[KevinJB]

I’m using Dan Clark headphones with my Mojo which I find a great pairing, what IEMs would you recommend with the Mojo, what IEMs do you use,
Kind regards
Kev

 

[Reactcore]

I’m using Dan Clark headphones with my Mojo which I find a great pairing, what IEMs would you recommend with the Mojo, what IEMs do you use,
Kind regards
Kev

If you like soundstage.. and dont mind non isolating earbuds.. you could try Toneking Tomahawks.

They share some of a HD800 signature.

And theyre cheap too under €40

 

[KevinJB]

Great to see a British HiFi still very much alive.
Kev

 

[Currawong]

As with any headphones, I'd seek out IEMs based upon the kind of music you listen to. Currently there seems to be a flood of cheap Chinese models out there. I think they are all trying to release the next "big hit" IEM. Since Campfire's Andromedas, nothing really has, and the flooded market has fairly killed any chance of that anyway.

 

[563236]

Great to see a British HiFi still very much alive.

God Bless British HiFi.

Since the Mojo is warm, I try to pair with a neutral CIEM / neutral cable combo. Warm + Warm + Warm doesn't compute.

John Franks was known to use a Studio Reference Monitor. I don't know if I can recommend it though as a new refresh of the Studio Reference Monitor should be released. It's been out since for almost as long as the Mojo. Lifecycle of Pro Monitors is pretty long.

Since he is a professional, very understandable he chosen this IEM. Audiophiles are another matter. But budget-wise, it's good value. Great value when they go on sale a few times a year.

https://www.headfonia.com/q-n-a-saturday-chord-electronics/2/

There are also similar Studio Reference IEMS out there that should match well with the Mojo @ around $1K. But if you have a higher budget... I myself is keeping an eye out on the Campfire Supermoon ($1500) because it's a Coherent Single Driver and Chord DACs love single driver coherency. But I'm also looking out for Status Symbol IEMs like the upcoming Subsonic Storm (next "big" hit @ $4500). But Studio Reference Monitor is always solid as that is what professionals, not Audiophiles use. I guess in a way like Dan Clark Stealth, HD800, etc. Since I'm in the Entertainment Capital and somewhat Music Capital of the world, if I'm working at Netflix, Disney, Capitol Records or even Death Row Records and I have a deadline, I'm using these for pro use. Personal enjoyment is more subjective.

John Franks:

https://www.moon-audio.com/chord-hugo/john-franks-profile.html

But I think something of this similar type of sound signature will pair well with the Mojo.

Planned obsolence purposes... With a Mojo2, it should pair well too. Depends on budget...

Here's the supposed next big thing:







Apparently neutral. Early impressions in the London 2022 impressions thread.

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/canjam-london-2022-impressions-thread.964309/#post-17071252

If your going to eventually end up in Chord Summit-Fi, it may be worth the wait.

https://subtonic.audio/pages/storm

Impression here of SuperMoon with Mojo2:

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/campfire-audio-supermoon.963024/post-16974141

You can probably pickup some of the advantages of single driver (no crossover) coherency versus multi-drivers with crossovers from the impressions. I don't know if single driver planar tech is mature enough to select over a Storm, but I like to keep an open mind and try not to listen with my wallet.

No official Storm thread yet, only early impressions on the London 2022 impressions thread.

 

[563236]

I have used and are using my old and trusted Noble K10U with both Mojo (OG) and CH2 with great synergy, there are much better iems out there today but these are quite neutral and not tireing after hours of use and can be bought for a bargain today…worth a listen

Solid choice. K10 is one of one the neutral ones. No need for FOTM (Flavor of the Month) or Status Symbol IEMs. It's extermely difficult to find this type of signature these days and all the better you got good value. Mojo and CH2 are already 5+years, so distrupting synergy not always optimal.

 

[563236]

I had a number of IEMs some 6 years ago - but I just couldn't get on with them. After an hour my jaw would ache. That said, the Noble Kaiser did sound very good.

Did you happen to get traditional custom moulds? There's a way to get digital laser impression moulds, not traditional invasive way where human errors can occur. I'm wondering if traditional moulds may cause aches, especially with the bite-down variance factor.

Sorry, I seem to have a habit of rambling on due to enjoying my Chord rig too much so shorten the post...

 

[Rob Watts]

Did you happen to get traditional custom moulds? There's a way to get digital laser impression moulds, not traditional invasive way where human errors can occur. I'm wondering if traditional moulds may cause aches, especially with the bite-down variance factor.

Sorry, I seem to have a habit of rambling on due to enjoying my Chord rig too much so shorten the post...

Yes they were custom with traditional moulds. The Audiologist later suggested to try without the bite down, but I haven't tried that. And since 2015 planer headphones have improved dramatically - the worries I used to have with LF distortion and depth perception don't apply any more, that's how much planer headphones have improved.

 

[563236]

Yes they were custom with traditional moulds. The Audiologist later suggested to try without the bite down, but I haven't tried that. And since 2015 planer headphones have improved dramatically - the worries I used to have with LF distortion and depth perception don't apply any more, that's how much planer headphones have improved.

I'm not a fan of the traditional Audiologist custom mould process. I refuse to go through this antiquated manual process no matter how much I want a CIEM.

What I was thinking was a long-term plan when it's convenient for you the next time you are in Irvine, California, USA. There's a expensive machine where you can get a digital impression via a laser scan for your ears. The machine is so expensive, only the resources of a billion dollar conglomerate (Logitech) can provide this service. There's a chance John Franks may have gone through this process.

The problem in the past is if you went through this digital process, you are tied down to purchasing a CIEM from them only going forward after the initial CIEM purchase. For my case, that is no longer the case. But I'm unsure if it's because I'm an long-term customer circa 2001, if I got lucky or if it's a new policy. But I'm pretty sure they can make an exception for you too if needed.

There's a standard file type called .STL. An .STL file encapsulates a scan of your ear so one can easily input for printing ear moulds. With digitial impressions, it stays native digital into the .STL file. With traditional ear moulds, there's a physical process where they 3D Scan the traditional ear moulds into a .STL file.

So to my surprise, when I requested .STL files they had no problem sending it over. I checked with other CIEM shops and the .STL files were approved. So this opens the door wide open to other CIEM options. I was hindered in the past because if I wanted another CIEM option, I had to go through the manual traditional process.

So take for example a few years down the road if you want a Planar CIEM, you can send in the .STL files of your hopefully near perfect digital impressions. I'm hoping Planar CIEMs become a thing. For now, the SuperMoon is a good start:



https://campfireaudio.com/shop/supermoon/

The only bottleneck I see is there's not a initial CIEM purchase I can recommend at this time. I'm waiting for them to refresh their industry standard Neutral Reference Studio Monitor. But since you are only in Irvine once a year, I'll keep an eye out for the refresh and hopefully it conicides with your yearly visit.

The CIEM and Planar CIEM is only a supplement to your goto Planar Headphones. But it will be a nice option to have going forward if the digital impressions go well.

CIEMs offer a different experience, so hope you exhaust all possiblities before you give up on them.

 

[563236]

I'll be back when a new Refresh is available. You can consider this digital impressions option when the stars align.

I'm only back temp because I couldn't help but appreciate the comment someone made on the London 2022 Impressions thread.

They mentioned they could not believe the difference clocks made when comparing the dCS Lina Stack against itself. To me, even though it's subtle, clocks are whole different experience with my Chord Stack. Mainly, it's fatigue-free, digital glare is gone, details galore, PrAT, etc. because timing errors at the source are completely eliminated so I feed the Chord DAC with a near perfect signal. I run near perfect measured clocks better than the dCS clocks. I run off-grid power better than car batteries.

I'm in the "The Right Bit @ the Wrong Time is the Wrong Bit" camp. So with near perfect clocks, the probability of timing errors are eliminated. That's why I can listen to one track 25 times in a row. I can listen to whole albums without getting 'triggered' to take a naviagation action. Whole different experience. Fatigue is a thing of the past because the brain doesn't have to process timing errors.

With the dCS Lina Stack being released, I can't help but liken it to my WFH Chord CIEM Stack. Even though I'm CIEM-only, I treat my chain with meticulous respect like a headphone chain. My whole chain is mOhms impedance, so as close to running the whole chain "bare metal" as possible. Honestly, I'll take my WFH Chord CIEM Stack every-time. I doubt nothing will be as this "modern" for years and years. Of course glass optical. Even ASR approves optical without even a single listening session, no-brainer. Everything else is just noise.

	WFH Chord CIEM Stack	dCS Lina Stack (Can even apply to AIO like DAPs, etc. minus the power section)
Clocks	Near Perfect Measurements [X]	OK, Typical Average Clocks, nothing special. Yawn.
DAC	Chord [X]	More AIO than pure focus on DAC.
Power	Off-Grid Dynamic, Low Impedance (mOhms) [X]	Mains, no ability to scale off-grid like Chord.
Operating System	Open-Source, 4ever update-able, realtime low-latency kernel, dedicated CPU cores exclusive to audio, ability to load entirely in RAM. [X]	Proprietary BS like all commercial Status Symbol solutions. Update maybe a few times and that's it, you are stuck with that for it's lifetime. Usually, no ability to load entire OS in RAM.
Playback Software	Open-Source, 4ever update-able, if the software you want is available, you should be able to implement. Scale software over time, even if a software is release five years from now. Real Summit-Fi Software. I also playback from dedicated RAM.[X]	Proprietary BS like all commercial Status Symbol solutions. Stuck with software that will stop updating at some point. Stuck for it's lifetime with zero updates. Usually not considered Summit-Fi Software. It's okay, average. Usually, no RAM playback ability.
Amplifier	Non-traditional. As close to listening straight out of the DAC as possible. Highest Resolution and Transparency with zero distortion and colouring. [X]	Traditional. I would never use Traditional Amplification.
CIEM Output	RCA. With RCA, you have the ability to scale to WBT. World of difference with speaker-like attributes. [X]	Traditional and Amplified. No way I'm ever going back to amplified for CIEM-use.

Anyways, this was a COVID-19 project, so it's time to move on and not think about this stuff ever again. I'm going to focus on a nice transducer and of course the Hugo₃ going forward. Please keep RCA Output on Hugo₃.

Many thanks for your teachings here on this thread. It helped inspire me to build something better than a car battery because car batteries are not too practical. When I decided to visit the Audiologist in Beverly Hills back in 2001, I never thought I could experience this level of enjoyment. With CIEMs the most progressive technology-wise, it's going to be fun going forward. It would take 6 digits to reach this level in the speaker world. Compared to the dCS Lina stack, I'm in at a fraction. Not listening with your wallet is a good take away from this thread. That's a great story you met John Franks @ CES. I miss all the free expensive software they give away @CES.

I'm out (again).

 

[Reactcore]

Hello @Rob Watts

Now that youre longer and deeper into Mscaled listening..

Are you developing different listening test styles/abillities ..eg focussing on other aspects of the sound?

Its just fun to be pointed to things to listen for which i didnt noticed

 

[Rob Watts]

Hello @Rob Watts

Now that youre longer and deeper into Mscaled listening..

Are you developing different listening test styles/abillities ..eg focussing on other aspects of the sound?

Its just fun to be pointed to things to listen for which i didnt noticed

Not really - I have built up an extensive tool kit to cover different aspects of sound quality, and any change using AB listening tests I will run through a number of tracks that I use to test certain parameters. Oddly enough I was doing a video last Thursday - and I recalled a recent video when I was asked what tracks I used for listening tests and my mind went completely blank. So to prevent that I complied a simplified list of my tracks, and here are my notes:

1. Nora Jones, Cold cold heart, Come Away with me album, track 3.

Inst separation and focus, bass pitch reproduction on the double bass.

Youtube here

2. Pictures at an exhibition, arranged by J V A Guillou, 1.Gnomus, track 2. Dorian Records

Depth of soundstage and bass pitch reproduction

Youtube here

3. O Tu Suavissima Virga, Hildegard Von Bingen, Vox Cosmica album, track 1.

Timbre variation, clarity

Youtube here

4. Journey Sequence, Max Richter, Ad Astra, track 8

Depth

Youtube here

5. Guitar Sonata in B minor, Matiegka: Complete music for solo guitar. Brilliant Classics.

Instrument separation and focus, starting and stopping of notes, clarity.

You can hear it here

6. Ransom notes, Sohn, Tremors album, track 5.

Depth - interesting track as the starting instrument is loud, with power and bass but with great depth.

Youtube here

Note - the actual tracks sound way better than on these compressed versions.

Now these tracks are only used for AB testing, when I am listening to very small differences - so for example I might want to listen to the sound of a 330dB noise shaper against a 350 dB noise shaper. In this case, it will affect depth perception (by depth I always mean how far away an instrument sounds). So I would use tracks 2,4 and 6. And listen backwards and forwards many times, just using the first 10 seconds. Normally, it will hit you immediately, with the exaggerated impression of one sounding deep, the other flat as a pancake. But when the effects are really small, then you need to go backwards and forwards many times to get a consistent and accurate view. Sometimes there is no difference, or it's a random preference - then you know you have stopped hearing changes.

Experience counts for a great deal. So when optimising the WTA1 algorithm (44.1 to 705kHz say) then all the above tracks need to be listened too, as everything is affected - so you need to check out for instrument separation and focus (being able to perceive individual instruments with power separately, focus is checking that quiet instruments are not disappearing by loud ones, timbre variation (bright instruments getting brighter, warm instruments darker or warmer), bass pitch reproduction (can you follow the tune), starting and stopping of notes (perceiving the initial pluck of a guitar string - getting sharp edges to be sharp).

Something that has become more important to me recently is best described by the term clarity. This is coupled with starting and stopping of notes, and applies with filters above 16FS to 104MHz. I use the term clarity, as I can't bare transparency - people use the term transparency because details are falsely exaggerated, and things sound etched and bright. Clarity is different, in that edges are better defined, without it sounding overly bright - it just sounds clear. And a lot of tests I have been doing over the past 2 years I have seen this aspect a lot.

Now these tests are perfect for very subtle changes, but they won't tell you if it's more musically enjoyable. Also, they don't tell you the scale of the changes - a tiny improvement in depth say, can be confused for a huge change, when actually it's just a bit better. For musicality testing, I need to finish and perfect the module I would have been testing, then employ it and just listen normally - if it's more emotional and musically you know you are onto a winner. You can then appreciate the scale of the change - if after a day you have gotten used to the improvement, then it's a small change. If after 3 months you are still hearing improvements then you know it's something huge and important.

 

[bobnewboy]

Hildegard Von Bingen - what a voice! Even in the ‘Bardcore’, more fun type of songs that she’s recorded that voice is clear with good range and great diction and enunciation.

 

[Triode User]

Hildegard Von Bingen - what a voice! Even in the ‘Bardcore’, more fun type of songs that she’s recorded that voice is clear with good range and great diction and enunciation.

Hilegard Von Bingen was born in 1098. I guess it is just a well preserved recording!

We always mishear her name on Radio 3 because we live near a place called Bingham and so we hear her name as Hildegard of Bingham!

 

[miketlse]

Hilegard Von Bingen was born in 1098. I guess it is just a well preserved recording!

We always mishear her name on Radio 3 because we live near a place called Bingham and so we hear her name as Hildegard of Bingham!

Glad to hear it is not an East Midlands pronunciation of Birmingham.