The Stax Thread III

[Chefguru]

I received very helpful guidance on Head-fi.org, and as my excitement mounts about my Stax, I thought I'd ask another question, specifically about the l700mk2 "versus" (note the ironic quote marks) a 9000x setup.

But first, some context:

I am not an expert in anything related audio. I just like quality. I used to be an indie rock DJ. My wife is a well-regarded classical composer, and she teaches me how to use my ears. So any setup is for two people, an authentic expert and a fanboy.

I WAS looking for 1000-dollar audio when I started this venture... But given that it's possible in theory to afford a Stax 9000 with all the fixins, ie Blue Hawaii etc etc etc, I'm considering taking that big step.

A month ago, I'd never heard of Stax, and I hadn't bought a new set of headphones/earspeakers in 15 years, the previous ones being about eighty bucks.

Two weeks ago, I listened to the l300, l500, l700 and 007 for the first time.

This week, I have a streamer (Node), DAC (MX-DAC), Stax (l700 MK2), driver/amp (SRM-400s), and streaming subscription (Qobuz) that put a smile on my face with regularity.

Neither of us like the 007--at all--we couldn't understand why someone would buy estats that don't sound a whole lot like estats (yes, I know I'm probably being obtuse). We haven't tried the 009 and don't have access to one. We can try out the 9000 in a couple days though.

What we definitely don't want is to pay ten or fifteen grand for The Best Headphones and then feel like we traded in exceptional clarity (current setup) for a "best of the l700, 007 and 009" package that winds up not feeling like a massive upgrade in any area.

My question is very broad and totally subjective. I hope folks won't shy away from personal opinion though: if we're listening with highly trained ears, what are we getting with the 9000 that we don't get with the aforementioned setup we're already happy with, and how much "happier" (5%? 10? 24.7?)?

And no, we don't want to spend a few months getting more used to what we have. If we're gonna do it we're gonna do it now.

The 009/009s/x9000 are very different sounding than other Stax headphones. The differences between them is more of the “is it worth it” conundrum.

The 007 is a completely different sound, but in previous generations matched closer to the Stax house sound. The current lambda models no longer resemble it - so it really feels like the outcast. I’ve owned several versions of the 007. It’s the only headphone I’ve ever experienced sounding vastly different on different amps. I hated the 007a on my modified 717. I love the 007mk1 on the Carbon.

Audition the x9000. It’s the best of the modern bunch and will tell you a lot about your preferences.

 

[BassicScience]

Just a quick response to the respondents to my post--comments about trusting my own ears and enjoying the journey are totally valid...that said, I really would welcome subjective opinions.

I may be misrepresenting how I make an audio (or any) decision. To clarify: I don't copy and paste the opinions of others, then go buy what someone else tells me to do. I'm one tier higher than that in the "fool and his money" spectrum

The opinions of people with more experience don't create my own opinion--they provide indicators for what I should look for when listening. I've read several reviews on the HeadCase forum, for example, that the x9000 has imaging and brightness issues, but that it's also of better build and neutrality than the 007 or 009. I'm going to look out for that, and doing so will surely help me train my ears.

There's an x9000 sitting in the shop down the street, so there's no concern about shipping delays. I'd just feel more comfortable doing the demo with more experienced, non-bot observations.

If someone reported that the X9000 has imaging and brightness issues, I'd question the amp or something in the setup. I found it to have superb tonal balance and excellent imaging capabilities. Unfortunately, no one can tell you how much more (if at all) you'd enjoy an X9000 with a BHSE over your current setup. There are simply too many variables, including how much of a financial stretch $15k represents to you.

 

[CT007]

Opinions on this?

• Gungnir + Mjolnir KGST + 007 MKII? (all newest versions)

The amp is where I'm not quite 100%, but it seems better than any new/rebuilt 007/006/717/727, Octave 2 and iESL. Maybe I would want a more neutral, detail oriented DAC for the 007?

My estat experience so far has been: Modi Multibit + SRM-252s + L300 / L300LTD + L700 pads, and I need a LOT better than that. . .

• Why does everyone seem to prefer older version(s) of SR-007? Because you can get it cheaper..?

 

[Petergrifindor]

Finally after some months searching for all the components in second hand markets, in about two weeks I should officially be part of the Stax crew. A Stax 009s will arrive at home and I will have a complete HiFi Headphone set up, with the PS Directream DAC, the Stax T8000 and the 009s.

Well, almost complete, because I don't have the cables needed to connect the DAC with the amp. I would apreciate some help, because I don't have a clue about what to use. I know they should be a pair of short XLR cables, and I would like the quality to match somewhat the rest of components of the chain.

Any brands and models recommended? What do you use as interconnections in your TOTL electrostats equipment?

Thanks a lot for your help.

 

[martin778]

I'm in the same boat at the moment, regarding XLR cables. Tried mogami 2534 with gold Neutriks but nope, the midrange is tiring and the treble is too dark.

I always found Audioquest a well balanced cable but my biggest issue are the turned XLR connectors, it's a nightmare make a thick XLR cable fit the connector.

 

[musicman59]

Finally after some months searching for all the components in second hand markets, in about two weeks I should officially be part of the Stax crew. A Stax 009s will arrive at home and I will have a complete HiFi Headphone set up, with the PS Directream DAC, the Stax T8000 and the 009s.

Well, almost complete, because I don't have the cables needed to connect the DAC with the amp. I would apreciate some help, because I don't have a clue about what to use. I know they should be a pair of short XLR cables, and I would like the quality to match somewhat the rest of components of the chain.

Any brands and models recommended? What do you use as interconnections in your TOTL electrostats equipment?

Thanks a lot for your help.

I used Kimber Kables Select KS-1116 which are the all copper cables. They provide me the level of detail and warmth I want in my system.

 

[number1sixerfan]

There's an x9000 sitting in the shop down the street, so there's no concern about shipping delays. I'd just feel more comfortable doing the demo with more experienced, non-bot observations.

If there's one just sitting and you have the funds, I would suggest you just buy it. With the high demand and delays, you could surely sell it for at or around the same price if you find it's not for you. Also, there's no telling when another may arrive if it sells. I would just go for it if financially feasible.

Again it's hard to give much advice here when you're so new to it all. It doesn't sound like you have some sort of set preferences for us to recommend against. In general, the 009 is a bit brighter, with a high sense of clarity, and the x9000 is smoother in the highs and across the full spectrum. Both are extremely resolving.. x9000 is overall slightly higher performer, but there isn't some massive gap between the two. A bit larger gap between what you have now, but only you can assess how big it actually is after hearing them. (I have the L300, but haven't heard the L700, so I don't have any insight to offer there).

 

[zomkung]

FYI, The original T2 is selling on yahoo Japan

 

[KDS315]

FYI, The original T2 is selling on yahoo Japan

Of a shady 0-rated seller, yeah

A nice one was sold about a week ago for JPY 1.1 million - guess that attracted that seller now…

 

[eskamobob1]

If there's one just sitting and you have the funds, I would suggest you just buy it. With the high demand and delays, you could surely sell it for at or around the same price if you find it's not for you. Also, there's no telling when another may arrive if it sells. I would just go for it if financially feasible.

Again it's hard to give much advice here when you're so new to it all. It doesn't sound like you have some sort of set preferences for us to recommend against. In general, the 009 is a bit brighter, with a high sense of clarity, and the x9000 is smoother in the highs and across the full spectrum. Both are extremely resolving.. x9000 is overall slightly higher performer, but there isn't some massive gap between the two. A bit larger gap between what you have now, but only you can assess how big it actually is after hearing them. (I have the L300, but haven't heard the L700, so I don't have any insight to offer there).

Honestly, I feel these is a solid gap between x9000 and 009 but it's not just raw resolution or image clarity but instead on a wholistic SQ level. X9000 has a much better timbre and the smoother FR allows for more organic presentation overall. Obv basically everything in this hobby is diminishing returns but I personaly view the jump in those qualities enoygh to call it a distinct tier up when looking wholisticaly. Obv this is also highly system dependant. I just haven't heard the 009 get these qualities to the levels present on the x9000 on BHSE on any system I've tried 009 on

 

[number1sixerfan]

Honestly, I feel these is a solid gap between x9000 and 009 but it's not just raw resolution or image clarity but instead on a wholistic SQ level. X9000 has a much better timbre and the smoother FR allows for more organic presentation overall. Obv basically everything in this hobby is diminishing returns but I personaly view the jump in those qualities enoygh to call it a distinct tier up when looking wholisticaly. Obv this is also highly system dependant. I just haven't heard the 009 get these qualities to the levels present on the x9000 on BHSE on any system I've tried 009 on

Oh I definitely agree that there's a nice performance jump between it and the 009 and I do think the x9000 is a tier up; I just don't think I'd say it's massive. I would say the same for the TC/Susvara/Sr1a which I have in the same tier of the 009. But that's all totally subjective, I was more so just trying to put in perspective for someone newer that the performance jumps are not linear related to price differences.

 

[eskamobob1]

Oh I definitely agree that there's a nice performance jump between it and the 009 and I do think the x9000 is a tier up; I just don't think I'd say it's massive. I would say the same for the TC/Susvara/Sr1a which I have in the same tier of the 009. But that's all totally subjective, I was more so just trying to put in perspective for someone newer that the performance jumps are not linear related to price differences.

Yah. Its all about what you personaly value. For me, the jump from hd800 to 009 is less valuable than the one from 009 to x9000 simply because I very highly value "completeness" or "coherency" to the sound that allows a can to be a great all arounder (which consequently is why I am not a fan of 1266). But if you are one that values raw resolution above all else the ultimately small jump in resolution between 009 and x9000 may mean that you would gain more personal value investing elsewhere in the chain. Tbh I find it super interesting just how much stax varies in sound as a brand overall. Realy there is just at least one great option for anyone in the market.

 

[Chefguru]

Opinions on this?

• Gungnir + Mjolnir KGST + 007 MKII? (all newest versions)

The amp is where I'm not quite 100%, but it seems better than any new/rebuilt 007/006/717/727, Octave 2 and iESL. Maybe I would want a more neutral, detail oriented DAC for the 007?

My estat experience so far has been: Modi Multibit + SRM-252s + L300 / L300LTD + L700 pads, and I need a LOT better than that. . .

• Why does everyone seem to prefer older version(s) of SR-007? Because you can get it cheaper..?

I had the KGST for a year before I upgraded to the Carbon. I liked the pairing with the 009S but the KGST was harsher on the highs and didn’t have the solid feel of the Carbon. Bass was also much thinner.

For the 007 you’re better off going Mjolnir KGSSHV which doesn’t have the tuby/holographic effect but up until the Carbon’s invention, was essentially the best solid state offering for 007.

Dac is

 

[SolarCetacean]

If someone reported that the X9000 has imaging and brightness issues, I'd question the amp or something in the setup. I found it to have superb tonal balance and excellent imaging capabilities. Unfortunately, no one can tell you how much more (if at all) you'd enjoy an X9000 with a BHSE over your current setup. There are simply too many variables, including how much of a financial stretch $15k represents to you.

That review was from Spritzer, running it off of a Carbon CC amp and Denafrips Terminator DAC. Definitely not a bad chain, but maybe not so suitable? Based on his comments, it seems like the brightness is due to some sort of resonance at a specific frequency, so if your tracks don't lean on that frequency or if you're not sensitive to that frequency, you'll never notice it. I've heard a similar phenomenon with my SR-L700mk2 vs my SGL Jr; the SGL is brighter overall, but there are specific areas on the L700mk2 with sharp peaks, so while normally the L700mk2 is a more relaxed listen, there are some tracks where it is harsher than the SGL. Also, Spritzer has mentioned elsewhere that his test tracks are mostly obscure Icelandic tracks, so it's hard to tell if it's that those tracks don't work well with the X9K vs an issue with the headphone in general.

 

[BassicScience]

That review was from Spritzer, running it off of a Carbon CC amp and Denafrips Terminator DAC. Definitely not a bad chain, but maybe not so suitable? Based on his comments, it seems like the brightness is due to some sort of resonance at a specific frequency, so if your tracks don't lean on that frequency or if you're not sensitive to that frequency, you'll never notice it. I've heard a similar phenomenon with my SR-L700mk2 vs my SGL Jr; the SGL is brighter overall, but there are specific areas on the L700mk2 with sharp peaks, so while normally the L700mk2 is a more relaxed listen, there are some tracks where it is harsher than the SGL. Also, Spritzer has mentioned elsewhere that his test tracks are mostly obscure Icelandic tracks, so it's hard to tell if it's that those tracks don't work well with the X9K vs an issue with the headphone in general.

I listened to a wide variety of music on the X9000, so it's very likely that any sort of resonance peak would have shown up at some point. That said, my listening did not include any obscure Icelandic music. It's possible that there were some synergistic issues with his chain, but I don't recall reading any reviews of those components that mentioned brightness, per se. BTW, I definitely agree that the SGL Jr. has an energetic, though never piercing, treble, and I would say it's clearly brighter overall than the X9000. Part of that impression is also due to the X9000's fuller bass. The SGL is somewhere in-between the SGL Jr. and X9000 on the brightness scale.