[Music Alchemist]

Agh! I was going off of memory, and for some reason I got the 207's curve conflated with the L300's curve. Sorry. The 207 does seem to have some seriously nice bass, though.

I put a lot of info in my post because I wasn't sure how much you knew. (I also edited it for clarification.)

The SR-L300 does have sub-bass roll-off in the measurements, but I did not really notice this during listening. (Not sure whether this is due to something going wrong in the measurements or what.) It has a bass hump as well. Overall, it actually sounded more bassy than the SR-207.

I haven't heard the SR-L500 and SR-L700, so I'll be on my way to avoid getting too off-topic here.

 

[tigon_ridge]

The SR-L300 does have sub-bass roll-off in the measurements, but I did not really notice this during listening. (Not sure whether this is due to something going wrong in the measurements or what.) It has a bass hump as well. Overall, it actually sounded more bassy than the SR-207.

Be sure to listen for the difference in subbass and not midbass, because bass humps normally occur in the 100hz region, not the subbass range. The L300's curve doesn't begin to descend until the 50hz point. I would test both headphones (if you happen to have both) with a sine sweep for a definitive comparison. You may be right, but I really just want to be extra sure. At this point, I don't know whether to go for a srs 3100 or 2170. They both seem very enticing.

 

[Pahani]

Be sure to listen for the difference in subbass and not midbass, because bass humps normally occur in the 100hz region, not the subbass range. The L300's curve doesn't begin to descend until the 50hz point. I would test both headphones (if you happen to have both) with a sine sweep for a definitive comparison. You may be right, but I really just want to be extra sure. At this point, I don't know whether to go for a srs 3100 or 2170. They both seem very enticing.

Luckily, I own both the 2170 system and L700. I am NOT a critical listener, so a highly detailed comparison will NOT be forthcoming from me. YMMV, etc.

However, in broad terms, my ears classify both the 207 and L700 as neutral-ish in nature. L700 (shockingly to me) seems to step up the detail about 2 notches. I would not have thought it possible, but there it is. L700 may or may not have a bit more midrange energy; I'm not sure if my ears are playing tricks on me.

207's have a LOT more clamp than L700. I didn't find my 207's at all uncomfortable in the @ 1 year i used them daily........but since becoming used to the much softer L700 clamp, the 207's are now uncomfortable and seem to apply pressure against the rear upward curve of my jaw. Whatever that's called.

I find both to be quite pleasing with most genres of music, with L700 being superior to me. However, when I desire a non-Neutral HP with exaggerated bass for EDM and such, I usually reach for my modded X00 Purplehearts.

I also refrained from looking at FR graphs..what my impressions are is what my ears tell me.

Also, the very first night I listened to my L700, I had a bit of a headache, and I think L700 has SO much detail, as well as some additional midrange energy, that I experienced listening fatigue because of that. I needed more time to get used to L700 and truly appreciate them than I would have thought necessary. I thought my year + experience with my 207's would have prepared me.......it didn't.

 

[catscratch]

The headache could be due to pressure on the temples. The L700's design prevents it from putting enough pressure on the lower half of the earpad, so most of the pressure goes to the top. That causes there to be too much pressure on the temples, which over time can lead to headaches. I experienced the same thing for the first few days.

The earpads do get softer over time, and the clamp goes down a little bit. They're never going to be truly comfortable, but they're not bad, and you get used to them. If they ever redesign the housing though, the little tabs on top of the earcups need to go.

Regarding the bass - it depends on your frame of reference. In isolation, yes you could argue that it's defined enough, but when you have 2 different SR-007s and a Focal Clear sitting on the desk, you start to see the L700's limitations. Still enjoy them more than the rest, though. The 007s need a lot of volume to really wake up. The Focals are pretty good, but in terms of resolution aren't even playing the same game.

 

[powertoold]

The L700 has a dust guard inside the earpads that blocks part of the driver. Anyone tried to remove it?

 

[powertoold]

So I removed the dust cover from my l700, and it took the detail and clarity up a notch, but the sound was a tad bit more "metallic" on first impression. Also, the presentation seemed a little bit different. It's less like speakers in front of you, and more like the Ethereal presentation of the LNS.

I totally prefer the dust covers off. For vocals alone, it now has a goosebump inducing realism that I didn't remember from the past.

I understand that there is a higher risk of dust getting in the drivers, but YOLO (I keep them in a clear plastic bag when not in use).

It's a shame that Stax gimped the sub bass on the l700. With the dust covers off, I can't imagine any better sound, with the exception of the bass.

 

[tigon_ridge]

Perhaps a static duster would be a simple solution, if you want to use the headphones with the dust covers off.

 

[luvmusik]

Cool to see experimenting with L700, dust cover project, it gives another sound option.

Believe we haven't had a definitive exact measurement of the L700 membrane thickness yet. Back in the thread Jim kindly wrote to Stax & they were vague & seems unpublished spec so far.

It's not really that important, but many of us are curious on the actual thickness. A bit deceiving (or maybe not) is when Stax states the SR-009 to be 1-2 um thick. I always read this published spec (to me) meaning 1.2 um, which makes sense but may not be accurate.

When Stax says under 2 um which then became the "catch-phrase" for 009 thickness, it means little, as nearly all Stax membranes since 1972 were < 2.0 um. The 2.0 um began in 1972, and later LNB & GNB were also 2.0 um. In the very earliest years were some of the really thick 5 & 6 um early models, & some continued a few years. So other than LNB & GNB, I recall all membranes were under 2.0 um on later many new emerging models (except for earliest models selling thru to end their inventory run). The LPro started the 1.5 um thickness, with LSignature (& Sigma Pro) being thinnest 1.0 um.

So, "under 2.0 um" seems vague. Wonder if indeed assumption (maybe wrong) of 009 being 1.2 um, and we know SR-007 MK2 is indeed 1.35 um, as so, then we would also gather L700 to be between these two (per Stax) at 1.2 to 1.35 um thickness. Just a guess. At least as Stax says L700 is thinner than 007-MK2, then it would have to be as L700 < 1.35 um.

As a reference, SR-404LE (Limited Ed., LTD) and SR-SC11 are both 1.35 um in raw membrane thickness. Seems like Stax is settling at 1.35 um and thinner most recently for their models.

Probably the most important point was posted earlier in thread that L700 thickness is between 009 and 007 MK2. Until we get an exact published figure, guess we'll have to go with it.

Anyone weigh in on L700 (and 009) membrane thickness measurements ?

 

[catscratch]

For the record, I think taking the dustcover off is a really bad idea and should never be done.

 

[powertoold]

For the record, I think taking the dustcover off is a really bad idea and should never be done.

Only because dust may get into the drivers?

I've been running my LNS without any covers for months without any problems.

Stax also makes it super easy to remove the dust cover on the L700, and they have a year warranty in Japan, so they'd be getting a lot of repair requests if the flimsy and loose dust cover were so important. Obviously, I wouldn't bring a L700 to a meet without dust covers, but with careful home use, I don't see much of a problem.

I'll let you guys know if I run into issues, but the L700 dust cover is odd, covers about 15% of the driver. Also, the electrostatic driver isn't very strong, so having anything in the way will impact the sound. I'm experiencing much more clarity and detail. Not sure about the drawbacks other than a very slightly more "metallic" sound.

 

[catscratch]

Oh, you meant the black plastic shield over the driver? No, that's not the dust cover. Not sure what that's there for. The dustcover is the outside layer of the driver itself, which seals the driver and prevents dust from getting in. People had taken to removing dust covers from electrostatics at some point, which is pointless and generally ruins the driver long term.

 

[powertoold]

Oh, you meant the black plastic shield over the driver? No, that's not the dust cover. Not sure what that's there for. The dustcover is the outside layer of the driver itself, which seals the driver and prevents dust from getting in. People had taken to removing dust covers from electrostatics at some point, which is pointless and generally ruins the driver long term.

Lol, but that plastic "shield" is a dust / debris cover / grill! If you take it out, I think the sound is clearer and more detailed.

People who remove the semi transparent cover over the drivers are crazy!

 

[Pahani]

Cool to see experimenting with L700, dust cover project, it gives another sound option.

Believe we haven't had a definitive exact measurement of the L700 membrane thickness yet. Back in the thread Jim kindly wrote to Stax & they were vague & seems unpublished spec so far.

It's not really that important, but many of us are curious on the actual thickness. A bit deceiving (or maybe not) is when Stax states the SR-009 to be 1-2 um thick. I always read this published spec (to me) meaning 1.2 um, which makes sense but may not be accurate.

When Stax says under 2 um which then became the "catch-phrase" for 009 thickness, it means little, as nearly all Stax membranes since 1972 were < 2.0 um. The 2.0 um began in 1972, and later LNB & GNB were also 2.0 um. In the very earliest years were some of the really thick 5 & 6 um early models, & some continued a few years. So other than LNB & GNB, I recall all membranes were under 2.0 um on later many new emerging models (except for earliest models selling thru to end their inventory run). The LPro started the 1.5 um thickness, with LSignature (& Sigma Pro) being thinnest 1.0 um.

So, "under 2.0 um" seems vague. Wonder if indeed assumption (maybe wrong) of 009 being 1.2 um, and we know SR-007 MK2 is indeed 1.35 um, as so, then we would also gather L700 to be between these two (per Stax) at 1.2 to 1.35 um thickness. Just a guess. At least as Stax says L700 is thinner than 007-MK2, then it would have to be as L700 < 1.35 um.

As a reference, SR-404LE (Limited Ed., LTD) and SR-SC11 are both 1.35 um in raw membrane thickness. Seems like Stax is settling at 1.35 um and thinner most recently for their models.

Probably the most important point was posted earlier in thread that L700 thickness is between 009 and 007 MK2. Until we get an exact published figure, guess we'll have to go with it.

Anyone weigh in on L700 (and 009) membrane thickness measurements ?

I'm probably remembering the same post in this thread that you're referencing; but in that post, to my recollection, it was related that Stax stated the L700 membrane to be between 009 and 007 specs, in both thickness and tension.

My memory plays tricks sometimes, please let me know if someone digs up that post and my recollection is wrong.

*edit* Haha sorry Frank, you stated that at the end of your post, and I missed it.

 

[AudioBear]

I remember it that way too....

 

[luvmusik]

@AudioBear
@Pahani

Hi guys,
Yes, we're all saying the same thing in our posts.

Keith, saw your edit to post; I alluded to the 3 models' relative thicknesses midway, and then wrote it out toward the end, but possibly it wasn't clearly written by me.

Glad to see you on the thread here, and we are enjoying & immersed in Lambda-Land with our L700's !

I have not done the simple reversible "seal" mod yet we discussed before, because I hardly have even a chance for free time right now. But, it seems very easy & one of us should try it without expectations, just to see what happens. No harm done either as it's reversible in minutes, but it may sound much worse, who knows ?, until we try. Enjoying them stock until more time in the far future allows ! Will look back at which materials we thought may apply, but I can't get to it for a long while.

Stax seemingly designed them slightly lossy maybe in a porting-type venture, but I don't know if anyone has sealed them up completely in the main Stax thread on Head-Fi. Other sites have not done it yet. A very fine fellow & deep-Stax guy yaluen posted the best talk about the gap in another place & he is here too on this site/thread.

I sorta think Stax did try it in development before issuing it to market. Surely it won't take long for some to say the seal would wreck the sound. We just don't know anyone who's tried it yet, unless buried somewhere in the main Stax thread, which is hard to keep up with, it's so long & busy. Plus, many like the porting mod on 007 the best of all for 007 sound, so L700 stock may leak a tiny bit purposefully. And, recall you have a different Stax model that has the straw-mod too, maybe a similar idea to stock L700 sorta. Anyway, it's just an experiment to see what happens & then go back to stock or not.