mm 1.4(which I have), which some would say allows for more creative shots. However, for someone just looking to get into DSLR's with a nice all in one zoom in a compact package, nothing beats the D40X + 18-200mm for size and versatility.

 

[Sherwood]

The D40 is every bit of the camera the D40x is. The larger megapixel count is, as has been said, only useful for two things:

Large, blown-up prints and cropping. Your money is better spent on lenses than bodies for a first time purchase. Lenses last forever. Get the 18-200 AF-S and a D40 body and start taking pictures. If you absolutely need support for lenses that Nikon will likely phase out, then buy a body with an internal motor. The D40x is only an upgrade on paper. You're better off getting a cheaper body and good lenses now, then wearing it out over the next 5-7 years until you buy a full frame body for a reasonable price.

Seriously. Get the 18-200 AF-S lens and whatever else fits your budget. The kit 18-55 + inexpensive 50-200 takes great pictures, but you ALWAYS wish you had the other lens on, and changing them takes up time you could be spending taking pictures.

Edit: You're also much better off with 2 2gb cards than one 4gb. Flash storage malfunctions occasionally -- why put all your eggs in one (more expensive) basket?

 

[yellafella321]

I went from a d70, to a d70s, to a d80, and now to the d300, and to be honest, I miss my d70s. A lot - to the point where I'm looking to buy another one. It's a really fantastic camera, and one of the best values out there. The camera is larger than the d80, so it fits better in my hand, and the feel is also much nicer. Although the LCD is a little bit smaller, they don't have the 3" LCD that the d300 has so at that point, there is no difference to me anymore - they're both small haha. AF on the d80 is better and the additional focus points are nice, but, for someone starting off, it would be better to learn to use the center focus and recompose, rather than messing with the additional focus points. CFvs SD, I like CF a lot more. The main reason why I like the d70s so much is just the different approach to NR and high ISO. Its hard to explain, on cameras such as the d80 or d200 or d40, or the d300 even, at high iso's, edges look like they're kind of destroyed and reconstructed in a pixelated manner, where as on the d70s, edges remain the same, you just lose some detail, and gain some noise. I personally would steer away from the d40. When you find yourself needing to use some f/2.8 glass, unless you can afford the Nikon 17-55, the Tamron 17-55 f/2.8 is by far the best choice, and will not work on your d40! Sigma has made an HSM model, but tamron's lens is still better. Additionally, this prevents you from using the 50mm f/1.8 and 85mm f/1.8 which are both gems, especially for the price. Hope this helps. I will say though, that I too am considering the d40 as my backup camera, but that is only because I already have the 17-55 f/2.8 DX, which is an AFS lens, although leaning not to, because it is so small, and after a day of shooting, my hand would be cramping and in tremendous pain.

Also, I'd really suggest starting with a 6mp camera to start as they are much more forgiving, and will allow you to get sharper images and allow you to build your technique. Its a lot harder to get a sharp image with a d80 than it is with a d70.

 

[Sherwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by yellafella321 /img/forum/go_quote.gif The main reason why I like the d70s so much is just the different approach to NR and high ISO. Its hard to explain, on cameras such as the d80 or d200 or d40, or the d300 even, at high iso's, edges look like they're kind of destroyed and reconstructed in a pixelated manner, where as on the d70s, edges remain the same, you just lose some detail, and gain some noise. Hope this helps.

Not to derail this thread, but if I'm not mistaken most Nikons have customizable Auto ISO settings. Perhaps I'm not fully understanding the problem, but wouldn't setting a lower ISO threshold / exposure time solve your problem? The D80 and the D70s are still limited to ISO 3200, right?

 

[yellafella321]

Well, if you shot at a lower iso, of course you would not have to worry about high-iso noise, but photography does not always happen outdoors, and in times of low lighting, you often have no choice but to shoot at iso 1600+.

The d70s and d80 are both rated to iso 1600. The d70s cannot go any higher, but the d80 can have a hi+1 to reach iso 3200.

 

[Sherwood]

The d40 also has a hi+ up to 3200, but that's not what I was intending to say. What I mean is that you can customize the camera's settings for when to bump up to a higher ISO. For instance, you can tell your Nikon that under low light, shoot at the lowest possible ISO until the shutter speed is above a certain point. That's what I intended by ISO threshold.

Maybe this doesn't solve your NR and ISO problems, but it's a feature worth pointing out.

 

[yellafella321]

Here are some samples. The image taken by the d80 was not taken by me, and is actually of me, so the focus is off a bit, but nevertheless, shows the d80's approach to High Iso Images. I know this isn't the best test, as they aren't all of the same subject, but I didn't actually own all three cameras at the same time.

D70S 100% Crop

D80 100% Crop

D70S resized

D80 resized

As you can see, when the images are resized, there is very little difference in noise or how they would print. Only upwards of 6X9 would I be worried, and the d70s images clean up a lot nicer in noise ninja.

Just in case you're curious, here is the d300 at iso 1600

 

[Gurra1980]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMarchingMule /img/forum/go_quote.gif So far, so good. Judging from this forum: D80 vs. D40x: Nikon D80/D70/D50/D40 Forum: Digital Photography Review It seems that compared to the D40x, the D80 has: The D80 is worth every extra penny...you get, over the D40x: - An in camera focus motor - A top LCD (you may not realize how much you will like this) - Exposure bracketing - More dedicated buttons for changing common settings - 9 more focus points (11 vs 3) - Wireless flash control - 2 Command dials - Better battery life - Better build quality - Option to use a battery grip - A slightly larger, more comfortable to hold (for most people) camera -Several things I'm probably forgetting Unless your obsessed with the D40x's slightly smaller frame, the D80 is the obvious choice. It's not that much more than the D40x and is significantly better. The weight difference is negligable, especially after you have a lens mounted and I think most people prefer the feel of a camera with a decent sized grip on it. Hope that helps, Mark (from: Re: D80 vs. D40x: Nikon D80/D70/D50/D40 Forum: Digital Photography Review) Also, where is a good place to shop for lenses? I realize having only the camera body isn't the most fun possible.

There is a lot more things on the D80 that is not on the D40x. For example it is a lot more customizable and here are some things: center focus area (the size can be changed), Grid lines, you can change ev step 0,3 or 0,5, sice of center-weighted messuring, flash shutter speed, Exp. delay mode (reduces shutter vibrations when you use a tripod), more funktions for the funk button. Also you can more precisely adjust the ISO, on D80 you can use 100,125,160,200,250,320,400,500,640,800,1000,1250, 1600, HI 0,3 HI 0,7 Hi 1 where on D40 it goes 100,200,400,800,1600, HI 1(3200)

I guess I forgot some things, but who cares.

 

[kugino]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sherwood /img/forum/go_quote.gif The d40 also has a hi+ up to 3200, but that's not what I was intending to say. What I mean is that you can customize the camera's settings for when to bump up to a higher ISO. For instance, you can tell your Nikon that under low light, shoot at the lowest possible ISO until the shutter speed is above a certain point. That's what I intended by ISO threshold. Maybe this doesn't solve your NR and ISO problems, but it's a feature worth pointing out.

i think the newer nikons indeed have this capability. my older d70, however, does not allow me to customize the auto ISO...at least i don't think i can.