[Rob Watts]

The Relics I copied to my mobile was the 1996 version. I actually haven't compared it to the original.

 

[bhobba]

Hi Guys

Been through some interesting times last couple of weeks. My normal store did not stock Chord gear so I went to another retailer I know, but then I heard pretty close to the final version of my new speakers and they will be costing even more than the maker thought because he also needs to build a uber stand. To ensue I do not run out of money I reluctantly had to cancel my order. Then my normal retailer contacted me and said he can get the Chord stuff in and I can fix him up money wise when I fully pay for the new speakers - I have already paid a lot of the cost of the new speakers - so great - I can get TT2 and M-Scaler.

They arrived, but the guy at my normal store is really busy so the technician I know who works up the road picked it up. He will build the initial cables etc. As a normal DA he was MIGHTY impressed - his exact words - very sweet.. He didn't try the M-Scaler because he needs a pair of BNC connectors (some may already be in the M-Scaler box - he hasn't opened the box yet). He wasn't connecting to the speakers direct yet - he wants build a 4A power supply before trying that (see below)..

Interestingly he tried a power supply he makes (it does 1 amp) and thought it better. Strange - he has read all of what Rob has written about the power supply and could not figure out why. Anyway he contacted me and asked would it be OK to build a 4A one - I said OK so we will see. Will try one on the M-Scaler as well.

A couple of issues for Rob:

1. He uses an Aurilac Aries as a source and at first just got junk out of it. He shut it down then started it up and it seemed to work OK.

2. Where are the huge capacitors in the TT2 - in the DAC case or the SWPS you plug into it? If its in the SWPS then my tech is really scratching his head - it should not have made the difference he heard - they should have stopped any hash from the SWPS - if its in the DAC itself then there may be some SWPS hash may radiating in the case.

Altogether very encouraging and interesting. But the tech has to find time from his normal work to build the cables - so more to come when cables built etc.

Thanks
Bill

 

[Rob Watts]

The supercaps are in the TT2. I wouldn't bother with another PSU as disconnecting the supplied PSU (for 10 seconds) produces no audible change. Linear PSUs generally do not have the RF filters built into SMPS and so normally sound brighter with the illusion of more transparency - but they are actually worse, and measure a lot worse due to lots more LF noise and magnetic noise, with higher leakage currents. The PSU I use has been selected, and measures identically to a battery supply using high bandwidth measurements.

 

[Triode User]

Hi Guys

Been through some interesting times last couple of weeks. My normal store did not stock Chord gear so I went to another retailer I know, but then I heard pretty close to the final version of my new speakers and they will be costing even more than the maker thought because he also needs to build a uber stand. To ensue I do not run out of money I reluctantly had to cancel my order. Then my normal retailer contacted me and said he can get the Chord stuff in and I can fix him up money wise when I fully pay for the new speakers - I have already paid a lot of the cost of the new speakers - so great - I can get TT2 and M-Scaler.

They arrived, but the guy at my normal store is really busy so the technician I know who works up the road picked it up. He will build the initial cables etc. As a normal DA he was MIGHTY impressed - his exact words - very sweet.. He didn't try the M-Scaler because he needs a pair of BNC connectors (some may already be in the M-Scaler box - he hasn't opened the box yet). He wasn't connecting to the speakers direct yet - he wants build a 4A power supply before trying that (see below)..

Interestingly he tried a power supply he makes (it does 1 amp) and thought it better. Strange - he has read all of what Rob has written about the power supply and could not figure out why. Anyway he contacted me and asked would it be OK to build a 4A one - I said OK so we will see. Will try one on the M-Scaler as well.

A couple of issues for Rob:

1. He uses an Aurilac Aries as a source and at first just got junk out of it. He shut it down then started it up and it seemed to work OK.

2. Where are the huge captivators in the TT2 - in the DAC case or the SWPS you plug into it? If its in the SWPS then my tech is really scratching his head - it should not have made the difference he heard - they should have stopped any hash from the SWPS - if its in the DAC itself then there may be some SWPS hash may radiating in the case.

Altogether very encouraging and interesting. But the tech has to find time from his normal work to build the cables - so more to come when cables built etc.

Thanks
Bill

Hmmn, maybe slightly concerning that the 'tech' is asking questions such as these.

The supercapacitors are in the TT2 itself. The outboard power supply charges them up with a relatively low current supply.

As has been discussed in here many times, be wary of 'better' sounds from swopping power supplies and the like. In a device such as HMS and TT2 better will normally be a darker or a less bright sound. Increased 'soundstage' or 'detail' could just be RF artifacts from increased RF noise.

Edit, Mr RW beat me to it.

 

[bhobba]

Thanks for that Rob and Trode user. Will be carefully listening with some very experienced Audiophiles and soon get to the bottom of it. Will try the discontenting thing.

Yes - many times I have seen something that measures better not sound as good - this is strange stuff. Here is the exact words he wrote:
Mainly a bit more air & separation around instruments & vocals plus the resolution also seemed to increase. Now this is just my opinion & certainly not blind tested.

As I said he has no idea why - it simply should not happen with that amount of capacitance.

I chatted to him and it was just sort of off the cuff comments - the real test will be as Rob said - disconnecting the PS and see what happens.

Thanks
Bill

 

[Rob Watts]

That to me sounds exactly like the false transparency one gets with more noise floor modulation from RF noise...

 

[bhobba]

That to me sounds exactly like the false transparency one gets with more noise floor modulation from RF noise...

My spidy sense tells me that's probably correct. That's the problem with judging by ear - it may sound better - but really is it? Or even does it matter?

Anyway interesting to see what eventuates.

Thanks
Bill

 

[Babysnake]

Hi Rob

A question if I may?

I am a very happy DAVE/Blu2 owner and must take this opportunity to thank you for your engineering skill and efforts in bringing such astonishingly good products to market. However, like many of those posting on this and other similar fora, I am an incurable tinkerer, constantly adding and subtracting cables and assorted boxes in an attempt to reach the mythical Land of Audio Nirvana

In said pursuit I was reading elsewhere (https://www.head-fi.org/showcase/chord-blu-mk-ii-digital-cd-transport.22848/reviews#review-19675) detailed listening tests and comments regarding the problem of RF interference in the signal chain, specifically the benefits of scrupulous "RF hygiene" for the USB input to the Blu2 and digital coax connection between the Blu2 and DAVE

My (multi part) question is then:


1
Do you accept the comments made regarding RF sensitivity of the Blu2/DAVE combo?

2
Is the suggested solution (multiple ferrite chokes on the USB and coax cables) likely to be effective from an engineering PoV?

3
If the answer to 2) is 'yes', are there any downsides to this approach?

4
Are there any alternative strategies for achieving this goal (assuming it is indeed desirable)?

5 (finally!)
Why are 2m coax interconnects preferable (again the post above suggests this recommendation stems from your good self)


My own experience (FWIW) is that my distinctly low-fi Supra USB cable markedly outperforms various 'audiophile' models I have used (Supra >>> Triode Labs > Curious) which *may* be related to RF rejection characteristics, who knows?

Best wishes

Neill

 

[bhobba]

Hi All

Well I will be struck dumbfounded. Rob is 100% correct. My tech took the measurement - the supplied SWPS is exactly as Rob said it was. He tried the disconnecting test - no difference. My tech put it through every instrument he had and it is exactly as Rob said - flat - the same as a battery. Even when power is removed a light connected to the SWPS took a while to dim - this is one special supply. He put his power supply through the same tests - there was a very small residual. Yes - Rob hit it with hole in one - its exactly as he said - 'That to me sounds exactly like the false transparency one gets with more noise floor modulation from RF noise'. My tech has never seen a SWPS like this - every SWPS used in Audio equipment he has measured were full of high frequency hash. The first one I saw was when I took my Off-Ramp down to his shop and the maker Steve Nugent said it had a very good SWPS - considering his engineering background we though he was right - but for a laugh my tech put it on the oscilloscope and it was full of hash. We looked at each other - he said you want me to build a linear supply - and I just nodded. It made a huge difference. Every device I have that uses a SWPS (eg the Uptone Regen) I have replaced with a linear supply and the difference was clearly audible. My tech is kept busy building supplies all the time - he gets at least two orders a day.

The SWPS Rob uses though is simply in another league - all I can say is I tip my hat to Rob - never before have I or my tech have seen a SWPS like this. My tech hopes other manufactures don't figure out how you do it otherwise his orders will decline rapidly.

Rating out of 10 - 11 - its that good.

Simply amazing.

Its Christmas time so my acquaintances are a bit busy - but in the new year will talk to my dealer who does GTG's every now and then. We will have a (hopefully) blind test of the TT2 with M-Scaler vs a number of other DAC's such as the Direct Stream and Gradinote with and without the linear supply. Regardless of the result at the end will reveal the SWPS tests and that it is better than the linear supply.

It should prove interesting and educational. If Rob wants to come on out for it he is most welcome - as is anyone reading this. It will be on the Gold Coast here in Australia so you can combine it with a holiday if desired.

Thanks
Bill

 

[514077]

Hi All

Well I will be struck dumbfounded. Rob is 100% correct. My tech took the measurement - the supplied SWPS is exactly as Rob said it was. He tried the disconnecting test - no difference. My tech put it through every instrument he had and it is exactly as Rob said - flat - the same as a battery. Even when power is removed a light connected to the SWPS took a while to dim - this is one special supply. He put his power supply through the same tests - there was a very small residual. Yes - Rob hit it with hole in one - its exactly as he said - 'That to me sounds exactly like the false transparency one gets with more noise floor modulation from RF noise'. My tech has never seen a SWPS like this - every SWPS used in Audio equipment he has measured were full of high frequency hash. The first one I saw was when I took my Off-Ramp down to his shop and the maker Steve Nugent said it had a very good SWPS - considering his engineering background we though he was right - but for a laugh my tech put it on the oscilloscope and it was full of hash. We looked at each other - he said you want me to build a linear supply - and I just nodded. It made a huge difference. Every device I have that uses a SWPS (eg the Uptone Regen) I have replaced with a linear supply and the difference was clearly audible. My tech is kept busy building supplies all the time - he gets at least two orders a day.

The SWPS Rob uses though is simply in another league - all I can say is I tip my hat to Rob - never before have I or my tech have seen a SWPS like this. My tech hopes other manufactures don't figure out how you do it otherwise his orders will decline rapidly.

Rating out of 10 - 11 - its that good.

Simply amazing.

Its Christmas time so my acquaintances are a bit busy - but in the new year will talk to my dealer who does GTG's every now and then. We will have a (hopefully) blind test of the TT2 with M-Scaler vs a number of other DAC's such as the Direct Stream and Gradinote with and without the linear supply. Regardless of the result at the end will reveal the SWPS tests and that it is better than the linear supply.

It should prove interesting and educational. If Rob wants to come on out for it he is most welcome - as is anyone reading this. It will be on the Gold Coast here in Australia so you can combine it with a holiday if desired.

Thanks
Bill

I'll be curious about your listening tests against the DS, as the Watts and Ted Smith design concepts are antithetical: RW in the PCM domain, and TS in the DSD one. I hope you'll consider reporting your results to us.

 

[bhobba]

I'll be curious about your listening tests against the DS, as the Watts and Ted Smith design concepts are antithetical: RW in the PCM domain, and TS in the DSD one. I hope you'll consider reporting your results to us.

Of course. But since it's getting close to Christmas likely early next year sometime. Actually I do not think the DS will be the strongest competitor - a few DAC's likely to be there have bested it in careful listening tests.

Thanks
Bill

 

[ray-dude]

Hi Rob

A question if I may?

Rob will of course respond on his own, but here are some links for when he's discussed these topics in the past (in fact, these posts were the input into the experiments that I documented in my crazy long review)

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cho...-official-thread.831343/page-87#post-13696537
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chord-electronics-dave.766517/page-627#post-13881243
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chord-electronics-dave.766517/page-627#post-13882837

Please note: all these discussions (and my tests) were with a Blu2. Rob incorporated additional RF management into the Hugo mScaler, informed by these observations. I'm looking forward to getting my HMS soon, so I can compare with the Blu2.

The RF hygiene I discussed is audible, but it is VERY minor impact compared to the remarkable impact of the mScaler itself (I consider the mScaler as important a transformation in music as the advent of the CD...it makes things audible that you'd never be able to hear before)

Ray

 

[Babysnake]

Rob will of course respond on his own, but here are some links for when he's discussed these topics in the past (in fact, these posts were the input into the experiments that I documented in my crazy long review)

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/cho...-official-thread.831343/page-87#post-13696537
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chord-electronics-dave.766517/page-627#post-13881243
https://www.head-fi.org/threads/chord-electronics-dave.766517/page-627#post-13882837

Please note: all these discussions (and my tests) were with a Blu2. Rob incorporated additional RF management into the Hugo mScaler, based on these various learnings. I'm looking forward to getting my HMS soon, so I can compare with the Blu2.

The RF hygiene I discussed is audible, but it is VERY minor impact compared to the remarkable impact of the mScaler itself (I consider the mScaler as important a transformation in music as the advent of the CD...it makes things audible that you'd never be able to hear before)

Ray

Thanks for those Ray, most kind

2m BNC cables and assorted ferrites on order !

 

[musickid]

Will your blu2 headphone results be done soon?? Looking forward to it.

 

[514077]

Of course. But since it's getting close to Christmas likely early next year sometime. Actually I do not think the DS will be the strongest competitor - a few DAC's likely to be there have bested it in careful listening tests.

Thanks
Bill

Thought it might be the case. Paul from PS podcasts, tends to sound like sunshine and emotion every day. Which is why I look forward to your reviews.