The Stax Thread III

[Rob80b]

Hi Rob,

I'm not great at audiophile puff descriptions, however, I'll try to answer as best I can . . .

Thanks Jeff…pretty good answer IMHO.
I’m also looking at upgrading the 252s to the 400, so what ever comes 1st.

TBH, I think with a good PEQ system, you could pretty much turn the 300 into the 700.

With my setup I've no provision for doing any EQ, just source direct to amp but no complaints on the L300.

Maybe even more so by using the 700 pads as well.

I've added thicker leather pads similar to the 700, bass overall is rather very good and full bodied, any lack of sub base is music dependant.

Not sure I'll even try the Blu tack mod mentioned quite often, might be that the 3rd party leather pads I'm using, unlike the OEM stock 700 pads which I believe have a thinner backside similar to the stock 300 pads to attach to the mount, these are thicker so may seal better.
3rd party leather pads on the right.

Also a lot of the pics of the 700 pads show creasing which may also impede a good seal.

No creases,

 

[jamiekp]

OK - I'm looking for some input here to help steer me closer to the estat nirvana I'm hoping to find!

I started with a pair of 202s and an SRM1 mk II which I inherited and they were my gateway drug. But after some time and after reading Ken Rockwells review I felt like I wanted to move to a tube amp to add some extra warmth ... then I managed to source an SRM-T1 with a pair of "broken" Lambda Signatures (not the novas!) - What a steal those were! The headphones only had a broken headband which I managed to get a replacement for from the ESLab guys in HK. More on that in a minute.

The Sigs were such a huge upgrade on the 202s - I absolutely love them and they have become my "daily drivers". Total bargain and they are 30 years old which is what amazes me. It showed me that more expensive / newer certainly doesn't mean better.

After a while I started to wonder if there was more. Could it be that the 007s or 009s would offer another level beyond what I was listening to? Something with just a bit more sub-bass for example? Something that would sound more coherent on a level that I haven't yet heard? Once I started wondering it was inevitable that I'd try and find out.

And that is what lead me to the ES1a - being as some will know based on the Omega concept and some say having a sound signature somewhere between the 007 and 009. I saved some pennies and ordered a pair new from HK. When they arrived a few weeks later I was unfortunately not rewarded in the way I thought. They just didn't do it for me...the absolultey lacked the bass punch and focus that my Lambda signatures provide and the more forward mid whilst interesting turned out just not to be my cup-of-tea. Speaking to the guy at ESLabs he suggested that my amp was underpowered and that I'd get better results with something more powerful. So I sat on that for a while.

Cue the next upgrade: I managed to source a Mjolnir KGST amp second-hand. Plugging that in and replacing the SRM-T1 was definitely a fantastic upgrade however it still didn't change the fact that I prefer the sound of the Lambda Sigs to the ES1as.

The latest and last stop on this journey has been a pair of 007 mk IIs . Again it turns out that I just can't get excited about them compared to the Lambda Signatures! They are certainly a nice headphone - lots of bass which makes them sound fuller than the Lambdas, and a very pleasing relaxed and balanced tone overall but they have almost none of the air and shimmer that I love from the Lambdas. And at 800 quid for a pair I have to concede that I can't justify keeping them much as I love their construction, design and much as I want to love them...

I was speaking with a member here on the forums in a DM and he told me that he the 404LE (hard to find) and the L700mkII stuck out having gone through a lot of different estats. Current plan is to look out for either of those models and give them a whirl...but I'd be super keen to hear from other folks who have experience in this game. I guess what I'm looking for is a sort of upgraded version of what I've got - something with a bit more bass extension perhaps, something a little fuller sounding, but something that maintains the ethereal and exciting STAX signature sound that I got hooked on back way back when...

I realise my descriptions are very poor - so apologies if it doesn't make it clear what I'm after - perhaps someone who has listened to enough the cans I've described and some more would be able to give me some ideas about what models are out there that might get me excited again?

Thanks for any opinions offered...

 

[Svperstar]

OK - I'm looking for some input here to help steer me closer to the estat nirvana I'm hoping to find!

I started with a pair of 202s and an SRM1 mk II which I inherited and they were my gateway drug. But after some time and after reading Ken Rockwells review I felt like I wanted to move to a tube amp to add some extra warmth ... then I managed to source an SRM-T1 with a pair of "broken" Lambda Signatures (not the novas!) - What a steal those were! The headphones only had a broken headband which I managed to get a replacement for from the ESLab guys in HK. More on that in a minute.

The Sigs were such a huge upgrade on the 202s - I absolutely love them and they have become my "daily drivers". Total bargain and they are 30 years old which is what amazes me. It showed me that more expensive / newer certainly doesn't mean better.

After a while I started to wonder if there was more. Could it be that the 007s or 009s would offer another level beyond what I was listening to? Something with just a bit more sub-bass for example? Something that would sound more coherent on a level that I haven't yet heard? Once I started wondering it was inevitable that I'd try and find out.

And that is what lead me to the ES1a - being as some will know based on the Omega concept and some say having a sound signature somewhere between the 007 and 009. I saved some pennies and ordered a pair new from HK. When they arrived a few weeks later I was unfortunately not rewarded in the way I thought. They just didn't do it for me...the absolultey lacked the bass punch and focus that my Lambda signatures provide and the more forward mid whilst interesting turned out just not to be my cup-of-tea. Speaking to the guy at ESLabs he suggested that my amp was underpowered and that I'd get better results with something more powerful. So I sat on that for a while.

Cue the next upgrade: I managed to source a Mjolnir KGST amp second-hand. Plugging that in and replacing the SRM-T1 was definitely a fantastic upgrade however it still didn't change the fact that I prefer the sound of the Lambda Sigs to the ES1as.

The latest and last stop on this journey has been a pair of 007 mk IIs . Again it turns out that I just can't get excited about them compared to the Lambda Signatures! They are certainly a nice headphone - lots of bass which makes them sound fuller than the Lambdas, and a very pleasing relaxed and balanced tone overall but they have almost none of the air and shimmer that I love from the Lambdas. And at 800 quid for a pair I have to concede that I can't justify keeping them much as I love their construction, design and much as I want to love them...

I was speaking with a member here on the forums in a DM and he told me that he the 404LE (hard to find) and the L700mkII stuck out having gone through a lot of different estats. Current plan is to look out for either of those models and give them a whirl...but I'd be super keen to hear from other folks who have experience in this game. I guess what I'm looking for is a sort of upgraded version of what I've got - something with a bit more bass extension perhaps, something a little fuller sounding, but something that maintains the ethereal and exciting STAX signature sound that I got hooked on back way back when...

I realise my descriptions are very poor - so apologies if it doesn't make it clear what I'm after - perhaps someone who has listened to enough the cans I've described and some more would be able to give me some ideas about what models are out there that might get me excited again?

Thanks for any opinions offered...

Id try a 007mk1/mk2 or modern Lambda with the port mod. I have the l500mk2 and with and without the port mod they are way different headphones. The port mod is essential

 

[alota]

@jamiekpIf you are happy with your lambda, stay with your lamba. I'm new in electrostatic world but

OK - I'm looking for some input here to help steer me closer to the estat nirvana I'm hoping to find!

I started with a pair of 202s and an SRM1 mk II which I inherited and they were my gateway drug. But after some time and after reading Ken Rockwells review I felt like I wanted to move to a tube amp to add some extra warmth ... then I managed to source an SRM-T1 with a pair of "broken" Lambda Signatures (not the novas!) - What a steal those were! The headphones only had a broken headband which I managed to get a replacement for from the ESLab guys in HK. More on that in a minute.

The Sigs were such a huge upgrade on the 202s - I absolutely love them and they have become my "daily drivers". Total bargain and they are 30 years old which is what amazes me. It showed me that more expensive / newer certainly doesn't mean better.

After a while I started to wonder if there was more. Could it be that the 007s or 009s would offer another level beyond what I was listening to? Something with just a bit more sub-bass for example? Something that would sound more coherent on a level that I haven't yet heard? Once I started wondering it was inevitable that I'd try and find out.

And that is what lead me to the ES1a - being as some will know based on the Omega concept and some say having a sound signature somewhere between the 007 and 009. I saved some pennies and ordered a pair new from HK. When they arrived a few weeks later I was unfortunately not rewarded in the way I thought. They just didn't do it for me...the absolultey lacked the bass punch and focus that my Lambda signatures provide and the more forward mid whilst interesting turned out just not to be my cup-of-tea. Speaking to the guy at ESLabs he suggested that my amp was underpowered and that I'd get better results with something more powerful. So I sat on that for a while.

Cue the next upgrade: I managed to source a Mjolnir KGST amp second-hand. Plugging that in and replacing the SRM-T1 was definitely a fantastic upgrade however it still didn't change the fact that I prefer the sound of the Lambda Sigs to the ES1as.

The latest and last stop on this journey has been a pair of 007 mk IIs . Again it turns out that I just can't get excited about them compared to the Lambda Signatures! They are certainly a nice headphone - lots of bass which makes them sound fuller than the Lambdas, and a very pleasing relaxed and balanced tone overall but they have almost none of the air and shimmer that I love from the Lambdas. And at 800 quid for a pair I have to concede that I can't justify keeping them much as I love their construction, design and much as I want to love them...

I was speaking with a member here on the forums in a DM and he told me that he the 404LE (hard to find) and the L700mkII stuck out having gone through a lot of different estats. Current plan is to look out for either of those models and give them a whirl...but I'd be super keen to hear from other folks who have experience in this game. I guess what I'm looking for is a sort of upgraded version of what I've got - something with a bit more bass extension perhaps, something a little fuller sounding, but something that maintains the ethereal and exciting STAX signature sound that I got hooked on back way back when...

I realise my descriptions are very poor - so apologies if it doesn't make it clear what I'm after - perhaps someone who has listened to enough the cans I've described and some more would be able to give me some ideas about what models are out there that might get me excited again?

Thanks for any opinions offered...

if you're happy with your lambda signatures why bang your head?

 

[jamiekp]

Haha. Yeah I know. I just have a feeling there is even more out there but I haven’t yet found it. I’m truly amazed that a 30 year old headphone can outshine all these more expensive and modern options to my ears at least.

 

[jody2k]

OK - I'm looking for some input here to help steer me closer to the estat nirvana I'm hoping to find!

I started with a pair of 202s and an SRM1 mk II which I inherited and they were my gateway drug. But after some time and after reading Ken Rockwells review I felt like I wanted to move to a tube amp to add some extra warmth ... then I managed to source an SRM-T1 with a pair of "broken" Lambda Signatures (not the novas!) - What a steal those were! The headphones only had a broken headband which I managed to get a replacement for from the ESLab guys in HK. More on that in a minute.

The Sigs were such a huge upgrade on the 202s - I absolutely love them and they have become my "daily drivers". Total bargain and they are 30 years old which is what amazes me. It showed me that more expensive / newer certainly doesn't mean better.

After a while I started to wonder if there was more. Could it be that the 007s or 009s would offer another level beyond what I was listening to? Something with just a bit more sub-bass for example? Something that would sound more coherent on a level that I haven't yet heard? Once I started wondering it was inevitable that I'd try and find out.

And that is what lead me to the ES1a - being as some will know based on the Omega concept and some say having a sound signature somewhere between the 007 and 009. I saved some pennies and ordered a pair new from HK. When they arrived a few weeks later I was unfortunately not rewarded in the way I thought. They just didn't do it for me...the absolultey lacked the bass punch and focus that my Lambda signatures provide and the more forward mid whilst interesting turned out just not to be my cup-of-tea. Speaking to the guy at ESLabs he suggested that my amp was underpowered and that I'd get better results with something more powerful. So I sat on that for a while.

Cue the next upgrade: I managed to source a Mjolnir KGST amp second-hand. Plugging that in and replacing the SRM-T1 was definitely a fantastic upgrade however it still didn't change the fact that I prefer the sound of the Lambda Sigs to the ES1as.

The latest and last stop on this journey has been a pair of 007 mk IIs . Again it turns out that I just can't get excited about them compared to the Lambda Signatures! They are certainly a nice headphone - lots of bass which makes them sound fuller than the Lambdas, and a very pleasing relaxed and balanced tone overall but they have almost none of the air and shimmer that I love from the Lambdas. And at 800 quid for a pair I have to concede that I can't justify keeping them much as I love their construction, design and much as I want to love them...

I was speaking with a member here on the forums in a DM and he told me that he the 404LE (hard to find) and the L700mkII stuck out having gone through a lot of different estats. Current plan is to look out for either of those models and give them a whirl...but I'd be super keen to hear from other folks who have experience in this game. I guess what I'm looking for is a sort of upgraded version of what I've got - something with a bit more bass extension perhaps, something a little fuller sounding, but something that maintains the ethereal and exciting STAX signature sound that I got hooked on back way back when...

I realise my descriptions are very poor - so apologies if it doesn't make it clear what I'm after - perhaps someone who has listened to enough the cans I've described and some more would be able to give me some ideas about what models are out there that might get me excited again?

Thanks for any opinions offered...

If you like lambda signature's "sound signature" then the L700 or SR-009 would be more recommended if you look for upgrade imo. (but it will be significant more expensive).
The 007 is going the complete opposite direction tuning wise and the ES1a is okay but not for everyone's taste.

Stax X9000 and SR-009(s) have the best bass extention of any estat except Audeze CRBN.
The Lambda's have good midbass punch, lambda signature's are hard to beat for their pricepoint imo.

 

[TheAbyss2022]

If you like lambda signature's "sound signature" then the L700 or SR-009 would be more recommended if you look for upgrade imo. (but it will be significant more expensive).
The 007 is going the complete opposite direction tuning wise and the ES1a is okay but not for everyone's taste.

Stax X9000 and SR-009(s) have the best bass extention of any estat except Audeze CRBN.
The Lambda's have good midbass punch, lambda signature's are hard to beat for their pricepoint imo.

I would not recommend the SR-009S for mid bass impact.

The SR-009 is much better in this department and more comparable to the X9000 bass. Audeze CRBN does have the most bass impact but loses out on texture and detail compared to the Stax.

 

[jody2k]

I would not recommend the SR-009S for mid bass impact.

The SR-009 is much better in this department and more comparable to the X9000 bass. Audeze CRBN does have the most bass impact but loses out on texture and detail compared to the Stax.

Didn't know the sr-009s vs older sr-009 were so different in this area, interesting to read.

I only own and heard the older SR-009 and I agree I think this will be my endgame headphone for long time.

 

[jamiekp]

Yeah I think I agree that the 007 was heading in the wrong direction...which provides some useful info to course correct.

The ES1a is perfectly pleasant. I've got it on now and am giving it a run this afternoon...its a nice sound but I will move it on when I can post classifieds here because its a lot of money to have sunk into something that isn't really to my tastes.

@TheAbyss2022 Thanks for that info...I read about the CRBN earlier but if it looses out on the detail I love so much it sounds like it might be a step too far. I didn't realise that the 009 was vastly different to the 009S - maybe I should look out for a pair of those to try.

@jody2k I'm honestly astonished by the Lambda Signatures as I've said several times. I'm curious if you feel either of the models you mentioned would actually feel like a step-up for me? And did you ever hear the 404SE that was recommended to me elsewhere?

 

[TheAbyss2022]

Didn't know the sr-009s vs older sr-009 were so different in this area, interesting to read.

I only own and heard the older SR-009 and I agree I think this will be my endgame headphone for long time.

Yeah the mid bass impact on the 009S is a lot more constrained but tighter and better textured. There is literally no sub-bass on solid state but its presence is much improved once you put it on tubes and I only listen to it on tubes anyway, its too sterile on solid state.

 

[TheAbyss2022]

@TheAbyss2022 Thanks for that info...I read about the CRBN earlier but if it looses out on the detail I love so much it sounds like it might be a step too far. I didn't realise that the 009 was vastly different to the 009S - maybe I should look out for a pair of those to try.

Depends on the headphones you already have. If you don't have any modern estats I think the CRBN's bass detail is still really strong and it still has more detail in the bass than any dynamic or planar headphone that I have heard. I was floored by the bass definition on the CRBN when I first got it and didn't realise it could get even better until I got the 009.

Depends on what genres you listen to as the 009 & 009S excel at different genres.

 

[jamiekp]

This reminds me of my realisation about motorbikes (which I've had a taste for all my life)...in the end there is not just one bike that can do it all

There's a pair of 009s on ebay for £1500 give or take. I'm tempted to grab them at that money and move the ES1as on. It sounds like they might be closer to what I'm after from what you say but its hard to tell without hearing them! And unfortunately they'd be shipping from Japan making returns hard...

 

[TheAbyss2022]

This reminds me of my realisation about motorbikes (which I've had a taste for all my life)...in the end there is not just one bike that can do it all

There's a pair of 009s on ebay for £1500 give or take. I'm tempted to grab them at that money and move the ES1as on. It sounds like they might be closer to what I'm after from what you say but its hard to tell without hearing them! And unfortunately they'd be shipping from Japan making returns hard...

If you tell me which genres you listen to, I can direct you to either the 009 or 009S.

For example, rock and metal music sounds incredible on the 009 but very poor on the 009S.

 

[jamiekp]

Well thats just my problem - I listen to a lot of different stuff. rock, classical, electronic, ambient, jazz, folk, etc...
There is a guy in Essex who has a pair of 009S' that I could buy and test...so maybe it would be worth doing that. They are 1k more than the 009 though...its a fairly hefty outlay as the next port-of-call.

 

[TheAbyss2022]

Well thats just my problem - I listen to a lot of different stuff. rock, classical, electronic, ambient, jazz, folk, etc...
There is a guy in Essex who has a pair of 009S' that I could buy and test...so maybe it would be worth doing that. They are 1k more than the 009 though...its a fairly hefty outlay as the next port-of-call.

Go for the 009 as they have a wider soundstage, better treble extension, better bass impact.

The upgrades you are getting with the 009S is a smoother treble (for better or for worse), more natural instrumental timbre, improved midrange detail (not like the 009 is lacking in detail anyway). You will be very disappointed if you got the 009S expecting them to be good for rock and electronic music. I only use them for acoustical, flamenco, jazz or more refined music that requires more natural sounding instrumentation. I also only use the 009S with tube mode as its too sterile sounding on solid state mode with the Phantom. The 009 sounds best on solid state mode.

I can help you out and let you listen to both if you can make it to North London.