[Eee Pee]

How can you recommend a TT that isn't even released yet?

 

[Skyliner]

Guys the best thing you can do to ensure correct alignment is get a bespoke protractor for your table/arm combination. The MintLP best tractor is the go. I faffed around with test records/dual trace audio CRO, USB microscopes, fozgometer etc etc but the MintLP nails it every time. 3150Hz test track on test LP's is useful for setting speeds accurately and silent tracks are useful for isolating unwanted noise/rumble and such, but the rest of them are really only useful for tweaking studio equipment i.e fully adjustable RIAA's and cutterheads.
 
Best $110 a vinylista will spend.
 
http://mintlp.com/best.htm
 
No affiliation, I just love this simple no BS product that works every time.

 

[analogsurviver]

  How can you recommend a TT that isn't even released yet?

It has to go trough some reviews of course - but it does not seem to be flawed "from the plane". They have included the necesarry - no frills - but what it is does look solid enough. Vintage Onkyo tables were not slouches either.
 
If absolute accuracy/precision is absolutely required, there is at least one EUR 500.000,00 machine out there... - but for the reasonably priced budget TT I would not dismiss the Onkyo - in the $600 or so arena. I am looking forward to reviews and comparisons with similarly priced well established belt drive suspects. 
 
Onkyo might be "less" known name, but they are ANYTHING but run of the mill - either in decision of components they (used to ) build or their quality first,  price second but  also usually bordering on best buy. Remember, they were the first of the "mainstream" manufacturers offering a dedicated headphone amplifier, their 9090 tuner is still highly sought after, they did build one of the - at the very least - Top 10 turntables of all time ( with the likes of Linn being not even represented in this rarefied field ) , etc - in short, if they put the 2 and two together right, their new DD TT does stand a chance of having "the right stuff". 
 
Time will tell - but again, I really doubt they did not weigh their options extremely carefully and came up with cost efficient design. That they can build at SOTA levels has been proven decades ago. With all that experience from the past it should not be difficult for them at all.

 

[Eee Pee]

  Onkyo might be "less" known name, 

 
Not really, and at this point in anyone's manufacturing career, I can't put it passed any of them to put out cheaper mediocrity.

 

[RUMAY408]

  Guys the best thing you can do to ensure correct alignment is get a bespoke protractor for your table/arm combination. The MintLP best tractor is the go. I faffed around with test records/dual trace audio CRO, USB microscopes, fozgometer etc etc but the MintLP nails it every time. 3150Hz test track on test LP's is useful for setting speeds accurately and silent tracks are useful for isolating unwanted noise/rumble and such, but the rest of them are really only useful for tweaking studio equipment i.e fully adjustable RIAA's and cutterheads.
 
Best $110 a vinylista will spend.
 
http://mintlp.com/best.htm
 
No affiliation, I just love this simple no BS product that works every time.

Very interesting, the downloaded protractors off vinyl engine are obviously free, but I never feel that my alignment is ever more than a good guess.
Getting the right needle weight is easy enough with the Project stylus force gauge.

 

[TeskR]

  Well, if you are prepared to wait a bit for the just released Onkyo DD TT, it may just be the ticket.
 
I could not fail to notice that Down Under quality vintage analog is comparatively pricey - but consider yourself lucky for not being in South America - whenever looking for some rare stuff, I usually end up on Mercato Libre & $imilar $ites - yike$!  
 
Although nothing special, this CEC built table might also be worth considering http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Vintage-Audio-Reflex-AGS-MR-110-Turntable-Record-Player-LP-Made-in-Japan-/181636423655?pt=AU_Electronics_Vintage_Electronics&hash=item2a4a5fdfe7

Thanks for the suggestion I noticed that was coming out, however there is only one importer in Aus for Onkyo as far as I know and I can imagine they are going to apply the 'Australia Tax' liberally.
 
I really don't know much about whats quality in the Vintage TT world, I'm basically looking for something that is quiet enough to be able to listen to often using headphones, as this will be how its used often. I guess I am kind of leaning towards a Project Debut Carbon (DC) as it will have a warranty and should be fairly quiet?
 
Thanks for your help, the more knowledge the better.
 
Edit: Is there any standout vintage TTs I should keep an eye out for on ebay?
 
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Sony-PS-1100-Turntable-/141541133527?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item20f4824cd7#shpCntId
 
This TT is near my house so i wouldnt have to postage, is 170USD too much for that?

 

[Skyliner]

Hi TeskR,
 
The Denon DP series of direct drives are good, and sold well thus are readily available. Micro Seiki belt drives are good. Some of the Technics are good, some not, same with Pioneer. There are good and not so good Toshiba and JVC units as well.
These are the used ones I would be looking for in your price range. Also I would look to Stereonet over eBay. You will find much keener prices for the same items there.

 

[TeskR]

  Hi TeskR,
 
The Denon DP series of direct drives are good, and sold well thus are readily available. Micro Seiki belt drives are good. Some of the Technics are good, some not, same with Pioneer. There are good and not so good Toshiba and JVC units as well.
These are the used ones I would be looking for in your price range. Also I would look to Stereonet over eBay. You will find much keener prices for the same items there.

 
Thanks for the reply, is any Vintage stuff from sony any good?
 
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/VINTAGE-SONY-PS-5100-AUDIOPHILE-QUALITY-TURNTABLE-RECORD-PLAYER-NEAR-MINT-/281556319808?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item418e107e40
 
This looks a bit pricey but the included video of the SQ is fairly impressive i think?

 

[Skyliner]

Good places to check if there's any vintage gear pedigree rather than seller BS is:
 
http://www.thevintageknob.org/
and
www.vinylengine.com
 
Personally I would get a Denon or Micro for that sort of coin...
 
Unfortunately people associate vintage with good. There was just as much "looks good - is crap" in the 60's - 80's as there is now. So I wouldn't rush into this. Do some homework, get a shortlist, audition and keep looking. I have owned maybe 12 or more turntables to reach the point where there will be no further upgrades. Cartridges & tonearms are another story...

 

[TeskR]

Cool, thanks for the help mate I will keep looking over the next little while and see if i can snag a good deal.

 

[analogsurviver]

 
Thanks for the suggestion I noticed that was coming out, however there is only one importer in Aus for Onkyo as far as I know and I can imagine they are going to apply the 'Australia Tax' liberally.
 
I really don't know much about whats quality in the Vintage TT world, I'm basically looking for something that is quiet enough to be able to listen to often using headphones, as this will be how its used often. I guess I am kind of leaning towards a Project Debut Carbon (DC) as it will have a warranty and should be fairly quiet?
 
Thanks for your help, the more knowledge the better.
 
Edit: Is there any standout vintage TTs I should keep an eye out for on ebay?
 
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Sony-PS-1100-Turntable-/141541133527?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_15&hash=item20f4824cd7#shpCntId
 
This TT is near my house so i wouldnt have to postage, is 170USD too much for that?

Both the Audio Reflex and Sony unit are approximately equal - they were made to last, they are solid. I posted a photo of my very early model Audio Reflex in "pictures" thread - and it really is built like a tank. The arm on the one from my link is light years better than on my unit.
 
Due to the pricing on vintage in AU ( rare>expensive ), that Project Debut Carbon DC is also not a bad idea. Waiting for something really good to show up for sale at low price in your neck of wood would really prove to be an exercise in patience - good luck!

 

[MisterMoJo]

 
Very interesting, the downloaded protractors off vinyl engine are obviously free, but I never feel that my alignment is ever more than a good guess.
Getting the right needle weight is easy enough with the Project stylus force gauge.

Yes, as a struggling "aligner" right now, I would say a good protractor that works for you is paramount.

 

[Skylab]

Another reminder that the easiest "protractor" I have ever seen is the Mobile Fidelity Geodisc. Incredibly easy to use, and gets plenty close enough for most setups. For my Denon it was spot on.

 

[MisterMoJo]

Another reminder that the easiest "protractor" I have ever seen is the Mobile Fidelity Geodisc. Incredibly easy to use, and gets plenty close enough for most setups. For my Denon it was spot on.

Have you found single point protractors to be as accurate as two point-ers?

 

[Skylab]

Are they as accurate? No. But the difference in terms of ease of use is significant, and as such, it's much better to use a Geodisc than to just eyeball the alignment