Didn't you prefer the regular 009 above the 009S? Yes agree the gaming experience with my 009 is just incredible.
As you still own both for the moment i'm curious to ask, what exactly do you prefer the 009S vs 009 in games?
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As you still own both for the moment i'm curious to ask, what exactly do you prefer the 009S vs 009 in games?
After doing some A/B listening with 009 and 007, it lead me to realise that I preferred the 007 sound much more. It's just thinner and brighter with less bass/dynamics than the 007. The timbre is also more natural sounding on the 007. 009S has the same type of natural timbre as 007 but in a different type of sound signature.
On songs such as Lujon - Henry Macini, I thought the 009 would destroy the 007 as that type of music is the 009 bread and butter but in reality I only slightly preferred the 009 which shows how good the 007 held up.
The timbre is much improved on the 009S making sounds such as gunshots sound a lot more real/natural. It also has more detail with improved imaging and depth. This makes pinpointing enemy players on a map much easier and it's basically wallhacks
. For context, I had Sennheiser HD800S and then Hifiman HE1000SE, the 009S is like alien technology in gaming audio compared those other two.
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mbrennwa
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Not sure I get this. Why wouldn't you be able to roll tubes on the BHSE?
I sold my 009 and i have only 007. When retourns the x9000 i made the second choice
Forgive my lack of knowledge with these amps as I thought the tubes in the Aeras have more of an effect to the sound compared to tube rolling on BHSE.
Alien technology loll that certainly has some truth, the jump from hifiman he1000se to stax 009 was a pretty big jump for me too gaming wise. Have you tried gaming on the x9000 while you owned it? My thoughts were that x9000 could be the best candidate as timbre is even more natural compared to 009S and it's the most spacious sounding stax.After doing some A/B listening with 009 and 007, it lead me to realise that I preferred the 007 sound much more. It's just thinner and brighter with less bass/dynamics than the 007. The timbre is also more natural sounding on the 007. 009S has the same type of natural timbre as 007 but in a different type of sound signature.
On songs such as Lujon - Henry Macini, I thought the 009 would destroy the 007 as that type of music is the 009 bread and butter but in reality I only slightly preferred the 009 which shows how good the 007 held up.
The timbre is much improved on the 009S making sounds such as gunshots sound a lot more real/natural. It also has more detail with improved imaging and depth. This makes pinpointing enemy players on a map much easier and it's basically wallhacks
I think ill end up with a x9000 in the end as I almost prefer soundstage and spaciouseness above anything else.
For context, the jump from the 009 to 009S in gaming is almost as big of a jump as HEKSE to 009. I have only demoed the X9000 so I can only comment on its capabilities with music but I will say the timbre and detail of the 009S was very similar to X9000 for me.
Imho same thing
The BHSE and Aeras are more similar than different in overall topology. I talked with Justin from HeadAmp and he told me that he learned from working with Kerry that the Aeras' output stage is pretty similar to a miniaturized BHSE output stage with 6S4As instead of EL34. Both amps use transistors for their voltage gain stages and then have tube output stages. The Aeras is distinct from the KGST by using the tubes in a different topology.
Also, I'm not sure how many 6S4A tube options there are. From what I gathered from the datasheets, 6S4A was not originally an audio tube, but was built for use in TVs. That makes them cheap and plentiful vs fancy audio tubes in addition to having electrical characteristics which are well-suited for driving electrostatics, but I don't think they're being made anymore and I don't know how much variation there is between manufacturers. That's in addition to the Aeras topology not being particularly more amenable to tube rolling than a BHSE. EL34s are audio tubes and there are lots of makers, including new production.
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Aspirant Audiophile
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What does 'different topology' mean, specifically?
Chefguru
Headphoneus Supremus
Good intel.
The main consideration that people are not taking into consideration is that, these are essentially solid state designs that utilize output tubes vs a tube amp that uses them for input / CCS.
Tubes have the advantage of tolerating higher heat temperatures which is why they are a great use for an estat amp - unlike with many dynamic designs that put them in to “color” the sound.
Carbon design found a workaround.
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The KGST uses grounded-cathode configuration for the tubes while the Aeras and BHSE use grounded-grid configuration.
mbrennwa
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I don't think the temperature thing is why tubes are at advantage with electrostatic headphones (or speakers). Tubes tend to run hotter than semiconductors because of the heaters / filaments.
The real advantage of tubes is that electrostats operate at high voltages (kilovolts) and low currents (a few milliamps). That's exactly what tubes are good at.
Svperstar
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You can change the tubes on the BHSE, but it is a hybrid amp not a full tube amp and the way tubes are used on the BHSE they don't really color the sound they do in a full tube amp like a DarkVoice. An electronic engineer could explain the technicalities better. I bought multiple tubes for my Blue Hawaii(non-SE, BJT) and thought I could hear a difference at first but tried mixing the tubes and didn't hear a difference
Apologies up-front but this is gonna be a very long post but i think its quite informative. I posed this questions asked here about different tube amp designs to ChatGPT and it spat out something pretty decent:
...
Electrostatic tube amplifiers like the KGST (Kevin Gilmore Stax Tube) and High-Amp Antares use hybrid designs that leverage the strengths of both tubes and solid-state components. This design approach creates a unique balance between tube warmth and solid-state precision – but the role of the tubes differs from what you might expect in traditional tube amplifiers. Let me break down why the “tube color” is less pronounced in these hybrid amps.
...
Electrostatic tube amplifiers like the KGST (Kevin Gilmore Stax Tube) and High-Amp Antares use hybrid designs that leverage the strengths of both tubes and solid-state components. This design approach creates a unique balance between tube warmth and solid-state precision – but the role of the tubes differs from what you might expect in traditional tube amplifiers. Let me break down why the “tube color” is less pronounced in these hybrid amps.
1. How Tubes Are Used in Hybrid Electrostatic Amps:
In amps like the KGST or Antares, the tubes are typically used in the gain stage (voltage amplification stage), while the output stage – the part that drives the electrostatic headphone directly – is handled by solid-state transistors or MOSFETs.- Voltage Amplification (Tubes):
The tubes amplify the audio signal to the required voltage swing necessary for electrostatic headphones (often several hundred volts). This stage sets the gain and influences the overall character of the amp. - Current Buffering (Solid-State):
Electrostatic drivers require very little current, but they demand high voltage swings (sometimes over 1000V peak-to-peak). The solid-state section acts as a current buffer, ensuring the high-voltage signal from the tubes can drive the headphones without sagging or distorting.
2. Why Tubes Don’t Add as Much “Color”:
In traditional tube amps (like for dynamic headphones or speakers), tubes handle both the voltage and current amplification. This often results in:- Harmonic distortion (especially 2nd-order harmonics), which adds a “warm, lush, and thick” sound.
- Softer transients and rolled-off highs compared to solid-state amps.
- Natural compression and “euphonic” coloration that many audiophiles love.
- Preserves detail and transient accuracy.
- Reduces distortion associated with tube power stages.
- Keeps the sound more transparent, with less tube coloration.
3. Why People Choose Hybrid Designs:
- Electrostatics favor neutrality and precision.
Electrostatic headphones like Stax are prized for their speed, resolution, and transparency. Too much tube coloration could muddy the detail and reduce micro-dynamics. - Better control over the diaphragm.
Solid-state buffers ensure the electrostatic diaphragm moves with greater precision and less distortion than a fully tube-based design might allow.
4. Comparing to Fully Tube Electrostatic Amps:
- Fully tube-based electrostatic amps (like the original Stax T2) do impart more tube coloration because tubes drive the output directly. However, they often lack the same level of tightness and speed in the bass and extreme treble.
- Hybrid designs strike a balance: you get some tube warmth but retain the accuracy and punch that solid-state components offer.
5. Why Some Say There’s No “Tube Magic”:
- Minimal Harmonic Distortion: Since the tubes operate primarily in the voltage domain and not in the current domain (where most tube distortion occurs), their influence is subtler.
- High Feedback Designs: Some hybrid amps (like the KGST) use negative feedback to minimize distortion, further reducing the classic tube “bloom.”
- Transparency Focus: Electrostatic headphone designs aim for neutrality and realism. Excess tube coloration could actually detract from the listening experience rather than enhance it.
6. But Do Tubes Still Matter?
Yes – but it’s more about texture and finesse than drastic tonal shifts. Tubes in hybrid electrostatic amps can:- Add a slight sweetness to the treble.
- Introduce subtle harmonic richness, making vocals more lifelike.
- Slightly soften the upper mids, reducing harshness.
- Improve spatial depth and enhance layering.
7. Amp-Specific Notes:
- KGST (Kevin Gilmore Stax Tube): Known for being very neutral and transparent. Tubes add a hint of smoothness, but the amp leans heavily on solid-state linearity.
- High-Amp Antares: Slightly warmer than the KGST but still designed to maintain clarity and precision. Tubes introduce minimal coloration, and the amp focuses on speed and accuracy.
8. Tube Rolling – Worth It?
- Yes, but expect subtle changes.
- Swapping tubes can adjust the flavor of the treble, midrange liquidity, or soundstage width, but don’t expect drastic shifts.
- Stick to low-noise, high-quality tubes (like NOS Telefunken, Mullard, or Amperex) to maximize detail retrieval without introducing unwanted noise.
Final Thoughts:
- Hybrid electrostatic amps use tubes differently from traditional tube amps – they influence the sound gently, not overtly.
- You’ll still get some of the “tube magic,” but it will feel like a sprinkle of seasoning rather than the main dish.
- This design philosophy complements electrostatics’ inherent transparency and speed, preserving their most valued traits.
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