[HeadphoneAddict]

Quote:

Originally Posted by HeadphoneAddict /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I suppose I'll be adding to the glut of Westone 3 threads when I post my mine entitled "REVIEW: Westone 3 Ultimate IEM vs the Losers..."

Okay - It is Done. The ultimate Westone 3 fan boi thread can be seen now:

http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f103/r...7/#post5070427

It's crazy how well the W3 have held up over the years, and even with all the new IEM that have come out the W3 have not become totally obsolete. Trying to figure out where my review photos went, after 7 years.

 

[OliverBB]

It's crazy how well the W3 have held up over the years, and even with all the new IEM that have come out the W3 have not become totally obsolete. Trying to figure out where my review photos went, after 7 years.

Cool-your original review was one of the reasons I decided to pick one up, finally

 

[159650]

Earphones like the W3, TF10 or IE8 won't really ever be obsolete. Yes, they will have succeeding models that can best them in a few ways, but the earphones themselves will never be edged out completely. What sound good will remain good and as long as you don't get too caught up on upgrading gears, then they remain quite fresh in my opinion. For example, I don't own a single newer generation top tier UIEM. I didn't get the UE900 when it came out, and held onto the TF10. I did sell my SE530 when the SE535 came out, but that was one of the most regrettable purchases I ever made and ended up returning the SE535 (sharp top end). The IE8 are marginally lacking compared to the IE80, but I couldn't justify upgrading to the IE80 when I did a rough calculation of potential losses. I've auditioned the UE900 and Westone W40 but honestly I never really felt that the cost to upgrade was worth it. To me the old top dogs that I do have, the TF10, W3 and IE8 still sound amazing and I'd never consider them to be obsolete. There are models of headphones that have been in production forever now, such as the Koss Portapros, Sony MDR7506, AKG K701-702 etc. They remain favored despite all the new stuff that's come out since. Bottom line, what sounds good will always sound good and that won't change. Just as long as we don't keep chasing new stuff just cause they're new. Another reason in my opinion is that the top tier stuff usually sound unique. I have not encountered a pair of main stream earphones be it 100 dollars or 200 that sound quite like the top tier stuff. 
 
So just keep enjoying. I for one am quite satisfied with my W3. 

 

[WhatToChoose]

The W3 were my first delve into +$100 IEMs (got them for $160). I have to admit, they do have a special characteristic sound that makes them stand out. They were very well detailed, with excellent bass, yet retaining clarity throughout the spectrum. Unfortunately, they weren't for me, since their signature was far too laid back, which bored me very easily. Nonetheless, they are an excellent option to those who like that kind of laid back sound.
 
I found the Noble 3Us to be similar to the W3s, but with a grander soundstage (more 3D), cleaner bass, and a mysteriously engaging sound. Though to be real, I don't there is any IEM that can best the Philips she3590 in price to performance ratio. These little buds never fail to impress me somehow....

 

[159650]

15 bucks? I think the KSC75 from Koss might best it at that price. Brainwavz Delta are pretty good as well. AWEI Q9 are astonishing for the money, since they only cost me 4.50 and they're made of real wood! then there are the Piston 3.0. I have a pair, but not sure what the fuss is about. I find them to be good, but not as engaging. However many consider them to be budget kings. If you can find certain pairs on deals they're very good. I got my Klipsch S3m for 12 dollars. Excellent for the price and nearly as comfortable as the W3. TTPOD T1E were excellent, with great big bassy sound. Really fun, at 35 or so. Excellent. One of the true budget kings in my opinion are Havi B3Pro1. There are new models out now, but I still consider the B3P1 to be excellent. I have two pairs, one as a spare since they are my go-to earphones for daily use. 
 
Lots out there. 

 

[WhatToChoose]

15 bucks? I think the KSC75 from Koss might best it at that price. Brainwavz Delta are pretty good as well. AWEI Q9 are astonishing for the money, since they only cost me 4.50 and they're made of real wood! then there are the Piston 3.0. I have a pair, but not sure what the fuss is about. I find them to be good, but not as engaging. However many consider them to be budget kings. If you can find certain pairs on deals they're very good. I got my Klipsch S3m for 12 dollars. Excellent for the price and nearly as comfortable as the W3. TTPOD T1E were excellent, with great big bassy sound. Really fun, at 35 or so. Excellent. One of the true budget kings in my opinion are Havi B3Pro1. There are new models out now, but I still consider the B3P1 to be excellent. I have two pairs, one as a spare since they are my go-to earphones for daily use. 

Lots out there. 

I love how I could actually get and try all those IEMs you pointed out, and still be under $100 pretty much haha. Ive always wanted to try the b3pro1s, since they have some sort of amazing soundstage, but that day is not today....T1Es were excellent for the 4 days I had them. Not sure how Klipsch would be, since I had the s4s and that was before I realized their sound was not very good. I just found that I am able to listen to the she3590s and not feel like their is a substantial lack of detail, which is pretty incredible.

Do you think that the b3pro1 is 4x as good as the philips btw?

 

[159650]

I have too tried the S4 and found them underwhelming. Of course, that's considering their price at 79.99 retail. The S3m are far less pretentious and cost under 15 if you buy them at the right time. The sound is slightly V shaped and actually performs quite well. B3P1 is not going to be 4x better than your SHE3590 since that's not how objects work. Even at substantially less than 100, the principle of diminished returns still apply, so while better, I'm sure it won't even be 2x better. Not to mention such quantification of SQ is quite impossible. The value of the B3P1 will only become apparent to you once you try them out for yourself. Are they worth the 60-70 dollars? In my opinion, absolutely. Otherwise, I wouldn't have purchased a 2nd pair as a spare a year after the first. I was quite convinced during the 1 year ownership that the B3P1 as a daily pair are quite possibly the best earphones ever made. The reason has little to do with SQ alone as my criteria for daily earphone are the following:
 
1. Price must be below 100 dollars. If I lose them, then I should be able to accept their loss and have access to replacements easily.
2. Comfort and fit. The shape of the B3P1 as I'm sure you've noticed are somewhat based on the IE8 and IE80 from Sennheiser. The shape is in fact a bit better on the B3P1 and are superbly comfortable.
3. Isolation - Very good with the right selection of tips
4. Durability - kevlar wires in a nice linguine form. To be frank the wiring is a bit odd, but they're still functional and well made
5. Looks - they look much pricier than they are!
 
Of course, SQ matters the most. That is a given. But all other things considered, most earphones don't meet my requirements because they typically cost over 100 to get the same level of performance. The shape is one which I am very familiar with since I own the IE8, and have no issue with fit or comfort. They're nearly expendable as they can easily be replaced. My earphones before the B3P1 were the quite well respected Sennheiser IE7 which I picked up for 85 dollars used. They're no longer available at that price and are irreplaceable so I ended up betting the B3P1. I owned both the TTPOD and although the TTPOD is the more fun earphone, the B3P1 is much closer to neutral and linear. The only major drawback of the B3P1 is their impedance. They need A LOT of power. Very close to full sized cans.

 

[WhatToChoose]

  I have too tried the S4 and found them underwhelming. Of course, that's considering their price at 79.99 retail. The S3m are far less pretentious and cost under 15 if you buy them at the right time. The sound is slightly V shaped and actually performs quite well. B3P1 is not going to be 4x better than your SHE3590 since that's not how objects work. Even at substantially less than 100, the principle of diminished returns still apply, so while better, I'm sure it won't even be 2x better. Not to mention such quantification of SQ is quite impossible. The value of the B3P1 will only become apparent to you once you try them out for yourself. Are they worth the 60-70 dollars? In my opinion, absolutely. Otherwise, I wouldn't have purchased a 2nd pair as a spare a year after the first. I was quite convinced during the 1 year ownership that the B3P1 as a daily pair are quite possibly the best earphones ever made. The reason has little to do with SQ alone as my criteria for daily earphone are the following:
 
1. Price must be below 100 dollars. If I lose them, then I should be able to accept their loss and have access to replacements easily.
2. Comfort and fit. The shape of the B3P1 as I'm sure you've noticed are somewhat based on the IE8 and IE80 from Sennheiser. The shape is in fact a bit better on the B3P1 and are superbly comfortable.
3. Isolation - Very good with the right selection of tips
4. Durability - kevlar wires in a nice linguine form. To be frank the wiring is a bit odd, but they're still functional and well made
5. Looks - they look much pricier than they are!
 
Of course, SQ matters the most. That is a given. But all other things considered, most earphones don't meet my requirements because they typically cost over 100 to get the same level of performance. The shape is one which I am very familiar with since I own the IE8, and have no issue with fit or comfort. They're nearly expendable as they can easily be replaced. My earphones before the B3P1 were the quite well respected Sennheiser IE7 which I picked up for 85 dollars used. They're no longer available at that price and are irreplaceable so I ended up betting the B3P1. I owned both the TTPOD and although the TTPOD is the more fun earphone, the B3P1 is much closer to neutral and linear. The only major drawback of the B3P1 is their impedance. They need A LOT of power. Very close to full sized cans.

 
Looks like the she3590s are still the best PtP ratio IEMs then! Though I have no doubt that the B3 Pro1s are extremely good. And with regards to scaling, the 4x question was with regard to price ($60 (Havi)/$15 (Philips)). It was more of: "Would paying 4x the price be worth the upgrade?" sort of question. But so many factors are subjective that this would pretty much be impossible to answer.
 
How is the bass on the B3Pro1s by the way? I heard it was thin to compensate for the soundstage, but since you actually own them perhaps you could give some insight?

 

[159650]

Well, the B3P1 is much more neutral and balanced and are certainly not bass earphones. They actually sound somewhat close to studio monitors and remain relatively flat. I would describe the sound overall as accurate, airy and clean. There is a hint of warmth to the sound. They typically don't dig too deep in the low region nor do they match the TF10 for treble but are capable. So I would say that if the bass note calls for deep lows, you get it (sort of). If not, then you don't. They can be a bit boring (at times). Although I wouldn't necessarily call them analytical, as I've said, they are neutral-ish so at time they can be lacking compared to the more laid back and warm sounding earphones like the Sennheisers. Yes, they have a more neutral flavor, but they're not as analytical as proper studio monitors. So they can be somewhat in between a studio and audiophile gear. Although I own superb bass gear such as the IE8 and Denon D5K, the B3P1 in my opinion has the perfect sound for their purpose. 
 
If bass is really your thing, and I suppose this being the W3 thread many of us appreciate good bass, the B3P2 might be more to your liking. The thing is that almost 95% of Havi buyers prefer the B3P1 over the P2 because word is that the P2 loses out on almost everything in the pursuit of added bass. 
 
If you get a chance to listen to the B3P1, then do it. They're pretty much my recommended pairs at 50-100. I know that there are quite a few exceptional pairs under 100 nowadays such as the Shure SE215, VSD 3S, Ostry, etc. Sadly I only own the SE215 and B3 and have never heard alone even seen the VSD3S or the Ostry KC06. If you like something more colored, the VSD3S is probably more up your alley. They're also easier to recommend (based on reviews) at 45 dollars. They have frequency coverage (deeper bass and higher treble) but do come at the cost of sibilance, although described as being more dynamic than the Havi. 
 
Here is a pretty good detailed review of the Havi, Ostry and VSD if you're interested. http://theheadphonelist.com/brief-impressions-vsonic-vsd3s-ostry-kc06-havi-b3-pro/
I am listening to my B3P1 as I write this and honestly, they're very good. Drawback - power hungry monsters, and will need an amplifier and of course, slightly thin sound. But I prefer the sound signature with the slightly forward mids and airy sound. The Havi have a very strong following here on headfi like the Ostry and VSD. 

 

[159650]

I bet you that the KSC75 can edge the Philips. Of course by design they're completely different as the KSC75 are open clip-on headphones. They don't exactly get a lot of head time, but they're sold at a street price of 10-15 and are pretty astounding for the money. In my opinion, they're better than the Koss Portapros. Heck there are even people who've swapped out the Portapro drivers with the KSC75 to get the fit of the Portapro but the sound of the KSC. 
 
And the Portapros are what? 45? Awesome deal!

 

[OliverBB]

So the Westone 3's came in however unfortunately no matter what tip I used from the rather big selection I could not get a good fit. I even tried a bunch that I have collected over time. These really need a deep fit and the W3's have a relatively short nozzle. Plus I just have a right ear that is tough to fit. 
 
I was just about to send them back when I stumbled upon an idea of putting on a small Etymotic triple flange on the IEM nozzle and then "snap" on a Sony Hybrid tip over the tiny first flange of the Ety tip. It worked! I eventually went back and glued the hybrid tip onto the Ety tip because it would fall off with normal use i think. I then cut the stem completely off so the IEM can get in a little further in the ear.
 
Now that I have the proper fit these things sound great. A bit overbearing on the bass at times but I'm fine with using EQ. Soundstage is great. Very musical.    
 
Anyone have experience pairing these with Hidizs ap100, Fiio X3II, or X5? $200-250 is about the budget I have for a DAP. 
 
Thanks

 

[159650]

Not sure if the Hidiz or the Fiio X5 would be acquirable for that price but if you are willing to stretch it a bit, maybe you can look at the DX90 as well. I own it and it's a fantastic player. Also, iBasso is soon to release the DX80 which is set to retail for 320 or so. Very competitive. Dual CS4398 DACs with crystal oscillators, dual micro sd port, large display. Really a lot of features. 

 

[OliverBB]

  Not sure if the Hidiz or the Fiio X5 would be acquirable for that price but if you are willing to stretch it a bit, maybe you can look at the DX90 as well. I own it and it's a fantastic player. Also, iBasso is soon to release the DX80 which is set to retail for 320 or so. Very competitive. Dual CS4398 DACs with crystal oscillators, dual micro sd port, large display. Really a lot of features. 

Thansk for the reply, Actually the ap100 is going for about $220 and the X5 (original) for about $260 both on Amazon. 
 
The DX80 certainly looks interesting, I had been looking at the DX90 which was a bit too pricey but the DX80 may fit the bill
 
edit-just looked at the DX80 in the dedicated thread-thing looks like a beauty!  

 

[159650]

Yes! there has been a lot of buzz lately over it. The specs are very impressive and although no one can say whether the DX80 will outperform the DX90 or not, one thing is for certain; the DX80 is a more refined product overall, sound quality aside. It takes much more than just sound engineers to produce a good DAP. You need the right kind of marketing knowledge, and a good understanding of how products develop. The DX80 in my opinion is a much more grown-up device than the DX90. That isn't to say that the DX80 is the better sounding device, but that in terms of UI, feel, quality or specs, the device is a nice step in the right direction. It is indeed a great looking thing, almost reminiscent of Astell and Kern players. The other players, all aside from the newer Fiio products tend to suffer from somewhat poor UI and performance when music is not the sole factor. I also own a Xuelin IHIFI770, which by the way is well within your budget but is let down by poor UI and ergonomics. The sound is good, but I wouldn't give the player a high rating based on all other things considered. The IHIFI800 is exactly in your budget I believe, and you can contact jdog if you wish to know more. It's one of Xuelin's more newer products so it could be worth a look. 

 

[macdonjh]

  So the Westone 3's came in however unfortunately no matter what tip I used from the rather big selection I could not get a good fit. I even tried a bunch that I have collected over time. These really need a deep fit and the W3's have a relatively short nozzle. Plus I just have a right ear that is tough to fit. 
 
I was just about to send them back when I stumbled upon an idea of putting on a small Etymotic triple flange on the IEM nozzle and then "snap" on a Sony Hybrid tip over the tiny first flange of the Ety tip. It worked! I eventually went back and glued the hybrid tip onto the Ety tip because it would fall off with normal use i think. I then cut the stem completely off so the IEM can get in a little further in the ear.
 
Now that I have the proper fit these things sound great. A bit overbearing on the bass at times but I'm fine with using EQ. Soundstage is great. Very musical.    
 
Anyone have experience pairing these with Hidizs ap100, Fiio X3II, or X5? $200-250 is about the budget I have for a DAP. 
 
Thanks

 
OK, I must be doing something differently than every other W3 user.  I was just going to post that after a couple of weeks of use, I think the bass of these IEMs is pretty lean.  My most recent, specific, example is Dream Theater's "Pull Me Under" was missing the thunder from the drum kit and the rumble from the bass.  Unlike OliverBB above, I'm able to get them inserted, at least a little way, into my ear canal so they're not just riding in my outer ear with a fat foam tip trying to seal against my outer ear.  I'm using an A&K Jr. directly, no amp.  I have on my to-do list to get a set of Comply P-series long tips to try to get more insertion depth (doesn't that sound dirty?), but haven't done that yet.  Anyone tried Spin Fit?
 
If that all seems reasonable to you guys, perhaps I'm a closet bass-head and need a recommendation for a different.  Boy I hope that's not true.  I always considered myself a fan of neutral gear.  I'd have to rethink my entire life philosophy.